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At The Back => The Dressing Room => Topic started by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 02:19:04 PM

Title: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 02:19:04 PM
As the title suggests that's the position I find myself in. We had a communication last week and it resulted in me getting a letter that stated the above. Basically the role I am in has been re-written and the company wants to make sure that anyone doing that role can deliver what is expected after the changes take effect. This will be done via an assessment day - 14th March for me.

I know other people on the forum have been through redundancy before but I'm not sure if anyone has been through an assessment day. Basically we'll be put in a number of situations such as a team brief, a 1:1 and a group exercise and have our performance monitored by independent assessors. If anyone has been through something like this what did you find the best way of prepping yourself was/would have been in hindsight?

It's never a great time to get something like this but for me this is probably the worst possible time! Perhaps I am lucky that this is my first ever experience of this after 17 years of service with the same employer. The potential silver lining to this cloud is that I am currently loaned out to our IT team and there is a chance that this could turn into a permanent move for me (fingers crossed etc).

Feeling a little numb about it really so any words of advice would be greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Twinfan on March 06, 2011, 02:52:22 PM
Gutted to hear that Ian - terrible stuff  :(

I've not been through the process you describe so can't help I'm afraid, but wanted to wish you the best of luck with the assessment.  Go get 'em!
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: shobet on March 06, 2011, 03:20:00 PM
Pisser, I hope the move to IT comes off.

Remember not to say $%&# or bugger in the interview.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Matt77 on March 06, 2011, 03:37:30 PM
Bugger
I know a man that may be able to help.
PM on the way
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Nadz1lla on March 06, 2011, 04:10:20 PM
First of all, you need a bottle of X-Lax. Then you need to go make tea for your "co-assessment-ees".

Job's a good 'un!


On a more serious note, harsh news, but good luck, mate. Nothing worse than being pitted against your work-mates in a fight to the redundancy for a position.  :? I hope all goes well for you.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ratrod on March 06, 2011, 05:28:24 PM
Am I alone in thinking assessment tests are wrong?

I don't think it's the right way of judging an employee.

Best of luck to you anyway.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 05:47:38 PM
Cheers all - the strange thing about this exercise is that I won't be in direct competition with anyone as there is no reduction in headcount. Effectively it's a case of "we've changed the job role and we need you to show that you can deal with it". Having been in a management position for the last 10 years seems to count for not much as past performance is not included in how I will be assessed.

Matt - cheers for the PM. Will be in touch.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Philly Q on March 06, 2011, 05:56:13 PM
Sorry to hear this, Ian.  I've never been in a similar position, so I can't offer advice (in my job I'm so much part of the furniture, even if there was a redundancy programme I think they'd forget I was there).  But I hope it works out!
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 05:59:55 PM
Am I alone in thinking assessment tests are wrong?

I don't think it's the right way of judging an employee.

Best of luck to you anyway.

I don't think you're alone at all. I think things like this would be far better done through active management on the job rather than a false situation outside of work. Takes time to do proper and consistent performance management though.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 06:04:13 PM
Sorry to hear this, Ian.  I've never been in a similar position, so I can't offer advice (in my job I'm so much part of the furniture, even if there was a redundancy programme I think they'd forget I was there).  But I hope it works out!

What do you do Philly? I'm not sure I've ever picked up on this whilst on the forum.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Philly Q on March 06, 2011, 06:09:40 PM
Sorry to hear this, Ian.  I've never been in a similar position, so I can't offer advice (in my job I'm so much part of the furniture, even if there was a redundancy programme I think they'd forget I was there).  But I hope it works out!

What do you do Philly? I'm not sure I've ever picked up on this whilst on the forum.

Hmmm, I avoid the subject because it is the least "cool" job ever in the world in space. 

And it's one of those careers people think is highly paid.... but (for the vast majority) it really isn't.


[cough] accountancy [/cough]
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 06:17:34 PM
Surely an actuarial job is less cool than that (apologies if we have any actuaries on here).

As far as highly paid goes I'm paid fairly well although doubt I will be able to earn much more without sacrificing part of my home life. And I'm not willing to do that, provided I have a job in a few weeks.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Philly Q on March 06, 2011, 06:21:07 PM
Surely an actuarial job is less cool than that (apologies if we have any actuaries on here).

You're probably right!  That would've been an option with my degree (in Statistics) - and it would be a lot better paid - but I really think it would've bored me to death.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 06:31:44 PM
You're probably right. The work I am doing on IT at the moment involves working with our actuarial teams. I really couldn't be that motivated to work within that discipline.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: 38thBeatle on March 06, 2011, 07:33:44 PM
Whatever happens, all the best Ian. Worrying times but keep your head and I am sure it will work out for you.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 07:37:42 PM
Cheers mate. The one good thing, if I do go, is that the redundancy terms are pretty good. With my service and age I would get 42.5 weeks salary. It's just finding another job, at a similar salary, that worries me.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Matt77 on March 06, 2011, 08:20:24 PM
My friend is an actuary
I've known him since I was 4 years old.
He has set his retirement date for 6 years time
We are both 34.  :(
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Transcend on March 06, 2011, 08:24:17 PM
the only thing you really need to do is be confident in your job and show this in these assessments.

I am also at risk of redundancy but no notices have been handed out yet but there are 30-50 expected in the first half of this year and more to follow q1 2012
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: _tom_ on March 06, 2011, 08:44:23 PM
Sorry to hear that Ian :( Unfortunately I don't have any useful advice as I'm finding it hard enough to get myself a job in the first place, even with some experience and a First Class degree in the area I want to go into.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 06, 2011, 08:47:49 PM
My friend is an actuary
I've known him since I was 4 years old.
He has set his retirement date for 6 years time
We are both 34.  :(

 :(

At a recent event I met a guy who I had not seen since my first day. We joined the company together and lost contact after about a month. Turns out he is now a director in one of the actuarial departments. There are only a handful of people at his level and only one layer between him and the CEO. He is the same age as me.  :(

He does work very long hours though.  :)
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: FernandoDuarte on March 07, 2011, 11:39:37 PM
Sorry to hear it Ian, hope you kick some ass there and people get surprised with you! Do your best, with your best confidence... Confidence counts a LOT!!!
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: James C on March 08, 2011, 07:45:49 AM
Best of luck Ian!

Off topic(ish):  Actuarys do have the chance to earn big money, I left 6th form and have worked in Pensions Admin for 5 years and earn a good-ish wage, My GF started as a trainee actuary in september and by the end of this year will be on 10k a year more than my wage :-(. but she does spend all of her free time studying or working.



Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 11, 2011, 10:21:00 PM
Well, just a quick update on this. And it's good news for me. The director of the IT department and my old director agreed yesterday to transfer me permanently into IT and remove me from the assessment centre on Monday.

Such good news, a massive weight off of my mind and now free to enjoy a stress/worry free weekend.

Thanks all for the messages of support, much appreciated and further proof as to why this is the greatest forum going.

Matt - cheers for taking time to PM me. I had planned to respond to you earlier this week but got an inkling that something was happening behind the scenes.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Twinfan on March 11, 2011, 10:24:53 PM
SUperb news Ian - made up for you  :D

Have a fantastic weekend - chill out and relax!
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: 38thBeatle on March 11, 2011, 10:29:41 PM
Nice one-I am really pleased it has resolved itself.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Philly Q on March 11, 2011, 11:10:12 PM
Great news Ian!  :D
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: FernandoDuarte on March 11, 2011, 11:25:43 PM
:D Great news!
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Afghan Dave on March 12, 2011, 02:26:10 AM
Excellent news.   :)

I cannot believe that such disgusting employment practices such as "assessment centre" evaluations after such long service are allowed to exist.

As most of you know, I probably sit "right of centre" in my politics but I am a firm believer that the absence of a contemporary evolved trade union movement has distorted the workplace just as badly as "work to rule" and "flying pickets" ever did.

 :x :x :x 
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: 38thBeatle on March 12, 2011, 08:12:30 AM
I agree Dave.
I was talking to a colleague a few days ago in another  office of the company I work for. He is being made redundant as they have decided that the job he does, along with one other ( and she gets paid less than he does) is now a job for one person. So they made him redundant after an "assessment hearing" and he leaves in 3 months.... they asked him to stay a while because there is so much on at the moment. I don't know the full circumstances but that sounds a little bizarre- there is apparently not enough work for two and yet he has to stay on to clear it. Maybe a backlog but I have close contact with them and would be affected by any backlog and have seen no evidence. He's 37 with a mortgage and 2 kids.
I nearly lost my job 3 years ago and the "package" being offered was statutory minimum- no exceptions ( not just to me but to all those who actually did lose their jobs). This was after 10 years of early mornings, late nights, rare lunch breaks, taking work home etc etc.  Scum bags- I only stayed after I decided I would get what I can out of them but my plan isn't working particularly well I must admit.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: AndyR on March 12, 2011, 09:58:18 AM
Sorry I missed this, but nice one how it's worked out Ian :D

And I tend to agree with Dave as well.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: shobet on March 12, 2011, 10:11:48 AM
Congrats. Ian, must be a weight off your mind.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Matt77 on March 12, 2011, 08:35:53 PM
That's good news.
I'm certain assessment centres are not the best approach.
The evidence from an interview or assessment is never as accurate as on the job performance. Thing is, most of the time on the job performance isn't recorded consistently enough to stop people claiming unfair selection for redundancy if it is used as the selection criteria. On face value an assessment centre is consistent and therefore legally much safer for an employer looking to reduce the numbers.

I've been lucky and managed to make things work for me. I've wrangled redundancy with good terms a few times in the past.
Bought most of my gear!
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Transcend on March 12, 2011, 08:38:12 PM
It looks more likely that redundancy is heading my way now.

Running out of work 2 weeks into the month when usually we struggle to complete it!!

I need more people to get Ill so i have more work!!!
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Afghan Dave on March 12, 2011, 09:01:43 PM

I need more people to get Ill so i have more work!!!


I'm doing my best to spread Chlamydia if that's any good to ya...
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Transcend on March 12, 2011, 09:02:40 PM

I need more people to get Ill so i have more work!!!


I'm doing my best to spread Chlamydia if that's any good to ya...


Not really as it doesnt involve prescriptions.

Thrush would be better or cystitis!

Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 12, 2011, 09:23:16 PM
It looks more likely that redundancy is heading my way now.

Running out of work 2 weeks into the month when usually we struggle to complete it!!

I need more people to get Ill so i have more work!!!

Fingers crossed that the work picks up for you (or people are ill, but not life threatening ill!)
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: FernandoDuarte on March 12, 2011, 10:30:16 PM
Just a small relief about bad work practices...

The company I work for ( the big petroleum company in Brazil ) made the annual Satistaction Inquiry with the employeers... The result in the refinery I work was worse than last year...

Then we were told that it will decrease the money for the career progression and promotions, as it has value 3 on the table to ranking the refineries of the company... we felt from 2nd to 8th on the refineries...

Sometimes I get sick of where I work, and it's the biggest company in Brazil.... :?
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Ian Price on March 13, 2011, 06:14:23 PM
For those at risk of losing their jobs now I really hope everything works out for you. I've kind of said it above but I can't think of any other forum that would give you such genuine and compassionate responses. Such a good resource.

And I agree with the responses on assessment centres. My opinion is that job changes such as this should be sorted through performance management. Much easier for the employee to work with but, critically, much more difficult and time consuming for an employer to do consistently to ensure there is a minimum risk of tribunals etc.
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Transcend on March 13, 2011, 06:24:40 PM
aye hopefully mine will smooth out.

We've already been through a lot of cuts and i've already survived 3 rounds of redundancy so im obviously doing something right :P

So far ive lost 20% of my monthly bonus, my annual payrise was frozen as of friday which really annoyed me as its onlya  couple of weeks away...

But if i can get through this next lot thats been announced for 1st of april ill be fine.

If not i'll get a decent amount in pay outs and may actually go onto starting my own business which i've always wanted to do
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Johnny Mac on March 14, 2011, 09:39:38 PM
Glad to hear you still have a job Ian  :D
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: MrBump on March 17, 2011, 12:19:23 PM
On a related note, my wife had an interview for her pwn job yesterday - the job that she's been doing for the last 14 years, that she's now having to reapply for...

Sucks.

Particularly because she works part time, and it looks like the only thing that they will offer is a job share, which she won't be able to do because of family committments.

Sucks.

Just a reason for the local authority to streamline and get rid of all those messy part-timers.

No more purchase for Mr Bump in the near future...

:(
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: Afghan Dave on March 17, 2011, 03:01:09 PM
On a related note, my wife had an interview for her pwn job yesterday - the job that she's been doing for the last 14 years, that she's now having to reapply for...

Sucks.


That's an exotic line of work your wife's got.... and you're OK with that?  :?

I'm surprised they don't allow "a job share" as I've seen this quite often on the net... "messy part-timers" are often positively encouraged.




PDT_002

Seriously.. Sorry to hear that this cr@p is getting more common.  
Title: Re: "at risk of redundancy"
Post by: MrBump on March 17, 2011, 04:19:14 PM
Hmmm... Inapproriate cr@p typing...