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Author Topic: BKP Juggernauts ?  (Read 40108 times)

darthphineas

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #30 on: September 22, 2013, 12:38:46 AM »
I think that's how all the clips were done back in the old days with a JCM800 I believe.
, I don't see where it matters  if it's a real amp or a sim.

The fact that modellers react extremely differently to the actual amps they're modelling.

I do believe my comment was " as long as there is a baseline for comparison, I don't see where it matters  if it's a real amp or a sim."

not quite the same as how it was made to look in how you used it in your quote. *wags finger* 

and, provided all things are equal, it wouldn't matter what type of amp or amp sim was being used.

the end goal I am referring to would be to get an idea of how one pickup model sounds next to another one.  playing one model through a Plexi in a alder Charvel and one model through a dual rec in a LP Standard and another model through a sim/iPad using a basswood Ibby doesn't really give the listener a true idea of how the pickups relate on to another.  playing them all in the same guitar through a Plexi would.  or through a dual rec.  or a amp sim.  the listener doesn't need to know if it's a tube amp or what brand of tube or if it's a SS amp or if it's not an amp at all... any more than if it's going through a Mackie or a Neve or a DAW... just that it's an apples-to-apples comparison of one pickup to another.  and THAT is my only point.   :)

Dave Sloven

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #31 on: September 22, 2013, 05:05:39 AM »
I totally agree.  Same guitar, same amp, variety of pickups to compare.  That's the only way to compare apples for apples.  However, it is also important to know how the pickups might react in your guitar. A guitar with vastly different wood and construction - or even hardware - might react to different pickups in different ways, so that the two pickups seem more 'alike' in one guitar than in another.  Same with amps.

Even with the BKP clips I find it hard to tell how a pickup will sound in my setup.  I can only compare them and go with the one with less mids than the other one, or more highs, or more smooth versus aggressive, juicy versus dry, etc.
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bulb

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #32 on: September 22, 2013, 09:24:04 AM »
Thanks for clearing all that up Nolls!

And just to echo all of his sentiments, I was aiming a bit bigger than "LETZ MAEK ULTRIMAT DJENT PICKUP" when Tim and I were discussing the sig pickup.
I saw this as an opportunity to explore some new ground, and so did Tim.  Long story short, he told me to come up with a wishlist, and we followed that.
In the end I think we ended up with a set that surpassed my expectations in that it excelled in categories I hadn't even initially considered.
For example, these sound absolutely fantastic on cleans, even on the bridge, and they are always very full sounding which is very pleasing.
I have always been of the mindset that the whole "Djent" tone is more of a picking thing combined with how you have your amp set.

Also to be noted, that video of me testing the Jamup app just happens to be one of the many things I have put together over the last year with a guitar that has a Juggernaut set in it, but the pickups are not the star of the show in that video, but the relatively inexpensive iOS app is.
Proper demos in several styles will be out soon, but ultimately one of my favorite things about this pickup is the feel and dynamics.  I love to dig in and pick hard, and this is a very rewarding pickup in that sense, so I am very excited for people who play all styles to give it a whirl as I think you will be very happy with the results, even if you don't play heavier music!

I hope this gives everything some perspective!

Toe-Knee

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #33 on: September 22, 2013, 11:32:24 AM »
I think that's how all the clips were done back in the old days with a JCM800 I believe.
, I don't see where it matters  if it's a real amp or a sim.

The fact that modellers react extremely differently to the actual amps they're modelling.

I do believe my comment was " as long as there is a baseline for comparison, I don't see where it matters  if it's a real amp or a sim."

not quite the same as how it was made to look in how you used it in your quote. *wags finger* 

and, provided all things are equal, it wouldn't matter what type of amp or amp sim was being used.

the end goal I am referring to would be to get an idea of how one pickup model sounds next to another one.  playing one model through a Plexi in a alder Charvel and one model through a dual rec in a LP Standard and another model through a sim/iPad using a basswood Ibby doesn't really give the listener a true idea of how the pickups relate on to another.  playing them all in the same guitar through a Plexi would.  or through a dual rec.  or a amp sim.  the listener doesn't need to know if it's a tube amp or what brand of tube or if it's a SS amp or if it's not an amp at all... any more than if it's going through a Mackie or a Neve or a DAW... just that it's an apples-to-apples comparison of one pickup to another.  and THAT is my only point.   :)

whoops. Sorry about that I misread after just glancing across most of the posts. My bad.
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Toe-Knee

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #34 on: September 22, 2013, 12:11:29 PM »
Also just incase anyone missed it theres a official product page now

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/pickups.php?cat=humbuckers&sub=contemporary&pickup=juggernaut
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PhilKing

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #35 on: September 22, 2013, 12:14:50 PM »
They look to have a new baseplate for these (unless it's for 7-string pickups in general).  The lugs are more EMG shaped.
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Toe-Knee

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #36 on: September 22, 2013, 12:25:28 PM »
They look to have a new baseplate for these (unless it's for 7-string pickups in general).  The lugs are more EMG shaped.

I think they're just shaped for direct mounting rather than pickup rings but should work either way
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Slartibartfarst42

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #37 on: September 22, 2013, 12:40:12 PM »
The official clips do sound better and more impressive than the video at the start of this thread but 'versatile' still isn't a word that leaps to mind when I listen to them. They just seem too tight and aggressive for anything much other than Metal but the idea of combining ceramic and alnico magnets is genius. I've often wondered if that could be done  8)
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Toe-Knee

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #38 on: September 22, 2013, 12:54:08 PM »
The official clips do sound better and more impressive than the video at the start of this thread but 'versatile' still isn't a word that leaps to mind when I listen to them. They just seem too tight and aggressive for anything much other than Metal but the idea of combining ceramic and alnico magnets is genius. I've often wondered if that could be done  8)

regarding the mag combinations its been done before a few times.

I'm still a bit sceptical but just got a credit of Ģ130 on the closure of the bt account at my old address and it's burning a hole in my pocket.
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Dave Sloven

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #39 on: September 22, 2013, 01:09:06 PM »
I'll say this about them: the 'modern metal' clip sounds very different from the other BKP clips I've listened to, and that's not a bad thing.  The djenty one sounds not bad either as soon as the djenting is left behind and the leads start - are those done with the new neck pickup?  If so I quite like it.
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Kiichi

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #40 on: September 22, 2013, 02:21:16 PM »
Big thanks to Nolly and Misha for chiming in! =)


I like the sound of those babys. I feel you can really hear the alnico in the bridge. Plus the neck sounds really really nice.
Would love to hear more of these, especially non djent stuff (I know it does that, now I wanne know what else it does and how). Right now I am very intrigued cause I feel these really could be for me (when it comes to metal at least).

I think I would love to try these for a downtuned metal axe I think, might just add what I felt the AM was lacking for me.



Could you perhaps shed some light on how these compare to the AM tonewise? Both bridge and neck. Seems like a logical point of comparison.
« Last Edit: September 22, 2013, 02:22:52 PM by Kiichi »
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Studiostriver

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #41 on: September 22, 2013, 03:52:21 PM »
I know listened the clips from official BKP Juggernaut page.

Something i like,something i do not like ...

For rhythm I think they sound much better than Aftermath.When doing pulm mute riffing at modern metal clips it sounds ubber cool I must say.Thightness is good,and bass responce also.
But when playing open riff on intro it somehow do not attack enough,sound mellow and less agressive than Miracle Man or Nailbomb...That is think despite the fact pickup do not have presence in high notes at all...That is thing I do not like...

Same thing with neck pickup,has a really unique sound without a doubt but very high end closed.But balanced at the same time.The second thing I do not like is how pickup react with tremolo picking at higher notes,somehow sharp noisy clicking..Playing some busy alternate phrases neclassical style would be very messy in my opinion..

So + and - are in this pickup...I think that it is not versatile for anything that is not modern metal...

But I hope I`m wrong. If you have a time please post any new clips with standard ordinary metal riffings and solos please...

In ordering section I can not see Juggernaut 7 String version yet,are there gonna be 7/8 options too?

« Last Edit: September 22, 2013, 04:17:13 PM by Studiostriver »

bulb

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #42 on: September 22, 2013, 05:35:57 PM »
Big thanks to Nolly and Misha for chiming in! =)


I like the sound of those babys. I feel you can really hear the alnico in the bridge. Plus the neck sounds really really nice.
Would love to hear more of these, especially non djent stuff (I know it does that, now I wanne know what else it does and how). Right now I am very intrigued cause I feel these really could be for me (when it comes to metal at least).

I think I would love to try these for a downtuned metal axe I think, might just add what I felt the AM was lacking for me.



Could you perhaps shed some light on how these compare to the AM tonewise? Both bridge and neck. Seems like a logical point of comparison.

Here is something I wrote up to try to describe the sound and feel of the pickups with words haha:
In short, I went to Tim asking him to make me a hybrid pickup that would capture the best aspects of Ceramic and Alnico pickups but without the downsides. Ceramic tends to be harsh and compressed, Alnico doesn't have the attack or tightness that I need.

Tim and I actually designed these pickups not around being "djenty" (because apart from being rather limiting as a sound, most of that comes from your picking technique and how you set your amp) but focused more on fixing the small qualms I had with the Aftermath and Black Hawk. These are much more dynamic, and smoother in the top end so that leads/high notes don't sound shrill or ice-picky, and we managed to shift the low end focus from bass to low mids which means they are hitting frequencies which are a lot more relevant to the guitar and the pickup sounds fatter for it. All of this whilst having that signature "open" top end clarity that I have come to associate with BKP pickups as well as the ability to have distorted chords ring out evenly and clearly without the lower notes taking over.

A huge bonus that was kind of unexpected is how phenomenal these pickups sound on cleans (even the bridge) and mid gain tones as a result of the added dynamics, sweetness and fatness.

Now since it is my pickup, Tim's challenge was to work those qualities into the pickup in a way that would still allow me to completely get the tightness and angry attack I get from the Aftermath (especially if you pick hard) and the purr of an Alnico Blackhawk without relying on the compressed nature of that pickup. As a result, you can effectively use your right hand/strength of your picking as a gain control!

For the neck pickup voicing, I have always thought that the VHII was the most perfect neck pickup, but unfortunately it is not output/eq matched to the AM/BH set, so we spent some time designing a pickup that had all the positive characteristics of the VHII but that matched the output level and general eq of the Juggernaut bridge so that they would sound like part of the same set!

Arthurus

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Re: BKP Juggernauts ?
« Reply #43 on: September 22, 2013, 05:48:06 PM »
Man I love the VH-II. I wanted a pickup which was more aggressive and more powerful on the bridge position, but I knew it wouldn't go well with the VH-II.

As soon as I get my salary, I'll order these. Dayum, I can't wait !

By the way, I will make a Holydiver+VH-II/Juggernaut comparison clip, so you guys will hear what it's all about (since lots of you have the Holydiver). Cheers Nolly and Misha !
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Kiichi

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Juggernaut
« Reply #44 on: September 22, 2013, 06:28:04 PM »
Again, thanks a lot Misha, that was very informative!

Really sounds amazing. The idea and process behind this PU really speaks to me. While I donīt play djent we still seem to have the same qualms with the AM and BH and if this PU is what you make it out to be it could be just what I want for my future drop A# axe.

Now what I (and I assume quite some other people) would like to have are more clips of this PU doing more classic metal styles, see how it does with, say Hair Metal, Thrash and heavy metal.
Also some more midgain stuff so I can actually make out the mid character under distortion more, cause the current clips are too high gain for me to get a good idea of that.
Just a crunch clip would be great.

Actually that goes for most PUs, but here especially since you talk about mid gain stuff being good and that gets me interested, but there are only clean and high gain clips.
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