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Author Topic: E flat  (Read 6144 times)

richard

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Re: E flat
« Reply #15 on: December 24, 2011, 12:20:01 PM »
I joined a band who insisted on playing SOME numbers in E flat. I detuned my back up guitar (Gibson SG) and absolutely hated the way it sounded. Can't really explain why but it was bad enough for me to quit the band.
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she.cries.wolf

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Re: E flat
« Reply #16 on: December 24, 2011, 01:22:57 PM »
I actually think it originated from when guitar players were playing with other instrumentalists as Concert Pitch is Eb, as well as you have some Brass instruments playing Bb. So I think it just made it easier on all the instrumentalists. Take Metallica for instance, they play in E Standard, but the Live S&M concert they played in Eb

plastercaster

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Re: E flat
« Reply #17 on: December 24, 2011, 03:41:28 PM »
"E flat, the unloved ginger stepchild of the guitar chords"
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Sancho

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Re: E flat
« Reply #18 on: December 24, 2011, 03:54:11 PM »
I joined a band who insisted on playing SOME numbers in E flat. I detuned my back up guitar (Gibson SG) and absolutely hated the way it sounded. Can't really explain why but it was bad enough for me to quit the band.
At first I hated it as well. It took me a while to get used to it. Now it doesn't make any difference to me, soundwise.
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gordiji

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Re: E flat
« Reply #19 on: December 24, 2011, 08:38:42 PM »
don't want to appear an arse but concert pitch for pretty much the last century is A 440ish hz.this means your bottom
string (6 strings) is E not E flat. different reference pitches are more common before 20th century.
if your guitar sounds bad in e flat  it's because your strings are too loose not because of the pitch.i.e a playability thing.it would be like saying i like an F chord but not F sharp, the quality of the chord is the same.obviously an open E (or Eflat) may sound better than F (or Fsharp) but thats because of the open strings which resonate truer than fingered.
the pitch is pretty irrelevent to the quality of the sound but very relevent if you want to use fat strings and retain playability.
 

dave_mc

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Re: E flat
« Reply #20 on: December 24, 2011, 08:49:23 PM »
i normally stick to e

i keep a guitar or two in e flat so i can play along with songs which are in e flat, but that's about it

i guess if i were in a band and teh singer needed it to be tuned down to e flat i'd do that- but i prefer e if given the free choice, i think.

Sancho

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Re: E flat
« Reply #21 on: December 24, 2011, 08:59:53 PM »
don't want to appear an arse but concert pitch for pretty much the last century is A 440ish hz.this means your bottom
string (6 strings) is E not E flat.
Tuning a half step doesn't mean your guitar isn't in A440...
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Re: E flat
« Reply #22 on: December 24, 2011, 10:36:14 PM »
I actually think it originated from when guitar players were playing with other instrumentalists as Concert Pitch is Eb, as well as you have some Brass instruments playing Bb. So I think it just made it easier on all the instrumentalists. Take Metallica for instance, they play in E Standard, but the Live S&M concert they played in Eb

A good point but not accurate.

Metallica had been playing in Eb since 95 as hetfield shot his voice and couldnt reach the notes correctly in standard.

This can be seen on death magnetic you can hear him straining on the final version but on the demos that are in Eb he doesnt strain at all. However Rick Rubin wanted to have him straining to hit the notes as it made  him sound "vulnerable" :S

Miek

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Re: E flat
« Reply #23 on: December 25, 2011, 08:22:59 AM »
But no one makes any 10-56 or 10-60 sets for 6 strings.

I think GHS did a Zakk Wylde Boomer Set that was 10-60 and another that was 10-70
You are right actually, I had forgotten about those. Been meaning to give them a shot...

Sifu Ben

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Re: E flat
« Reply #24 on: December 25, 2011, 12:23:07 PM »
Quote
as hetfield shot his voice and couldnt reach the notes correctly in standard.
Should point out that your voice naturally deepens with age anyway.
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HTH AMPS

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Re: E flat
« Reply #25 on: December 26, 2011, 12:06:09 AM »
I've played in Eb for ages now, its a bit easier on the old digits if you gig regular (and have arthritis).  It was to make top notes easier for our singer at first, but it worked out cool with me too.  The tension on the low strings isn't quite what I've like, so will have to play with gauges at some point (playing 11s on Gibsons).

she.cries.wolf

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Re: E flat
« Reply #26 on: December 27, 2011, 12:52:01 PM »
But no one makes any 10-56 or 10-60 sets for 6 strings.

I think GHS did a Zakk Wylde Boomer Set that was 10-60 and another that was 10-70
You are right actually, I had forgotten about those. Been meaning to give them a shot...

DR Strings actually make them Gauges. I use 10-56 DR Jeff Healy sig set :)

FELINEGUITARS

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Re: E flat
« Reply #27 on: December 27, 2011, 11:42:32 PM »
As you go up in gauge of string I find that you get less harmonic overtones and more of the fundamental note.
That is why blues players seem to love fat strings and why it suits stoner rock etc

Skinnier strings tend to get a higher amount of higher harmonics in the sound  and this seems to give them more sizzle and maybe accounted for a little of that wasp in a jam-jar tone that some of the 80s waddlers using .007 and .008 gauge strings along with their choice of pedals amps and settings.

Eb tuning was almost the staple tuning of half the rock and metal bands in the 70s and 80s it seemed
It was also the reason that 99% of music notation, chord songbooks and some early tab books (prior to about 1986) were all wrong and even the artist who played the tune in the first place wouldn't be able to play the song from the songbook

On that note I found this
http://youtu.be/-KR7txrLvuY
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Miek

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Re: E flat
« Reply #28 on: December 28, 2011, 08:45:19 AM »
But no one makes any 10-56 or 10-60 sets for 6 strings.

I think GHS did a Zakk Wylde Boomer Set that was 10-60 and another that was 10-70
You are right actually, I had forgotten about those. Been meaning to give them a shot...
Found a set of DR 10-60s since I hate GHS, I'm looking forward to it. I'll even be trying that 70 in E standard as soon as I get rocksmith.

Andrew W

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Re: E flat
« Reply #29 on: December 28, 2011, 01:49:19 PM »
As you go up in gauge of string I find that you get less harmonic overtones and more of the fundamental note.
That is why blues players seem to love fat strings and why it suits stoner rock etc

Skinnier strings tend to get a higher amount of higher harmonics in the sound  and this seems to give them more sizzle and maybe accounted for a little of that wasp in a jam-jar tone that some of the 80s waddlers using .007 and .008 gauge strings along with their choice of pedals amps and settings.

Eb tuning was almost the staple tuning of half the rock and metal bands in the 70s and 80s it seemed
It was also the reason that 99% of music notation, chord songbooks and some early tab books (prior to about 1986) were all wrong and even the artist who played the tune in the first place wouldn't be able to play the song from the songbook

On that note I found this
http://youtu.be/-KR7txrLvuY

That makes a lot of sense. I always felt that a set of 11s sounded more focused and direct which would seem to be the case if it's exhibiting fewer overtones as you say. Really appreciate that Jonathan it clears a lot up for me.

Also that is one of my favourite sketches of all time and I can never see it enough so thanks for the reminder of that too.