Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: hamfist on November 16, 2007, 04:38:21 PM
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Ok, I've now had a week with the new beast, and had a chance to get to know it a bit.
First -Here's a link to a pic - http://www.box.net/shared/static/tahnglggnd.jpg
It's a fairly standard Jtm45 clone BUT has power-scaling and a pre-PI MV installed.
The cab is a rear-ported 2x12 with G12-65's in it, and was actually constructed at the Matamp factory (as was the head cab), where Martin is apparently going to get all of his speaker cabs made.
So, apart from the EQ controls there are actually 4 controls governing gain/volume at various points in the circuit. So, there's the volume controls for bothe the bright and the normal channels, the PPIMV and the power-scaling control (on the rear). All these are REALLY interactive and there are so many permutations and combinations that one can have. In fact, it took me a good couple of hours of tweaking to start to be able to get my head around the best way to get the tones I wanted.
I have found that as I use more and more power-scaling, I need to reduce the PPIMV. Doing it this way, mimics the tones one gets with the amp cranked.
And. yes, the PS really does enable you to get (as near as dammit) the exact same tones as one gets from the amp fully cranked, but at anywhere down to TV volumes. It's a very impressive bit of technology IMO. martin seems to have done a cracking job at installing it too. It's actually installed inside the head cab, with a computer-type fan running onto to it, to disperse the heat produced. So the PS does exactly what I hoped it would do.
The G12-65's suit the amp very well IMHO. I always like a rich, "fat", not harsh tone, and these give it in spades !
here's a few clips I did. The amp has the channels jumpered, and the volume is at about loud TV-type volume.
heavy chord riffage - http://www.box.net/shared/static/3vn5vl8xoz.mp3
mild crunch chord riffage - http://www.box.net/shared/static/zy8s59gef7.mp3
clean - http://www.box.net/shared/static/rbe9gu61zt.mp3
Personally, for my taste, the amp get's rather loose and saggy in the bass as the gain gets higher. It's not faulty, that's what all Jtm45's do. It's their "sound". I've found the way that I am liking to use it is to have the amp set on clean/slight break-up, and then add pedals for various shades of gain. The cleans are just beautiful and, let me tell you, this thing is awesome with pedals.
Here's a couple of clips (again loud TV volumes) with a Box of Rock runnin through the Jtm. I LOVE this sound !!
BoR heavy chord riffage - http://www.box.net/shared/static/x99xmmnapu.mp3
BoR mild crunch chord riffage - http://www.box.net/shared/static/6vavxu7mc7.mp3
I'd be interested to hear what you think of the clips in comparison to the amp's own tone. I posted the clips elsewhere and many folks preferred the amp's own distortion. For me I like the extra "tightness" I get from the BoR.
And may I say that Martin at Martamp can been an absolute gentleman in all my dealings with him in building this amp. And I was probably slightly more demanding than many folks would have been. Thanks mate !
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That sounds awesome, especially the Box of Rock ones!
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Nice am seriously wanting him to build me an amp when I have the cash..sorry may be dumb but what's "pre-PI MV" do
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Gorgeous sounding amp my friend! congrats.
As far as the amp vs. BoR go, i prefer the tone of the amp by itself personally. Yes, it is a lot looser, but to me it just seems more raw and has a three-dimensional quality that the BoR doesn't quite provide. The BoR sounds very nice, and I'd be more inclined to use it for higher-gain, more focussed sounds.
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the clean and mildly overdriven amp sounds are fantastic! i agree that the more heavily overdriven sound from the BOR is better. the pedal's milder crunch sound isn't as good as the amp's own, but would be a perfectly good compromise for easier sound changes. if i hadn't heard the amp's own crunch it would be great!
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in the picture, i'm guessing the knob on the lower input 2 is for the power scaling?
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He said power scaling was on the back, presumably that would be the Pre PI volume?
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those cleans are devine, although personally, i would have added a little more bass to it but of course this is just my preference. Nothing, absolutely nothing to complain about.
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How much does it cost? Their website doesnt give any prices?
There is no history on their website either. What relationship is Martamp to Matamp?
if you had an amp did they say how much the installation of the powerscaling costs?
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Perhaps I can answer those questions. :)
All the amps I make are different prices, but a typical JTM45 replica or similar would start at about £700. Power Scaling adds £130 to that.
Other amps I do include the single ended EL34 10W Goldstar which starts at £380 for a head and £450 for a 1 x 12 combo.
Power Scaling installation goes from £130-180, depending on complexity.
As to history, I'm an experienced engineer, having started my career on military aircraft, and most recently spent 10 years testing and maintaining machinery in the semiconductor industry. I've always played guitar and currently play in 2 bands.
I have a good commercial relationship with Matamp, which goes both ways, and concentrate on providing services they don't.
Hope this helps.
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do you do any other clone amps I.E. fender, mesa etc
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He said power scaling was on the back, presumably that would be the Pre PI volume?
Correct, my friend.
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do you do any other clone amps I.E. fender, mesa etc
Basically anything that there are available parts for; Marshall, Fender, Matchless, Trainwreck, even Dumble and some others. More the vintage amps rather than Mesa or Soldano though.
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..sorry may be dumb but what's "pre-PI MV" do
It's simply a master volume which can turn down the signal between the gain stages of the pre-amp (V1 and V2) and the Phase Inverter (PI). Hence its a MV which is pre-PI.
On this particular amp, the power tubes and the PI are all power-scaled. If you apply hefty power scaling, it really helps control the range of nice tones available to be able to control the strength of the pre-amp signal going into the PI and power section. This is exactly what the pre-PIMV will enable you to do.
Therefore you can dial in as much pre-amp breakup from V1 and V2 as you want (using the main bright and normal channel volumes), but then reduce the strength of that signal going into the PI and power tubes, using the pre-PIMV.
It still doesn't act like the traditional "gain" and "master volume" arrangement of a standard modern amp, because NMV amps simply don't produce their distortion that way. NMV amp's distortion is much more shared out between all the pre-amp tubes, the PI and the power tubes.
Trust me, when you're tweaking to try and get great tones at low volumes on this particular amp, it really helps.
I'm sure this explanation seems really quite complicated. It took me a good while to get my head around what it all does.
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Oh, and thanks for all your kind words about the tones !
Alan
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Nice clips Alan - how were they recorded?
As I think some of you know, I was there for the final testing of Alan's amp as I kinda know Martin from Martamp ;)
The non-BoR clips sound very much like the amp does in the room, but with a touch more treble. This may be down to the recording gear used, or the speakers may have opened up a little since I played through the rig. The G12-65s are a thicker, smoother sounding speaker and this comes through on the recording too.
The BoR clips show the character of the pedal very well. As you wind up the gain it adds more bass, and you can add more treble to balance the tone out a bit and tighten the low end. This, I think, works really well for Alan's rig and it sounds great. I prefer the raw amp tone myself, but both are very nice :)
A couple of points of interest for you all is that I played through both my JTM45 and Alan's (through Alan's cab) and they sounded identical. Same spec amp (except for the Power Scaling I don't have) and JJ ECC83s plus Shuguang KT-66s. That's consistency for you!
Also, my Marshall 2x12 with a V30/G12H combination sounded much brighter with both heads. The speakers and cab design really make a big difference. Neither was 'better' than the other, just different. I'm happy with what I have and it sounds like Alan is too. For me personally with my rig, the BoR doesn't work as it makes the bass too full/flabby (because of the G12H I think) and if I try and tighten it with the treble it sounds too cutting (the V30 and especially the G12H have a good amount of treble). Which is why I'll say........
Alan - if you get chance you should try a Blackstar HT Dual through your amp for higher gain tones. I find, and I'm sure Martin will agree, that this combination of amp/pedal sounds awesome and covers all tones from clean to crunch to searing lead for anything from country to heavy rock. Fantastic :twisted:
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Nice clips Alan - how were they recorded?
Thanks TF, they were simply recorded with a Beyer TG-X58 mike, off centre to one of the G12-65's, straight through my (top quality !!) Behringer mixer, into cubase on my computer. A hint of reverb was added in cubase. No other fiddling whatsoever in cubase. Cab volume was loud TV-type volume.
Alan - if you get chance you should try a Blackstar HT Dual through your amp for higher gain tones. I find, and I'm sure Martin will agree, that this combination of amp/pedal sounds awesome and covers all tones from clean to crunch to searing lead for anything from country to heavy rock. Fantastic :twisted:
S'funny you should say that. I've had an HT Dual for a couple of months, and I've just decided to put it on ebay. I'm really, really happy with my low and mid gain crunch sounds from the BoR (and then boosting the BoR with a Blue Boy Deluxe). I was using the HT Dual for my solo sound, and I've just decided it's not what I'm looking for. Even though I'm a Marshall junky for rhythm sounds, I think I prefer a slightly more American (dumble-ish) tone for lead work. I've been lusting (in a good christian sense :wink: ) for a Jetter Gain Stage Red for months, so I've finally taken the plunge and ordered one from the US.
So if anyone's after a mint condition HT Dual, take a look on the 'bay.
Alan
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Fair enough matey - glad you've found something that suits you!
And thanks for the recording info, top stuff!
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What a beauty!It looks fantastic..As for the clips,i prefer the amp-sound.I can hear what you're talking about the bass but,to me,the amp-sound is much better on the clips.The BoR could be useful when you're in a "heavier" mood though .. :twisted:... and is tighter in the bass,indeed. :)
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my dear god your telling me you can do a trainwreck clone with power scaling?
wow ooh dear im going weak at the knees thinking about this now.
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It's certainly possible. In fact I have a Fixed bias DC PS kit in at the moment waiting for a customer.
Call me if you're serious. Cheers. :)
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just emailed u martin, im gonna get a v6-20 the price and specs are just right for me.
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:) 8)
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just emailed u martin, im gonna get a v6-20 the price and specs are just right for me.
You won't be disappointed..great amp
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my dear god your telling me you can do a trainwreck clone with power scaling?
wow ooh dear im going weak at the knees thinking about this now.
I asked for one of them first but then changed my mind and went for the Roadstar with power scaling.
I've taken it in to work for the past week (www.riffsuk.com), great for recording and at 18w it still keeps up with a drummer.
If you're reading this Martin the speaker is well and truly broken in and sounds as sweet as a nut.
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Good to know you're enjoying the amp, and it's getting plenty of use. :D
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and good to see its image up on your website too
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Yep, mine are up there too. As is Martin's own 'blue meanie' :)
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I'm lovin the lovely green v6-20 myself
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What a surprise ;)
Hopefully my two "in progress" will also go up there :D
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Don't forget the Tangerine Dream!!!
Martin's Blue amp is gorgeous-looking.
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Of course - forgot yours was there Sam!
Martin's blue meanie is very nice in the flesh too.
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They all are just wish was rich would have one of each and a few modded ones too
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They all are just wish was rich would have one of each and a few modded ones too
I dread to think how much I've spent on Martin's amps :roll: Ah well, you only live once.
Oh cr@p, does that make me a senseless fanboy??? :lol:
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Twinfan the fanboy...well am a fan of his work too
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Oh cr@p, does that make me a senseless fanboy??? :lol:
No, a man of discernment and taste. A connoisseur of fine amplificatorstm.
8)
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:lol:
I knew you'd have to answer to that comment somehow! I've just discovered the combination of the M45/100 and a LP Special with P90s. Nice..... ;)
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*L*
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Would a JCM800 clone with the power scaling and a built in SD-1 type boost 1x12 combo be a possibiliy? 8)
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Yes. 8)