Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: psy on February 10, 2009, 10:35:28 AM
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I'm thinking about switching from a head/cab set up to rack/cab set up. (I guess you can call it rack gas :lol: )I don't know anything about racks really, so I thought I'd ask you fine folk.
What are the basics for a rack? Is it a power amp & pre amp? Or do you not need a pre amp when using a multi FX pedal (Boss GT-6)?
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mmmmm I'd love a full rack... anyway back to guitars.
Ye your going to want a case, preamp, poweramp and a power conditioner at the very least.
Check out Hunters thread he has some nice rack gear.
Not cheap though!
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i use rack gear... although its just a head that fits into a rack case... i use the seperates as backup.
A simple rack would consist of a preamp, poweramp and cab.
Then you can start adding to it... with rack effects... rack tuner..and accesories like rack wireless, power conditionaer.. and then looper units such as the voodoo labs one to incoporate pedals into your rack if you so wish.
all in a nice rack case.
one of the good points of a rack setup is that more commonly than not you will get a stereo power amp and therefore beable to run a stereo effects processor into a stereo cab (or two mono cabs).... which is lush.
AND you can control the whole lot with a single midi pedal... (you can control anything with a midi pedal... but racks make it easier.. with a unit like the G-major allowing the effects unit to control your amps channel switching and then the midi pedal controling your effects unit.. you control the entire thing with one floor board... so one button push to switch your amp channel AND your effects patch.. no tap danceing!!!
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You don't need a power conditioner in the UK do you?
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You don't need a power conditioner in the UK do you?
you dont NEED one anywhere... but i think that the power is more stable here with it being 240V... or something to do with it being a higher voltage rating than in the americas
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Oh right, i thought than in America the power surges quite a lot, and a power conditioner helps to tame it. But in the UK, power supply is much more stable
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Thanks for the pointers guys :) Now I just need to decide if I want to go 50w a side & run my 2x12" in stereo or go 100w a side, run it in mono, but leaving room to add an additional cab in the future. Just need to get shot of my 2203 head first.
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I hook ALL my stuff to surge protectors anyway.
Power conditioners are overkill. SPs from maplins/willkinsons/any electronics or tat shop do the job.
Old wiring you see.
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Thanks for the pointers guys :) Now I just need to decide if I want to go 50w a side & run my 2x12" in stereo or go 100w a side, run it in mono, but leaving room to add an additional cab in the future. Just need to get shot of my 2203 head first.
50W a side stereo all the way!
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As people have suggested, a power conditioner is a good idea... i use a ETA PD8L, and it works great- also means that you can switch everything on in one go, which is nice :) Before you commit to buying a rack case, have a think about what kind of things you're likely to buy so you can buy a case large enough- i'd estimate between 6 and 10u, depending on how many things you're going to put in there.
You can use your GT6 straight into a poweramp, so you could have a setup that is just: power conditioner, GT6, poweramp, which (considering the GT6 is on the floor) means the rack could be as small as 3u, which is nice and portable for gigs and rehearsals :)
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I've been a rack user for over 20 years
I tend to use a Furman/Samson conditioner mainly for the distribution reasons
The Samson powerstrip is best value on that front
http://www.dv247.com/invt/47520/ (http://www.dv247.com/invt/47520/)
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Cool, cheers oli. It's good to know I can start small & build it up as & when I want too :)
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Oh right, i thought than in America the power surges quite a lot, and a power conditioner helps to tame it. But in the UK, power supply is much more stable
If I remember right, power over here used to be 230V +/- 5%. But they wanted to bring it in line with Europe (240V), so they made it 240V +5% -10%. Essentially they just changed the lower operational limit so that they could still generate/transform exactly the same, but could write 240V on everything.
I'll ask one of my bods what the exact voltage is next time I'm having someone apply the protection settings to a bit of kit.
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I run a rack.
The only reason I have a power conditioner is that it is also the main power supply for all the rack units, no 4 ways screwed to the inside. And it comes with a nice rack light. £30 for a Behringer unit.
When putting the rack together don't forget to leave a spare slot above the power amp to get rid of heat.
They can get bloody heavy though so you may be better off going with two smaller racks but more trips, especially if you have to lug them up and down stairs all the time.
My Rack consists of
Behringer power strip
PSA-1 (fantastic pre-amp)
TCelectronic G-System
A tray for the following Pedals (linked into the loops of the G-System)
TS9 Tube screamer (modded to TS808 specs)
Voodoo Labs Proctavia
Voodoo Labs Microvibe
A two unit Draw (for leads, picks, strings)
And Finally a Mesa/Boogie 50/50 Valve power amp
Speakers are 2 Marshall 1936 2x12 cabs
Controled by the G-System floor board. Only an ethernet cable required to link to the rack.
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I keep my power amp in a separate rack case
Several reasons
1 It's the heaviest bit and by handling it separately - I save my back from strain
2 Having the power amp separate means I can select a different power amp to use at home from one I would use at a gig- 20w or less for home ....50w or more for a gig
3 It does give it more cooling and keeps it away from heat sensitive gear
Shameless HUGE rack piccy:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v662/felineguitars/amps/PICT4927.jpg)
My Workshop rack - with added Egnater fun!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v662/felineguitars/amps/P1050086.jpg)
My newest bench rack - really just for the sake of my rack strobe tuner, but featuring a cut down Marshall 12w amp:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v662/felineguitars/P1050103.jpg)
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That's some nice gear there. You're doing nothing for my rack GAS :p
The power amp I'm thinking of going with is the Marshall EL34 50/50. It's a 3U unit. So would I put that in a 3U rack case on it's own.. or should it go in a 4U rack to allow airflow over it?
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Nice rack, but why so many ADA pre-amps???
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I'd go for the 4U case for added airflow, you might even want to get a 1U rack fan to suck in air
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If you have a modeler (like tonelab, boss, Axe FX, etc) you can get a rack with just a power-amp. A good solution is the Marshall EL84 20/20, which is just 1U and very affordable. People say that the deep switch compensates for lack of bottom end.
In the mid range there are the Carvin T100, and used ones like Mesa 50:50 (supposed to sound better than 2:50), sometimes a Randall pops up (they run EL34 in one side, 6L6 on the other and you can switch them via MIDI, pretty cool).
For bargain and value you should look for one of the Reussenzehn amps, they are big and heavy but sound great and go for 300-400 (German built). Reussenzehn has also a new product which is an dual class A EL34 poweramp, supposed to be amazing (according to German Gitarre und Bass magazine), really light too:
http://www.reussenzehn.de/roehrenverstaerker/Vorverstaerker/DE/content?cont_id=299&Grp_id=6
For above 600 you should look at the VHTs (I have a 2502). 2502 if you like EL34s, 2902 if you want bone crushing 5881 power. Currently guitarguitar are dumping out a 2902 for 799, which is 30% below usual retail.
There are several more options, like the Marshall EL34 50/50 or 100/100, but they are so heavy and big, you could also get a head instead.
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I like the Peavey 50/50 for a rack power amp... its a lot nicer than the 60/60.. that one is a bit sterile. Its not very expensive either, its 2u.. el34s..
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this is a good deal: http://cgi.ebay.de/Reussenzehn-Guitar-Slave-2-x-50-W-Rack-Amp-Vollroehre-3HE_W0QQitemZ320339744067QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAmps?hash=item320339744067
just need to ask nicely if he'd ship to UK too.
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For above 600 you should look at the VHTs (I have a 2502). 2502 if you like EL34s, 2902 if you want bone crushing 5881 power. Currently guitarguitar are dumping out a 2902 for 799, which is 30% below usual retail.
There are several more options, like the Marshall EL34 50/50 or 100/100, but they are so heavy and big, you could also get a head instead.
That is a good deal on the VHT in Guitar Guitar. I'll have to have look to see if they got one in the Newcastle shop to have a play on. :) I see it can be operated at 60w per channel too.
I'm still tempted by those big Marshall though. That's probably just because I'm familiar with the name (and they look cool LOL )
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Nice rack, but why so many ADA pre-amps???
They have all been modified to do different things
One has the 3 Tube Mod - much more gain and crunch(3TM)
Another has had a 1980s hair metal mod which gives a very different sound (Mod4MK2)
One has 5751 valves in for a much better clean tone (the 5751 has only about 70 % of the gain of a ECC83, so 2 of them yields 50% of the normal gain)
To be fair I may clear a lot of it out soon as I have been really taken with the Egnater
Will still keep a few ADAs but not so many
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I'm off to Guitar Guitar to try out one of the VHT's Hunter tipped me off about :) Wonder if the price drop is just because VHT have changed their name to Fryette.