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Author Topic: Just like to clear something up here + Amp advice.  (Read 17449 times)

Crazy_Joe

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Just like to clear something up here + Amp advice.
« on: August 20, 2006, 03:56:26 PM »
What is the thrash/speed pickup??

I always thought it was the Nailbomb, but recently i saw someone say Miracle Man was the thrash pickup.
I'm getting an Ibanez RG1570 (yes i am actually buying a guitar this week!! :o ) and i need a thrash sound.

I'm thinking of a combo of: Nailbomb - Irish Tour - Cold Sweat
Maybe a Trilogy in the middle, maybe a Miracle Man in bridge, but Cold Sweat is definate.

Next Issue

I will buy a 50 (or higher) watt combo amp shortly after this purchase, what will give me a good thrash tone? I know i will have to probably use a pedal of some sort, i was looking at a Marshall AVT series, maybe buying the Zakk overdrive and figured that would be a good thrashy tone, but thats definatley not confirmed.
I've heard people rubbishing the AVT series, though some people say they were surprised by them and they arn't half bad.
Other options is the dredded Line 6 Spider II :o  A lot of people don't like those but they have so many amp modelley thingys that i'm bound to find one or two good tones.
I have a Line 6 Uber metal pedal already, so that might serve me well if i get a Marshall.

Discuss!
Black Dogs

Previous BKP's: Riff Raff, Holy Divers, Painkillers, C. Warpig, Nailbomb, Miracle Man.

CaffeineJunkie

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« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2006, 04:32:00 PM »
i have the AVT and it's k, but it still is essentially solid state
the AVT i found was fine as a basic bedroom practise amp, but as soon as you try and crank it, it starts gettin buzzy when distorted, which is why i'm going to sell mine as soon as i get enough money for my plexi head

as for the pickups, wouldn't know, don't play thrash, sorry
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Crazy_Joe

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« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2006, 04:41:14 PM »
What if i'm using a noise gate with it, surely then it wouldn't be buzzy.
Black Dogs

Previous BKP's: Riff Raff, Holy Divers, Painkillers, C. Warpig, Nailbomb, Miracle Man.

CaffeineJunkie

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« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2006, 04:42:46 PM »
possibly, but it would depend on where you put it, as its primarily to do with the number of effects built into the circuit ... hence me wanting a plexi, very basic amp = very nice tone
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gingataff

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« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2006, 04:45:01 PM »
With my nailbomb I can happily get most tones from hard rock through to speed, thrash and death metal. It depends a lot on your amp/pedals and tone settings. A miracle man would obviously be good as well, but with more bass and lower mid than the nailbombs upper mid crunch. I'd probably say a nailbomb for 80s tones (but better!) and miracle man for 90s tones.
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Sifu Ben

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« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2006, 04:55:19 PM »
The ZW overdrive is pretty useless for thrash. It's a very traditionally voiced overdrive pedal, which Zakk uses to give a clean gain boost for solos. You will need a DISTORTION pedal, such as a metal master, metal zone, or the Krank Distortus Maximus.
 As for pickups, anything from the Cold Sweat up should be capable of producing useable thrash tones.
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FELINEGUITARS

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« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2006, 05:24:32 PM »
Depends upon what you call Thrash Metal

Back in 1985 when the genre emerged bands such as Anthrax and Metallica etc were called Thrash.

Two decades on opinions on that subject may have moved on somewhat

Really the whole picture is important - the guitar , the pickups, pedals and amp and what you consider to be a desirable tone for "thrash"

Chances are you will go for a Miracle Man, Nailbomb or Warpig

Maybe a bit cliched, but you might say:

For mid-late 80s Speed/Thrash go for a MM
For 1990s stuff maybe the NB as it has more "beefiness" and the WP if you like a more "Doomy" kind of sound

But it is all personal taste.......
If money were no issue......get one of each and experiment
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Brow

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« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2006, 05:25:48 PM »
Now, I'm in no way a metal guitarist but I've never heard anyone get what I would call a convincing metal tone out of a purely clean amp and then use a pedal for distortion. Always sound too fake or have no balls to it etc.

In my opinion it's always better to get an amp that will provide the gain/basic tone you want (Dual Rec, Peavey 5150, Peavey xxx just as examples) and then accenuate it with an OD pedal or a boost.

I may be talking out of my arse but that's how I'd do it :)
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_tom_

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« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2006, 06:32:57 PM »
To get a decent high gain sound out of pedals I've found its best to layer two. For my high gain sounds I use a Keeley Rat infront of a Behringer TO800 to get some huge tones :D Then again I have my amp set so its breaking up so its not going into a completely clean amp.

screamingdaisy

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« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2006, 06:45:04 PM »
I find thrash (I assume we're talking rhythm) works best with bright medium output pickups.  Bottom heavy pickups tend to tub out when you're pounding on the low E and extremely high output pickups then to compress too much.

Alot of your pickup selection has to do with your amp choice.  Obviously, a Dual Rectifier is going to give you a different sound than a JCM800.....and you may wish to choose your pickup accordingly.

FWIW.....you'll find that alot of thrash players don't use passives for a reason.


Quote from: Crazy_Joe
What if i'm using a noise gate with it, surely then it wouldn't be buzzy.


Solid states sound good at lower volumes, but get worse as you turn them up.  That said, they're capable of some very tight rhythm tones (see, Pantera) provided you like they sound they have.
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Crazy_Joe

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« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2006, 07:09:13 PM »
I'm not looking to spend that much on this amp, but by the sounds of it i'm going to need a good one if i want a good tone when cranked up.

I play a shite load of Metallica. Also Ozzy, Mercyful Fate, Slayer, Annihilator etc. stuff, i'm a very 80's player, though i do play a bit on the heavier/modern side of things, e.g. Trivium (purely for the guitars riffs), Kalmah, Ensiferum etc.
I was thinking Nailbomb because i'm getting an Ibanez, and a lot of people are happy with their Nailbomb loaded Ibanez axes.

However the band and me are starting to play our own material. the tone of both guitar's are indecisive since i have different equiptment to the other guitarist and we don't know what kind of tone we are going for yet. I'd say our songs so far are trying to be thrash/speed metal, though i'm not sure if it is exactly that yet, but we don't want to sound metalcore or something shitety like that.

A few months ago i wanted an Ashdown Fallen Angel 40 watt combo, but it was very pricey compared to what i wanted to spend. But maybe it looks like i will need an amp like that to get the gain i'm looking for.

I'm a bit confused as to what people are saying here, are you saying i need a tube amp, because it sounds as if all solid state amps are getting bashed here because they don't sound good cranked up, or do i just need a good solid state which sounds good loud, if there is such a thing :P

Also at the moment i play on the clean channel of my Marshall MG, and then use the Uber Metal pedal for the whole distortion.
Is this good or bad, and would it be better to go on the overdrive channel instead.

Sorry for the essay!
Black Dogs

Previous BKP's: Riff Raff, Holy Divers, Painkillers, C. Warpig, Nailbomb, Miracle Man.

Bainzy

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« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2006, 07:17:39 PM »
Quote from: CaffeineJunkie
i'm going to sell mine as soon as i get enough money for my plexi head


You're getting a Plexi? Sweet as - let me know if you want any advice buying it or working on it when you come round to buying it.

CaffeineJunkie

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« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2006, 07:18:06 PM »
i'd say get a valve amp if you can, something along the lines of a second hand JCM800 or a Laney if you can find one on ebay or summat

also, i've heard that the Nailbomb is very versatile, and would probably handle anything you throw at it, so that just means that you would need the right amp to get 'your' sound

best thing to do is to find a good guitar shop with a lot of amps in and try them out, then find a cheaper second hand version
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CaffeineJunkie

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« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2006, 07:18:44 PM »
Quote from: Bainzy
Quote from: CaffeineJunkie
i'm going to sell mine as soon as i get enough money for my plexi head


You're getting a Plexi? Sweet as - let me know if you want any advice buying it or working on it when you come round to buying it.


will do, i'm not goin as big as your SLP tho, i'm gettin the 50 watt little brother :D
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Crazy_Joe

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« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2006, 07:49:08 PM »
There is a used Laney TF400 in my local guitar shop, don't know if that is tube though. Anyone know?

Also the kind of tone i want is in this video:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=bj5CKxPuy8A&search=You%20Can%27t%20Bring%20Me%20Down

Also does anyone know what chorus effect the guitarist uses, or how to get that kind of chorus sound, it is fecking awesome!
Black Dogs

Previous BKP's: Riff Raff, Holy Divers, Painkillers, C. Warpig, Nailbomb, Miracle Man.