Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum

Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: Dennis on February 27, 2008, 08:44:06 PM

Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Dennis on February 27, 2008, 08:44:06 PM
Hello there,

To get the best sound out of my BKP's I am in search of a new head, to replace my Hughes & Kettner Triamp.

I was wondering if anyone has some cool hints about what amp would do the job!
When I bought the Triamp, I was looking for an allround amp, and I want my next amp to be allround too!
But it is very difficult to tell what kind of tones/sounds one is looking for.
For example: the Triamp clean isn't bad (at all!), but I like the clean of the Bogner Shiva more (but I really don't like the overdrive/distortion of the shiva), and for distortion and crunch tones..I don't know yet..

The Triamp has some amazing crunchy tones, but in the high gain territory, I would like to have a more gritty sound. The Triamp sounds pretty "smooth" although it has enough gain.

Amps I tried so far:

Soldano Decatone
My opinion: nice tone for classic (heavy) rock music!! Very nice lead tone also, but I don't like what is happening with that amp when you do some riffing a la Iced Earth or something. The sound is just to "loose" for that.)

Diezel VH4
Not my style. The clean is nice, but I prefer the distortion of the Triamp. The VH4 is a very "clean" sounding amp, I didn't find it heavy. I liked the gain structure on the Diezel Einstein better.

Bogner XTC
I don't know...maybe I didn't fiddle with all the settings enough, but I didn't like it for some reason.


On my list to try:

Engl SE (6L6 and EL34)
Mesa Boogie Roadking (damn that thing is expensive here in holland!)
Mesa Boogie mkIV
Diezel Herbert
VHT Sig X

Any opinions, or maybe other options I don't have on my to-try list (yet)?  :D
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Simon D on February 27, 2008, 08:49:19 PM
If you can't quite stretch to a Mesa Roadking, have a look at the Roadster. Effectively it's a Roadking without some of the more complex power switching options.  http://www.mesaboogie.com/Product_Info/Rectifier_Series/roadster/roadster.html

I've just bought one, but it won't be with me until April.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: LazyNinja on February 27, 2008, 08:53:39 PM
How about Fender EVH 5150III or Elmwood M90?
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: AdamB on February 27, 2008, 08:59:06 PM
Egnater Mod 50
Title: Re: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: zf on February 27, 2008, 09:53:21 PM
Have you tried the Koch Powertone II (being from Holland and everything)? I've played with it briefly and it seemed pretty awesome. Need to find some more time to go and crank it up to see if it does brutal metal as well :)
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: dave_mc on February 27, 2008, 10:42:44 PM
I can't really remember what the clean was like on the shiva...  :lol: kind of warm?

i'd say the Engl SE would probably do what you want, if i'm interpreting what you're saying correctly, but it is a lot of cash.

EDIT: it goes without saying that you should try everything you can. :)
Title: Re: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Twinfan on February 27, 2008, 10:50:35 PM
Quote from: Dennis
I really don't like the overdrive/distortion of the shiva


:o

:shock:
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: TwilightOdyssey on February 27, 2008, 11:54:31 PM
May I ask why it has to be 3 channel?

If so, check out the Marshall JVM series.

If a 2 channel with a dedicated solo boost will do, check out Splawn. Or, you might want to check out a Rivera Knucklehead and use a boost in the FX loop for a solo boost.

Another option is to get a MIDI preamp (JMP-1, ENGL E580) and something like a Marshall rack mounted power amp.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: bobthemerciful on February 28, 2008, 01:51:00 AM
The only one on your list I have tried is the Herbert. Prefer it to the VH4 also. Want a Herbert myself, but can't afford one yet. Need a G-System first anyhow. I love my Laney TT, but the Herbert is in another class.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: shaman on February 28, 2008, 02:39:59 AM
I own a Mesa Mk IV ..B version-I can only report on it..only one I have played-I love the cleans on this amp-tremendous...channel 2 is where some people get lost-many want it to have more gain....my feeling is they do not play it loud enough-the IV is a SIMUL CLASS amp=play el 34's and 6l6 tubes simultaneously-I love channel 2-its ac/dc type channel-the lead channel is all the gain you need-not the sag of a rectifier,but a tight tone..very tight
-it is a tweaker's dream!!!half power capabilities..simulclass...harmonic/mid gain switch..slave out...great effects loop-I love it!!!However, it really only serves me as my stereo power amp now..my Boogie IIC+ Coliseum is ridiculous,so it is my "tone bone"-the IIC+ is the most sought after in the mark series, and the IV comes damn close....
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Dennis on February 28, 2008, 05:27:53 PM
Quote from: LazyNinja
How about Fender EVH 5150III or Elmwood M90?


I never saw a Elmwood amp before! I checked it on youtube and it is worth trying though!

I don't know about the EVH 5150III...I am not too fond of the brown sound hype 'nd stuff, but I can give it a try..

Quote from: adammato
Egnater Mod 50


I like the principle of that amp, but I remember some older Egnaters that all broke down because of very bad soldering. Do you have any experience with the newer Egnaters? Because of the preamps that you can change, it doesn't look rock-solid (as far as a tube amp can be), but maybe I am wrong.

Quote from: zf
Have you tried the Koch Powertone II (being from Holland and everything)? I've played with it briefly and it seemed pretty awesome. Need to find some more time to go and crank it up to see if it does brutal metal as well :)


Yeah, Koch is pretty nice actually! Our other guitarist uses a Multitone, but I don't like the fact that it doesn't have a master volume.
I like master volumes , just because it is very handy.

Quote from: dave_mc
I can't really remember what the clean was like on the shiva...  :lol: kind of warm?

i'd say the Engl SE would probably do what you want, if i'm interpreting what you're saying correctly, but it is a lot of cash.


Well, the Bogner Shiva clean channel is like a tonal orgasm for me. I tried that amp and I loved it! Every time I hear someone playing on the shiva clean channgel, it makes me very happy!

Yeah, the SE is pretty expensive, but most of the amps with the features I am looking for are. Hell, I thought I had an expensive amp with the Triamp, and then I came across the mesa boogie Roadking  :lol:

Quote from: Twinfan
Quote from: Dennis
I really don't like the overdrive/distortion of the shiva


:o

:shock:


Yeah...I know....sorry man...not that it is bad, but it is just not what I want :)

Quote from: TwilightOdyssey
May I ask why it has to be 3 channel?

If so, check out the Marshall JVM series.

If a 2 channel with a dedicated solo boost will do, check out Splawn. Or, you might want to check out a Rivera Knucklehead and use a boost in the FX loop for a solo boost.

Another option is to get a MIDI preamp (JMP-1, ENGL E580) and something like a Marshall rack mounted power amp.


The reason I want a 3-channel amp is that I use it all  8)
I play mostly rock and metal oriented music, but I need a good clean also (well, no one will notice when I have a cr@ppy sound, but it's my hobby, so I want to get a kick when playing :) ).
In the band I use clean sounds as well as classic rock sounds (think of AC/DC and Guns N' roses), but also system of a down type of music, which is nicer with a modern sound.
I can try to mess with some distortion pedals, but I like the sound of a big tube head (although I am very curious about the Damage Control pedals!)

So a 2-channel with dedicated solo boost is not what I want. In the Triamp I use a booster pedal between the preamp out and power amp in, for solo boost, on top of the different channels for the sounds.

MIDI preamp is nice too, I have a JMP-1 with poweramp at home, for practise and backup purposes, but I like to use a head in combination with some floor pedals.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: QS-Nalle on February 28, 2008, 05:57:54 PM
Diezel Herbert, 'nuff said!
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: noodleplugerine on February 28, 2008, 06:14:45 PM
Quote from: QS-Nalle
Diezel Herbert, 'nuff said!


+10.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: hunter on February 28, 2008, 07:08:19 PM
Heard the Herbert on a Bon Jovi Live concert on the telli, not bad, not overwhelming either.

The onlyy 3Channel amp I could still get really excited about is the XTC Classic, it's very different from an XTC, but maybe also too lose for your taste.

I get the feeling that you are actually after a Marshall drive tone, as this will give you the tight Iced Earth kinda rhythm tone and with a tube screamer that searing lead feel.

Go try a DSL 50/100 top with a tube screamer type pedal, that might be better than any 3-channel amp.

Or even a Vintage Modern, which is my new favorite. I know you're after 3 channels but it's all theory in the end, try it out and you'll see. I also thought I need more channels and am learning the opposite everyday...
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Dakine on February 28, 2008, 07:09:49 PM
Rivera Knucklehead
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: dave_mc on February 28, 2008, 09:30:17 PM
Quote from: Dennis
[Well, the Bogner Shiva clean channel is like a tonal orgasm for me. I tried that amp and I loved it! Every time I hear someone playing on the shiva clean channgel, it makes me very happy!

Yeah, the SE is pretty expensive, but most of the amps with the features I am looking for are. Hell, I thought I had an expensive amp with the Triamp, and then I came across the mesa boogie Roadking  :lol:



my feeling is you're probably going to have to compromise on some of the tones... i haven't played any amps which do every tone amazingly well. I've played versatile super-amps where no tone is worse than "good", but still an amp dedicated to that one tone would do it better.

so, er, yeah. my advice is to try everything, and be brutally honest about how much you play of each style, what is a necessity and what, while nice to have, could be compromised on...

:)
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Nolly on February 29, 2008, 01:00:19 AM
Thought about a Framus Dragon?
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Dennis on February 29, 2008, 05:34:51 PM
Quote from: hunter

I get the feeling that you are actually after a Marshall drive tone, as this will give you the tight Iced Earth kinda rhythm tone and with a tube screamer that searing lead feel.


Maybe I should give that a go too! I must say that I have played through a TSL quite a while ago, but I didn't like it at all.
But I also read that the DSL should be better than the TSL, so it's worth a try!

Quote from: dave_mc

my feeling is you're probably going to have to compromise on some of the tones...


Yeah, I think you are right, but that doesn't stop me from finding the holy grail....yet  :)
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Johnny Mac on February 29, 2008, 09:20:20 PM
Be patriotic and support your local Koch.  :D  The Powertone II has two master volumes. Plus 3 speaker damping options and is half the price of a Herbert so you could get a full stack and jump off it.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: dave_mc on February 29, 2008, 09:37:59 PM
^ johnny, i'd strike italy off your holiday list this year, you aren't allowed to touch your koch in public there any more, according to some court case.

Quote from: Dennis
Quote from: dave_mc

my feeling is you're probably going to have to compromise on some of the tones...


Yeah, I think you are right, but that doesn't stop me from finding the holy grail....yet  :)


true! just because i couldn't find one that does everything (though my engl is close, but there are definitely tones it doesn't do as well as amps aimed at those tones specifically), doesn't mean you won't find an amp which'll do all the tones you want/need. :)
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Scott674 on February 29, 2008, 10:15:53 PM
Quote from: hunter
...tight Iced Earth kinda rhythm tone and with a tube screamer that searing lead feel...


Hunter, you just summed up my... style? sound?  That's pretty close to what I said to Tim when I emailed him on what pickups I should get. (CS, IT, Nail for my RG).  I think I may have to look into your amp recommendation myself!  It sounds fantastic.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Scott674 on February 29, 2008, 10:23:47 PM
Quote from: hunter
...tight Iced Earth kinda rhythm tone and with a tube screamer that searing lead feel...


Hunter, you just summed up my... style? sound?  That's pretty close to what I said to Tim when I emailed him on what pickups I should get. (CS, IT, Nail for my RG).  I think I may have to look into your amp recommendation myself!  It sounds fantastic.

How are the cleans on a DSL?
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: TomW on February 29, 2008, 10:39:35 PM
I agree with Hunter a DSL or Vintage Modern would be a good choice, as long as you get a pedal to put in front of it.

Quote from: Scott674
How are the cleans on a DSL?

I like the clean tones I can get with my dsl, however I'm not really an expert with clean tones as i hardly ever use cleans.
Heres a clip with the clean channel in the left speaker.
http://www.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11094
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Scott674 on February 29, 2008, 10:48:31 PM
Sorry about the double post... before I noticed it there was a reply, so I can't delete it...  

I like the tone there though... Very nice clip.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Adam.M on February 29, 2008, 11:13:20 PM
Say, just checked out HC and spotted this new amp.

http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/2008/Kustom-Double-Cross-All-Tube-Amp.html

I have no idea what Kustom amplifiers are like but this sure does sound interesting...

But i'm not sure it has a clean channel.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: hunter on March 01, 2008, 02:03:16 AM
Quote from: Adam.M
Say, just checked out HC and spotted this new amp.

http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/2008/Kustom-Double-Cross-All-Tube-Amp.html

I have no idea what Kustom amplifiers are like but this sure does sound interesting...

But i'm not sure it has a clean channel.


Just wondering if the fancy looks need to compensate for weak tones ...
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Adam.M on March 01, 2008, 11:01:07 AM
Quote from: hunter
Quote from: Adam.M
Say, just checked out HC and spotted this new amp.

http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/2008/Kustom-Double-Cross-All-Tube-Amp.html

I have no idea what Kustom amplifiers are like but this sure does sound interesting...

But i'm not sure it has a clean channel.


Just wondering if the fancy looks need to compensate for weak tones ...


Probably, though too many great amps are butt ugly!
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Slarty on March 03, 2008, 01:45:11 PM
Try a Bruentti if you can find one.  

I have the XL R Evo II which has three channels.  The clean is awesome and chimey but never harsh, even at maximum gain it just doesn't want to break up too much.  The other two channels (boost and lead) are awesome too.  Its a just an all round awesome amp, not over complicated like some deizel and bogner amps.

Try one and you'll like it :)
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Pale Rider on March 03, 2008, 02:42:27 PM
I haven't read the whole thread so maybe my suggestions are already there, but anyway...

Maybe the Cameron CCM-100 is another option: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QYNk30aycM&feature=related



Actually I like these: VHT UL, Engl Powerball, Framus Cobra, Cameron CCM-100, with the VHT being the best by far.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: horsehead on March 03, 2008, 05:29:22 PM
What about the Hughes & Kettner Tri-amp? From my little knowledge of playing one it sounds lovely
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: dave_mc on March 03, 2008, 08:37:35 PM
Quote from: Slarty
Try a Bruentti if you can find one.  

I have the XL R Evo II which has three channels.  The clean is awesome and chimey but never harsh, even at maximum gain it just doesn't want to break up too much.  The other two channels (boost and lead) are awesome too.  Its a just an all round awesome amp, not over complicated like some deizel and bogner amps.

Try one and you'll like it :)


that's a very nice amp. if i hadn't got such a good deal on my engl, i'd probably have gone with that.
Title: Opinions on 3-channel tube heads
Post by: Dennis on March 03, 2008, 09:06:30 PM
Quote from: Slarty
Try a Bruentti if you can find one.  


I have tried several Brunetti's, and they are nice amps, but not for what I want to do with it for some reason :)

Quote from: HeavyAxes

Maybe the Cameron CCM-100 is another option: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QYNk30aycM&feature=related


Yeah! That baby seems to have a nice chugga-chugga rhythm tone, very curious about that one!

Quote from: horsehead
What about the Hughes & Kettner Tri-amp? From my little knowledge of playing one it sounds lovely


Yeah, it does :) I own a Triamp mkII, but it is kinda smooth you know...I want some more grit in the lead sound, and a smoother clean...I wish I could play as good as I want my sound to be  :lol:

Everyone thanks for the replys so far. I am still not "finished" testing finding my holy grail, but slowly I am thinking of going to get me a custom built amp, just for me. Actually, when you compare it to a Mesa Roadking, it isn't expensive actually  :lol: