Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
At The Back => Time Out => Topic started by: _tom_ on December 05, 2008, 09:54:21 PM
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I want to replace my sound setup soon.. my Creative t20s are ok but compared to some other setups they just lack punch and depth, sound really flat if you know what I mean.. Anyway I cant decide between getting a pair of monitors such as the Mackie MR5s, or KRK Rokit 5s, or going for a hifi amp and speaker setup. I mostly just use these speakers for listening to music at reasonable volumes (probably loud bedroom if that makes sense), and a bit of basic recording (drums in ezdrummer, guitar either mic'd or direct into amplitube 2) - nothing "pro" just my own stuff at home to get ideas down really..
The KRKs are about £250 for a pair I think, and the hi-fi amp/speakers I'm looking at are system 2 here http://www.richersounds.com/information.php?cda=static&cst=hifisystems at £150, it seems good value. Those tangent speakers get a good review from what hi-fi mag.
I dont have a proper CD player so the hifi appeals to me, then again I can just play cds through the computer anyway, but somehow its not the same haha. Any opinions? My mate has an alesis amp and some Monitor 1 Mk2s but they only seem to sound good when up really loud (as in, way too loud for practical listening in a flat), and sound a bit lacklustre for rock and metal - I want punch. I know monitors are meant to be flat but those Alesis ones sound pretty damn punchy for drum n bass etc, just cr@p for rock that I've listened through them..
edit - I want to stick to a 2.0 setup as well just for portability really, plus a sub isnt really necessary to me - my creatives seem to have enough bass with their bass ports without any need for a sub - still shakes the floor when cranked :)
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This is worth it just for the speakers. B&W speakers are really good, we have a set of CM2's which are amazing.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Technics-Pioneer-Hi-Fi-Equipment-plus-2-B-W-Speakers_W0QQitemZ250334219818QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_AudioVisualElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_CompleteHifiSystems?hash=item250334219818&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1300%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Technics-Pioneer-Hi-Fi-Equipment-plus-2-B-W-Speakers_W0QQitemZ250334219818QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_AudioVisualElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_CompleteHifiSystems?hash=item250334219818&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1300%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318)
Edit: Sorry I just noticed 'pickup only' But B&W still rule :)
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They look a bit large for me, I have to be able to bring it to/from uni fairly easily :P
I was just hoping for some half decent desktop/bookshelf speakers. The problem with those hifi ones I linked to is that they arent magnetically shielded which I guess is a problem when I want to use them with my computer as they'll be near the monitor?
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I only think magnetic shielding matters with ye oldé CRT monitors, not modern TFT/LCD/OLED whatever the hell they're making these days.
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for getting a flat response for mixing....monitors are far better..but if as you say it's usually for listening to music at reasonable volumes..then yeah the HI FI route
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active monitors all the way
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i use Event TR5's as my main speakers. drive them through a small 10 channel mixer. to which i got everything connected (computer, mic, modeller). wouldnt trade them for anything.
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They look a bit large for me, I have to be able to bring it to/from uni fairly easily :P
I was just hoping for some half decent desktop/bookshelf speakers. The problem with those hifi ones I linked to is that they arent magnetically shielded which I guess is a problem when I want to use them with my computer as they'll be near the monitor?
Fair point, our CM2's are bookshelf speakers, about 30cm tall, but not that light, not too bad to move around, but not ideal either.
LCD's can be affected by magnets, but not in the same way or as much as CRT's (but CRT's give you such funky colours when you put a magnet near them :) ). If you are going to be PC based then I'd go with a good set of monitors.
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From my experience: get bi-amped active ones. I have KRK V6 and while they are great for listening, they are also great with a modeler, or even playing bass through them. And if you want later on, you can get the matching sub woofer to get the real "boom".
BTW I got the KRKs half price from a friend who also had Genelecs. I preferred KRK as they were more direct and punchy.
HOWEVER, you won't get so much the silky highs and airy mids as with a HiFi setup, the sound will be more analytic and punchy.
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Yeah Indy was saying the KRK are really punchy and good. I dont really need or particularly want a flat and accurate sound, but I've heard some monitors that sounded good for music.
btw this setup will be computer > interface (edirol ua-25ex) > rca or unbalanced out > speakers/amp/whatever I decide to go for
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From my experience: get bi-amped active ones. I have KRK V6 and while they are great for listening, they are also great with a modeler, or even playing bass through them. And if you want later on, you can get the matching sub woofer to get the real "boom".
BTW I got the KRKs half price from a friend who also had Genelecs. I preferred KRK as they were more direct and punchy.
HOWEVER, you won't get so much the silky highs and airy mids as with a HiFi setup, the sound will be more analytic and punchy.
I'm gonna be getting a pair of KRK RP6's in the new year, they sound great, they're not quite flat- they have a little boosted low and high-, but they sound great playing and mixing through.
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Boosted low sounds good, I dont want to have to use a sub really, my Creatives have more than enough bass without one. Gonna have to go and see if Sound Control/Reverb have any Rokit 5s to try out I reckon :)
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a mate and i tested aload of monitors out the other week. we liked the alesis ones in the end.
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I find (at least with my mates) that the Monitor 1 Mk2 are great for drum n bass and that kinda stuff but seem too hollow for rock and metal.
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I find (at least with my mates) that the Monitor 1 Mk2 are great for drum n bass and that kinda stuff but seem too hollow for rock and metal.
yeah, you're right - we were listening to them for drum'n'bass and electro
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Monitors, every time.
My Adam A7s >>>>>>> NAD C352 driving B&W DM602s >>> NAD & KEF C40s >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>creative amp&sub & JBL Control 1Gs.
Cheaper too (than 2 out of the other 3).
Its more than just EQ levelness, as well. Its how dynamic and fast the speaker is, its ability to resolve layered and otherwise concurrent sounds, differentiate attacks in notes that are close together, ability to only represent whats there, rather than always make everything sound good (whatever that manufacturers version of "Good" is), and you evade the nightmare and cash cow of amp/speaker pairing. Pay not very much (200 or so or more) and you get bi-amplified speakers with matched amps.
They all still sound pretty different, and you still have to learn them, but youre off to a much better start with monitors than Hi Fi speakers. I mean, monitors and Hi Fi speakers look very much alike, but they're for very, very different jobs. If you get good enough monitors, you'll wonder why half your music suddenly sounds so rubbish, and you wont be able to listen to MP3s any lower than 320kbs, for a start :D (upsampling media players are your friend - foobar or a plugin for winamp)
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If you get good enough monitors, you'll wonder why half your music suddenly sounds so rubbish, and you wont be able to listen to MP3s any lower than 320kbs, for a start :D (upsampling media players are your friend - foobar or a plugin for winamp)
ugh, yeah ... bad production albums too.. if the mix is too hot, you'll hear it.
i cant listen to any slipknot album anymore
oh wait.. they were rubbish before i got the monitors. :P (that was a joke btw)
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If you get good enough monitors, you'll wonder why half your music suddenly sounds so rubbish, and you wont be able to listen to MP3s any lower than 320kbs, for a start :D (upsampling media players are your friend - foobar or a plugin for winamp)
ugh, yeah ... bad production albums too.. if the mix is too hot, you'll hear it.
Thats kinda what I meant. Music that other people have done that you've been listening to for years, and your own music as well.
Oh, and probably as important, if not moreso than the speakers is the room, is location of the speakers in the room and acoustic treatment. You need position and treatment such that you have a listening position that has an even frequency response (i.e as close to it as possible) and clear and balanced stereo field. I've seen the location of your creative speakers and that aint it! Start with an equilateral triangle between the speakers and your head, with the speakers equal distances from the walls either side of them.
Unfortunately, getting good monitoring setup for recording and mixing is more than just geting speakers.
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Yeah thats whats worrying me, a lot of my music is in MP3, so I was thinking that monitors would make it all sound shite :lol: Twas sort of like that when I got my Grado SR80s, could hear clipping and stuff on a lot of tracks so I had to get rid of them and buy the cds!
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Twas sort of like that when I got my Grado SR80s, could hear clipping and stuff on a lot of tracks so I had to get rid of them and buy the cds!
modern cds will not guarantee getting rid of clipping!
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True dat.
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Well yeah but somehow the mp3s I downloaded had way more and just sounded shite, even mine ripped to 192kbps mp3 were much better :? How can people get it so wrong? :lol:
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Ok so I got to listen to my mates Mackie MR5s last night and was very impressed. Sounded much better than those Alesis Monitor 1 MK2s overall, rock and metal seemed punchier and well defined, sounded very large :) Plenty of bass without being overwhelming or muddy, loads of clarity and everything sounded great. Just cant decide between those MR5s and KRK Rokit 5s now! Anyone listened to both?
Going back to my Creative t20s is horrible :(
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I reckon I may have decided. Someone on the Reaper forums recommended Samson Rubicon R5A monitors. According to a blind Future Music test of monitors in the £200-250 price range, they came out on top, sounding the most natural and pleasing. Beat KRK Rokit 5s anyway so I dont think I'll be going for them! Only concern is that they look so dated, but I'm just being a vain bar-steward :lol:
I have a question though. My interfaces rca output level is -2db, whereas the Rubicons specs say the rca input is -10db. Would I damage the rubicon by running this output into the input, or am I just getting confused about how it works?
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I reckon I may have decided. Someone on the Reaper forums recommended Samson Rubicon R5A monitors. According to a blind Future Music test of monitors in the £200-250 price range, they came out on top, sounding the most natural and pleasing. Beat KRK Rokit 5s anyway so I dont think I'll be going for them! Only concern is that they look so dated, but I'm just being a vain bar-steward :lol:
I have a question though. My interfaces rca output level is -2db, whereas the Rubicons specs say the rca input is -10db. Would I damage the rubicon by running this output into the input, or am I just getting confused about how it works?
I'm worried by the way youre talking about monitors in this here thread mate.
They shouldnt be natural and pleasing and good and whatever else in the normal speakers sense, unless the mix is like that.
They should be detailed and revealing and unforgiving and accurate. They should let a good mix sound good and give a bad one enough rope to hang itself with. Or thats the idea.
A monitor that sounds good all the time is a failure as a monitor.
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Yeah thats why I was wondering whether or not it was a good idea to go this route instead of hifi speakers which are meant to sound pleasing rather than revealing.. the monitors I've heard have all sounded good just for music. I've only listened to "professional" mixes through them though so thats probably why they sounded good, my amateur attempts would sound awful I assume :P
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Bought tomjacksons Tapco S5s as £100 was too good an offer to miss. Bit of a problem though, when I received them today, the tweeter of one of them was inside the enclosure rather than mounted properly. It looks as though the magnet became detatched from the cone and then the cone fell off. Dont know how as the magnets clip in pretty tightly. Anyway after putting it back together that speaker sounds a lot duller and less clear than the other one :(
Hopefully I can get a pair of matching replacement tweeters for reasonably cheap (and that the amp/crossover isnt damaged), and that Parcel Force will pay up, but somehow I doubt it as the packaging isnt really damaged. Maybe it was loose when tom received them but he never realised, then when it was shipped to me, fell apart? I'm quite trusting of him/members of this forum, so I really hope theres nothing funny going on here.
Anyway, the one that IS working sounds great, bass very punchy and defined, everything sounds very clear and natural. Poor quality mp3s I have do sound a bit rubbish though so I'm going to have to update my collection with some higher quality stuff. Then again its hard to tell when you only have one half of it!