Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Tech => Topic started by: MrBump on August 03, 2008, 11:07:50 AM
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I was cleaning out my garage this morning and I saw this:
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1698.jpg)
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1697.jpg)
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1696.jpg)
Dimensions are 42x500x520 mm.
It's a cut off from an oak kitchen work surface I had fitted a few years ago, I'd forgotten all about it. But now I'm thinking - LP Junior shape? Cheap neck off Ebay? A couple of MQs?
What do you guys think? I KNOW it will be incredibly heavy, but that aside, will it work?
Mark.
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I don't see why not - it could be a fun experiment if nothing else.
But.... I just wonder if you'll end up with a boat anchor which may not sound too great thanks to all those different pieces of wood.... in which case is it worth all the effort?
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PQ - I really don't know... How much do you think laminated wood would affect the tone?
Like you say, an interesting experiment. I was going to make a chopping board out of it, but it's bloody heavy, and it seems a waste...
We'll see. Gonna see what kind of cheap necks I can get.
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whats the tap tone like :lol:
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:)
Seriously. The more i think about it the more I want to do it.
I'm thinking a hard tail strat. Loads of cheap necks on Ebay.
How hard can it be?
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I was going to make a chopping board out of it, but it's bloody heavy, and it seems a waste...
That's exactly what my brother did with a near-identical chunk of kitchen-worktop. But he doesn't play guitar. :)
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Don't worry about the amount of pieces of wood, I know a guy over at the telecaster forum that made a 35 piece tele body. Just lots of thin strips of pine or something. Sounded fine. The whole 1 or 2 piece body debate is cork sniffing cow poop. DO IT!
I even have a spare neck if you want it ;)
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The whole 1 or 2 piece body debate is cork sniffing cow poop.
I've got an old superstrat with a neck made of 50-odd maple laminates, all less than 1mm thick. It sounds good, no dead spots.
But it can't be total cow poop. Two or three different pieces of wood glued together must resonate differently from a single piece, whether that's good or bad.
And once you get to 35 pieces or whatever, a significant part of the body is glue, which must affect the tone. That neck of mine must be at least one-third glue! I'm not saying glue doesn't have great tonal properties :lol: , but the number of pieces has to have some effect.
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welll we can start talking about the tonal properties of different glues if you want, it all comes down to the brittleness of the glue when dry, some glues never get fully hard so will have a dampening effect, traditional glues like hide glue are much better because they are so brittle and hard when dry.
now i have nothing against lots of pieces of wood being stuck together to make a body even if its not something i am interested in using myself... but the problem i see here is that some are joined end to end and really you want a continuous piece for the length guitar because end grain jons are weak - but draw some shapes on and see where that end grain ends up.. if you can get them all behind the bridge it might not be a problem
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Sod it, I'm gonna do it.
Just been consting it up, and (bar the pickups) I think I can do it all for a shade over £100. Even Mrs Bump can't argue with that.
(Actually, she can. And probably will. Based on the fact that we have a spare room, our bedroom, the downstairs toilet, and living and dining rooms awaiting my magic DIY touch, and a guitar project WON'T go down well...)
To quote Guitar Sam - "It's Hell living with a responsible adult".
Mark, I remember the thread about your neck, and even thought about you, but I get kinda hyper with these things, and couldn't resist ordering a maple neck from Ebay...
Does anyone know anything about oak in terms of how it resonates? Didn't the rule used to be the heavier the wood the better tone (although my mother always says that when you move house you should spread butter on your cats paws to stop it from runing away, so I'm fully conversant with old wives tales...)
Mark.
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that rule was wrong/misleading , but certainly the way a lot of people used to think
brian mays red special was an oak mantlepiece
i asked about tap tone earlier and i was only half joking... if its has pleasing sound when you knock on it thats likely to translate into a good sound when its a guitar.. if it sounds like a dull thud then dont bother (except with swamp ash)
if toast always lands butter side down, and cats always land on their feet.... what happens when you butter a cats back!!
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If you butter a cats back you may as well just grill it lightly and have it for supper.
(I hope Jonathan doesn't read that - I suspect he's a cat lover, and he currently has my guitar...)
Just gave my "blank" a good tapping... Interesting sound. Very bright, almost a "ping", onamatapaeically speaking. I definitely wouldn't say dull. Also, the sound is consistent across the whole board, which I thought was a good thing.
Good point about the end joints, Wez... I think that I can get some continuity.
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possibly gonna be a bit bright then - but not necissarily in a bad way... just make sure you have a tone control
I'm a cat lover too, but not beyond buttering a cats back in the name of science. My hypothesis is that the cat will spin in mid air as reality collapses in on itself...
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I shall test the laminated oak brightness/cat spinning reality collapse over the coming weeks!
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So.
This is what I've been doing with myself...
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1698.jpg)
The starting point.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1706.jpg)
Shape was donated by my Charvel... pretty much Strat-ish.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1703.jpg)
Neck was no-name from Ebay, Canadian rock maple neck and fretboard.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1705.jpg)
Sanded and danish-oiled
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1702.jpg)
Jigsaw struggled cutting the body shape...
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1701.jpg)
... badly!
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1711.jpg)
Routed neck pocked - I hated doing this, and there are many gaps.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1712.jpg)
Checking that the neck fitted in and everything was straight - it was, against all the odds..!
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1719.jpg)
Mock up with bridge and knobs.
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1710.jpg)
Fitting the neck, tuners on (but wonkey as f*ck)
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1723.jpg)
Dodgy string ferrules
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1720.jpg)
Strings fitted, tuned and tested!
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1721.jpg)
More of the same...
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1722.jpg)
...and again...
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1715.jpg)
... and the youngest kicking some arse.
Well, that's it so far. I strung it with some Ernie Ball 9s that I had lying around, and it actually sounds pretty good - intonation is spot on, the action isn't half bad, plays really well!
It's rough as hell though - chips and gaps all over it. It's sloppy and a bit of a slob. Like me.
I love it!
Next step is to strip it down again and go through the fine sanding, then Danish oil and wax the body. The I guess some electrics.
I just wanted to share with you guys the story for now.
Ta ta.
Mark.
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Please put an IKEA decal on the headstock (it resembles the collapsible tabletop I have at home) :wink:
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Liking the Ibanez Roadstar style headstock :)
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Please put an IKEA decal on the headstock (it resembles the collapsible tabletop I have at home) :wink:
That's a pretty good idea... I think I might do that.
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Please put an IKEA decal on the headstock (it resembles the collapsible tabletop I have at home) :wink:
That's a pretty good idea... I think I might do that.
Careful they don't sue you for passing it off as a real IKEA guitar!
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Please put an IKEA decal on the headstock (it resembles the collapsible tabletop I have at home) :wink:
That's a pretty good idea... I think I might do that.
Careful they don't sue you for passing it off as a real IKEA guitar!
I don't think that they would... I've bought Ikea stuff. The quality is far, FAR superior to my effort...
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I think it looks absolutely awesome! :twisted:
Are you going to paint it? Black or an EVH-style black/white/red stripes would be great. And a black IKEA logo on the headstock would be a nice touch :)
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whats the weight like?
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whats the weight like?
Heavy. Oh, so very heavy... Mr PQ would definitely NOT like it...
But your "tap tone" comment was a fair one - it's only got 9s on it at the moment, but it's pretty bright, and the notes do ring out pretty well.
And thanks, Sambo. It ain't gonna win any awards, but it's a one off. I'm going to use danish oil and wax - I think that might be the safest option - I like the "kitchen worktop" effect showing through!
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whats the weight like?
Heavy. Oh, so very heavy... Mr PQ would definitely NOT like it...
I hadn't dared ask... :oops: :wink:
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Absolutely love this! Great use of left-over worktop, there, Mark :)
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Absolutely love this! Great use of left-over worktop, there, Mark :)
Ta. I was trying to make a Tele, but I couldn't get the jigsaw to get round that nasty bulbous top horn...
:wink:
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Sooooo......
I'm getting to a point where I want to put a pickup somewhere near this monster.
I know this isn't the right forum for that discussion, but the idea is a single HB, single volume and single tone.
Currently I'm leaning towards MQ...
Thoughts?
Mark.
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It's bright and heavy? An MQ is just going to emphasise that, and it's not a humbucker!
In true 80s home-build style, you should go for a VHII or Holy Diver :)
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It's bright and heavy? An MQ is just going to emphasise that, and it's not a humbucker!
In true 80s home-build style, you should go for a VHII or Holy Diver :)
VH or HD without a trem?!?! Blasphmeny!!!
Yeah, I wondered if it might be too bright. And I meant HB sized rather than HB... I'm intrigued by the single P90 sound, a la LP Junior...
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Not saying your creation doesn't deserve a new pickup, Mark, but before shelling out I'd try it with whatever I had lying around to get an idea of what worked best.
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Not saying your creation doesn't deserve a new pickup, Mark, but before shelling out I'd try it with whatever I had lying around to get an idea of what worked best.
Another fair point - I'd thought about that, but I don't actually have much lying around. Only a Charvel stacked humbucker, which means messing around with alternative scratchplates etc.
My reasoning for shelling out £90 for a single pup is that I'll ALWAYS find a home for it!!!
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Forget that - just ordered a Tonerider Rocksong - £20 from Ebay... I know, I know... It's not IDEAL. But it means that I can mess around with it, get it in the guitar without worrying too much about damaging an expensive PUP.
Now for some pots and caps!
Mark.
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So here it is:
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1732.jpg)
Heh, heh, heh...
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1730.jpg)
And an action shot!
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1746.jpg)
... or two...
(http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o82/markdemanbey/GuitarBuild/DSCF1745.jpg)
It's very bright sounding! The Tonerider PUP is OK... it's about 16k output, similar to my Nailbomb, but it's really raw sounding, nowhere near as smooth. I bolloxed up the push pull pot I had for splitting the coils, and also managed to lose all of my ceramic caps, so the tone pot isn't wired in just yet.
It's been an adventure. The guitar is VERY rough and ready, but I kinda like that. The IKEA logo on the headstock has "Custom Shop!" superimposed on it... Heh, heh, heh!
It actually plays quite well, which isn't suprising as I had nothing to do with the neck.
The body finish is Danish Oil and Beeswax - which I LOVE the smell of!
Anyway, off to talk to my family, if I can remember what they look like!
Mark.
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so whats next?
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Not sure... I really enjoyed it, and I think that I learned a lot about the process... If I did it again I'd do the whole thing; neck included.
Alternatively, I'm be tempted by something more kit-like, a Warmoth build or some-such.
This thing about my Ikea Custom Shop is that it was built with a purpose - to come in VERY cheaply. And it did. The whole thing was about £80*, which ain't half bad, I reckon, for a playable, half-decent sounding geetar.
Mark.
*This doesn't include the stupid amount of money spent on buying cheap powertools, breaking them, buying better ones, etc...
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Removed stupid comentary
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Classic!
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My God! That headstock NOOOOOO!
It reminds me a particular part of male body that makes me sick when I see that... (http://r6-forumz.com/images/smilies/iobarf.gif)
Hey! That's my new mistress you're talking dirty about!!!
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Hey! That's my new mistress you're talking dirty about!!!
I'm sorry Mr Bump :(
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well it looks fun, but you could build another body out of a proven tonewood for a pretty cheap price... worth considering now you have all the parts and tools
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wow! It's beautiful! lol, i'm considering hacking into my kitchen table to get one!
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Removed stupid comentary
Fernando, not stupid, funny!!!
:wink:
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:lol:
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Wow! I've missed all this - I saw the first post and assumed it had developed into a discussion about woods, eventually degenerating into something else...
I should've kept following it - Didn't realise you were actually building the thing.
Great stuff - very impressive :D
And I loved this bit:
*This doesn't include the stupid amount of money spent on buying cheap powertools, breaking them, buying better ones, etc...
:lol: That is exactly what I would do if attempted it. Even knowing that this is what would happen wouldn't not stop me making the mistake!!
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And I loved this bit:
*This doesn't include the stupid amount of money spent on buying cheap powertools, breaking them, buying better ones, etc...
:lol: That is exactly what I would do if attempted it. Even knowing that this is what would happen wouldn't not stop me making the mistake!!
Aha!
Andy, wanna buy a jig saw, cheap? It won't cut in straight lines, but apart from that it's fine...
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:lol:
I nearly added "I suspect Philly's the same..."
I also suspect that even chaps like Wez, Jonathan, etc must have at least one or two items like this lurking in their past!
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:lol:
I nearly added "I suspect Philly's the same..."
I am. But it's also true that one of the reasons I've never stepped up to building guitars "from scratch" is the cost of tools and equipment. I do nearly all my little bits of tinkering with basic hand tools (including some of StewMac's excellent gadgets). I don't even use an electric drill if I can avoid it.
Must say though, my trusty old Black & Decker router is one of the best investments I ever made.
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Yep, my biggest cost was the B&D Router - it's fantastic.
I first tried to route using my Dremel + router attachment. Killed it. And it cost more to repair than replace.
So, replaced that with a cheapo Maplin dremel-esq thing. OK, but nowhere NEAR as good as the Dremel.
Then bought a dirt cheap plunge router from Evil Bay... the thing was just sooo wrong... turned it on, it started flying around at about a million rpm, sparks started to fly out of the back of it. I was genuinely scared.
Then the B&D and all was fine.
TBH I have a lot of other stuff, a decent drill etc.
If I were to do it again, I would invest in:
1. A decent work bench. The B&D Workmate just doesn't cut it.
2. A drill press. It's impossible to drill in a straight line without one.
3. A band saw. I know, really expensive. But a jigsaw is RUBBISH and painfully slow. Also, I can't see how I could make a neck without a band saw and a straight cutting line...
I think that it's possible to do a lot with few tools if you're prepared to ignore some pretty fundamental safety guidlines...
Mark.
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A band saw. I know, really expensive. But a jigsaw is RUBBISH and painfully slow. Also, I can't see how I could make a neck without a band saw and a straight cutting line...
Yeah, a band saw, that's the big investment! I'd love to own one, but if I did feel inclined to purchase, the only place I could keep it would be the kitchen... ain't gonna happen.
I do have a really primitive spring-loaded drill press, but it's very hard to hold it in place and drill at the same time (at least until I manage to grow a third arm :roll: ). I much prefer to use my hand drill whenever possible. Sometimes I use the drill press and power drill to make a template, then I can switch to the safety of the hand drill and still get a proper vertical(ish) line.
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I think that it's possible to do a lot with few tools if you're prepared to ignore some pretty fundamental safety guidlines...
:lol:
This is one of the best lines I've read recently - kind of sums up my entire experience of DIYery. And it so easily covers both extremes:
"... it's possible to do a lot (of good stuff) with few tools ..."
"... it's possible to do a lot (of damage to the precious item you are working on, to the kitchen worktop, the living-room carpet, passing relatives, next-door's mains supply, and so on) with few tools ..."
:D
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on my first i had a cheap drill and i brought a basic router for doing the truss rod slot... everything else was hand tools - inclusing cutting out the body from a 2" slab of mahogany with a coping saw. it was the first proper wood work i had ever done but still turned out playable and sounded great
(http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e31/WezV/wv1.jpg)
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And so, as a finale, to this great thread, some not so great playing.
This is the thing spanking out a tune:
http://soundclick.com/share?songid=6947937 (http://soundclick.com/share?songid=6947937)
A bit of VH inspired guitar-w**kery, complete with dodgy drums. I had to tweek the EQ on my amp big style to tame the brightness, but it's still cool to play.
Mark.
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This is the thing spanking out a tune:
:lol:
Cool song!
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Would look so much better without that horrible pickguard, kinda ruins the look a bit imo :(
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Would look so much better without that horrible pickguard, kinda ruins the look a bit imo :(
Yeah, it's pretty bad...
The idea was "cheap build"... I just used the bit I had, where I had them. And I wasn't really confident enough to route a pickup cavity.
I kinda like it though. Not pretty. But I like it.
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great stuff mr bump
q:p
is that clip , already with a BKP installed on it?
just to confirM or not that the brightness is something purely related to the Body wood(s), instead of the pickup.
Q:)
JP
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Well done; looks awesome, imo. I like the sound, too, from what I could hear of it. :)
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No, it's a terrible clip! It's a Tone Rider Rocksong humbucker - gonna change it for a "heavyish" BKP ASAP... Not sure which one though, possibly a Warpig.
Mark.
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i actually really like the headstock shape
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brian mays red special was an oak mantlepiece
Yes, was gunna say the same. I think it was also made from several pieces glued together, and if I remember was somewhat hollow and contained some sort of resonation chamber.
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Ignore
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If we're talking about the same guitar (the Mr Bump Ikea-caster), I think the pics are back up a bit (page 3 the way I view threads...)
EDIT: Ah! you found it :D
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Wow, only just found this thread... Awesome stuff MrBump!! One thing though... the Ikea special needed water tap knobs and/ or light switch fittings! Seriously though, I think you did a great job.