Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: Jonesy76 on April 11, 2009, 08:24:23 PM
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Right, the time has come for me to consider the future of my beloved Marshall TSL601.
It's still playing beautifully, but I never take it out of the house any longer due to the fact that the only gigs I do now are with my sublime Larrivee LV-19E acoustic guitar (I'll never own another acoustic from any othe manufacturer again after finding these beauties), or I'm singing opera. My electric guitars are now for my own pleasure, and to be honest the old Marshall at 60W is possibly a bit too loud especially as we now have neighbours, and they've modernised the house next door so their old outhouse is now their office too - we're semi-detached!
I've been trying a Laney today - a VC30 - and to be honest I was very impressed as to what that little amp is capable of, but I have to admit to being a bit intruiged as to what the Laney Lionheart LT5 would be like as the guitar shop I tried didn't actually have one of them. Yes it would be another £70 more than the VC30, but it does come with a footswitch and a dust cover, and the things I've read about the little Lionheart are amazing. It sounds like the perfect home players valve amp.
What would you good people think?
Keep the old Marshall and it's 3 channels?
Get the VC30 with its 30W and more grunt?
Save for the Lionheart?
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It really depends what you would use the amp for, The Lionhearts are really nice but are voiced a little dark for me, the VC30 is a little brighter and as you say has more grunt. The Lionheart I have tried sounds great cranked but a little flat at lower volumes compared to the VC30 (although I'm comparing 112 with 210 speaker formats).
The Lionhearts look way nicer and feel better made but they are from the same camp tonally as the VC30's.
My favorite Laney is actually the VC15 which I owned briefly.
To be honest if you play only at home you won't notice much difference between 30 and 60W, either way you wont get the power stage working much.
I'd look at the VC15 or MJW (Martamp) for sopmething tonefull in the lower wattage ratings. Or even the new Vox AC4?
The Fender Champ XD's are nice too....
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^ agreed, the lionheart to me sounded like a "better" vc30 (though that wasn't head to head, just from memory). i thought the lionheart was nice, but a bit dear. a cornford would only be slightly more (granted, not as many bells and whistles, but still), and you could probably get a martamp/mjw for around the same money (which i haven't tried, but hear consistently great things about).
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Well the ones that I tried at the Manchester meet were definitely a cut aboive the Laney, I'm thinking perhaps Martin could make you something lower wattage for not that much more than a Lionheart?
From memory they had extra sweetness and grit in the top end compared to the Laney stuff. The 18 watter was great, lower noise also....
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Well the ones that I tried at the Manchester meet were definitely a cut aboive the Laney, I'm thinking perhaps Martin could make you something lower wattage for not that much more than a Lionheart?
From memory they had extra sweetness and grit in the top end compared to the Laney stuff. The 18 watter was great, lower noise also....
Damn you Tom! I've been trying to not think about selling my Lionheart and buyying an MJW!
EDIT - I recorded a little clip yesterday (apologies for posting this again) of the Laney with an Apached strat - playing needs to be smoothed out a little:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UNqdpp6NE4&feature=channel_page
The clean volume was on 3, bass on 8, mid on 2 and treble on 9. Bright switch was off, tone level was all the way up and there was a little reverb. I've played around with the settings a bit more today and dropped the bass down to 4. It now sounds less bassy/dark than it does in the vid.
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If you want an amp for home use only, it must be worth considering some tiny amps with 1 watt (or less) settings, or maybe something with power scaling. Even 5 watts can be hellaciously loud in a house or flat.
I haven't got any specific suggestions I'm afraid, just throwing the idea in.
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yeah, that's true, 5 watts is still very loud, especially in a home environment. :)
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I was speaking to Martin the other day about a 1W Roadstar he has in the works, not sure if I'm allowed to say that he didn't say it was a secret ;P
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How about the new Vox AC4TV? Looks pretty nice and can be scaled down to a quarter watt - http://www.voxamps.com/us/modernclassic/ac4tv/
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I was speaking to Martin the other day about a 1W Roadstar he has in the works, not sure if I'm allowed to say that he didn't say it was a secret ;P
I'm pretty sure it's been mentioned somewhere on the forum before. Unless I dreamt it.
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Well the ones that I tried at the Manchester meet were definitely a cut aboive the Laney, I'm thinking perhaps Martin could make you something lower wattage for not that much more than a Lionheart?
From memory they had extra sweetness and grit in the top end compared to the Laney stuff. The 18 watter was great, lower noise also....
Damn you Tom! I've been trying to not think about selling my Lionheart and buyying an MJW!
EDIT - I recorded a little clip yesterday (apologies for posting this again) of the Laney with an Apached strat - playing needs to be smoothed out a little:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UNqdpp6NE4&feature=channel_page
The clean volume was on 3, bass on 8, mid on 2 and treble on 9. Bright switch was off, tone level was all the way up and there was a little reverb. I've played around with the settings a bit more today and dropped the bass down to 4. It now sounds less bassy/dark than it does in the vid.
Damn you Ian, now I want Apaches instead of my Irish Tours!
Really nice sound there, the one I played was pretty new so maybe the speaker needed breaking in a bit, I've heard the G12H's need a good break in.....The Jensens in my VC30 are well and trully broken in.
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Damn you Ian, now I want Apaches instead of my Irish Tours!
Really nice sound there, the one I played was pretty new so maybe the speaker needed breaking in a bit, I've heard the G12H's need a good break in.....The Jensens in my VC30 are well and trully broken in.
:D I had recently considered switching the Apaches for Irish Tours as well! I've had the Laney for a while now, it gets used for about 5 hours a week but not at high volumes. I've only really cranked it in studios or at practice with my ex-band.
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Thanks guys! :D
Well......volume is important. Yes 30W is loud, and 5W will be nearly so (if things are to be believed), but I don't really want to drop down to 1W or less. I want the grunt to make the walls shake a little for when I'm pissed off, and I would still like something that I can take out if I get the option to.
I also want 2 channels. I love the sound of the Cornfords, but I'm not prepared to go totally boutique and have only one sound......seems pointless to then have to buy an overdrive pedal or something similar if I want to go from clean to dirty. I would rather have 2 channels built into the one amp as that way I get the cleans and the drive that the manufacturer designed. Bells and whistles is important, as I do like to play everything from the cleanest cleans through to hard rock.......I don't want a one trick pony to be brutally honest.
I only need something that works well with humbuckers as the only guitar I have with anything approaching a single coil is my Legra MG602 with its coil tapped Riff Raffs. 8)
And don't worry about Fender amps. I've never played one that I like.......the cleans are superb yes - but they're far too damn trebbly elsewhere. You're talking to a man who used to have a 100W Marshall head and a 4X12! That's the kinda sound I've always gone for.
Going to have a look at MJW amps now though.
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I know you said no pedals but as posted elsewhere I just bought an Ac4TV with a Blackstar HTdist (although initially they gave me a HTdistX) pedal - where the AC4 drops off the HT picks up it gives a huge range of flexibility. (for those people that said the AC4 can't do really metally metal it can with a little help from the HT whether it should or not for such a cute amp is another matter). The base tone on the Vox is great and the 1/4W means you can toggle between clean and gutsy by just flippin the switch and twistin the volume. With the pedal of course it's even better.
I also think you should listen to the blackstar HT5 stack (wife has the combo and it's really cool).
Just for info I compared these to the Fender Superchamp XD, Pro Junior, Junior blues and Orange Tiny Terror combo
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You'll have to post some clips up Bradock. For a person who was considering the purchase of their first guitar at the start of the month you sound like an expert already.
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I am an expert at listening to tone and sounds I have been a hifi buff for over 20 years with a decent vinyl system although I had a friend with a system close to £100k which did sound amazing but he not in the UK anymore.
Here http://www.rockporttechnologies.com/ you can see his TT look up Hall of fame - System II sirius
He had two of these amps they are 21" deep http://www.audioreview.com/mfr/krell/amplifiers/ksa-200/PRD_408410_1583crx.aspx
Although having listened some more at home I was thinking wow that distorion kicks in fast and I just realised we demmed a HTdist but they have given me a HTdistX whicj is probably a little over the top for me.
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:roll:
Let's get this back on topic. My opinion on this is to go for a low powered valve amp. I am fond of my Laney Lionheart - you can get a second hand one at a reasonable price, they're not too loud unless oyu really crank them and they take pedals well. I would sell the Marsall and use money from that to fund the Laney. Just my opinion of course and I'm no expert in tone and sound.
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I am an expert at listening to tone and sounds I have been a hifi buff for over 20 years with a decent vinyl system although I had a friend with a system close to £100k which did sound amazing but he not in the UK anymore.
Here http://www.rockporttechnologies.com/ you can see his TT look up Hall of fame - System II sirius
He had two of these amps they are 21" deep http://www.audioreview.com/mfr/krell/amplifiers/ksa-200/PRD_408410_1583crx.aspx
Although having listened some more at home I was thinking wow that distorion kicks in fast and I just realised we demmed a HTdist but they have given me a HTdistX whicj is probably a little over the top for me.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:
Has the Cornford Harlequin been suggested yet? It's not my cup of tea but plenty of players swear by them.
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Ok back on Topic - considering there was an issue with an amp that was £70 more than a Laney VC30 isn't the Cornford a little rich in this company.
When I looked and spoke to people about the LC and VC30 I was told they are great amps but can be a little flakey and some heating problems this put me off.
The other advice I would give is take a friend who can also play or in my case who can play !! :lol:
I lecture on the ear auditory responses and the physics of sound and the cognitive process for subtle details and character depends to some extent on devoting your mind to the task. So you will "hear" better if you are just listening, of course you should play as well but when you get down to the last two or three have someone else play and just listen and tweak it also really does help if you close your eyes but only do that if all those around you can be trusted or who knows what may befall you. If possible try to get dems off the weekend when shops are quieter.
:roll:
I'm no expert in tone and sound.
I never said I was an expert in tone and sounds I said I was expert at listening to them which means I know how to listen and what to listen for. Sorry for being so pedantic but if your injecting a little sarcasm then its good to get it right :)
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Harlequins regularly pop up on ebay for 400 8)
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You'll have to post some clips up Bradock. For a person who was considering the purchase of their first guitar at the start of the month you sound like an expert already.
That's a bit out of order, you don't need 6 years of playing experience to turn a few knobs and see how gainy a rig can and can't get.
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I never said I was an expert in tone and sounds I said I was expert at listening to them which means I know how to listen and what to listen for. Sorry for being so pedantic but if your injecting a little sarcasm then its good to get it right :)
Yes - there was a little sarcasm in my response. I have no trouble with pedanticism as detail is important. I guess my sarcasm was due to being a little jaded with almost constant reminders and hints that you are an expert in tone and sound etc. I get the picture (or should that be sound :)) Sometimes I feel a little humility goes a very long way. Apologies if this offends, it isn't intended to - the strength of the forum is about having a good cross section of people on it but with a like minded attitude to all things guitar (apart from Teles).
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You'll have to post some clips up Bradock. For a person who was considering the purchase of their first guitar at the start of the month you sound like an expert already.
That's a bit out of order, you don't need 6 years of playing experience to turn a few knobs and see how gainy a rig can and can't get.
Apologies - it's late and I've had a pretty bad day. I agree with your comment entirely.
EDIT - that should read I had a pretty bad yesterday.
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We're all up late tonight! :lol:
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I used to play MMRPGs with ameicans till the wee small hours this isn't late yet!
I am sorry I really don't want to come across as a blowhard I am aware that I am new to the forums and people know little about me I generally post on three grounds either I feel I have specific knowledge or I am posting as devils advocate which may mean I post something controvercial which I don't necessarily even agree with or I try to post from humour.
If my post based on experience is questioned then I do try to support it with background information as to my qualification or experience to post on the issue. This seems to be comming across as " ^&&*%$ does this guy need the daylight with so much sun shining from his a**".
Spending several hundred pounds on a second hand valve amp can be a dodgy business and if you are risk averse I wouldn't advise it unless you are handy with a soldering iron or know a good tech. It's easy to get your fingers burned (pun intended).
and we are off topic again.
NB. Sorry to hear you had a bad day Ian lets hope today is a lot better for you 8)
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mmorpgs=satan :D :D
Buying used amps is fine! :)
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Lew reply to this and grats on 500 posts.
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mmorpgs=satan :D :D
I had to look this up for it's meaning. I now understand - well, sort of. I've never been on one (or whatever the term for being on one is called)
And yes, you can get a S/H Harlequin for pretty good money - back on thread!
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I would never admit to having played mmorpgs :P
There are so many bargains out there at the mo due to the economy, there was a Soldano Hotrod for 600 in the back of Guitarist recently!! Make sure you take your time and shop around.
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Ok back on Topic - considering there was an issue with an amp that was £70 more than a Laney VC30 isn't the Cornford a little rich in this company.
When I looked and spoke to people about the LC and VC30 I was told they are great amps but can be a little flakey and some heating problems this put me off.
The other advice I would give is take a friend who can also play or in my case who can play !! :lol:
I lecture on the ear auditory responses and the physics of sound and the cognitive process for subtle details and character depends to some extent on devoting your mind to the task. So you will "hear" better if you are just listening, of course you should play as well but when you get down to the last two or three have someone else play and just listen and tweak it also really does help if you close your eyes but only do that if all those around you can be trusted or who knows what may befall you. If possible try to get dems off the weekend when shops are quieter.
:roll:
I'm no expert in tone and sound.
I never said I was an expert in tone and sounds I said I was expert at listening to them which means I know how to listen and what to listen for. Sorry for being so pedantic but if your injecting a little sarcasm then its good to get it right :)
I've had 2 VC30's over the years (always seem to get one when I need to free up some cash!) and never had a problem. The first was gigged extensively at pretty much full volume and the second well gigged also. Never had a major problem other than the odd valve which is par for the course. Plus they come with a 5 year Warranty so In my experience they are definitely not flakey.
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Five year warranty implies they probably had problems in the past that are now fixed it is a common reaction from firms sufforing with bad rep, as it shows they are confident everything is fixed now. If it wasn't they would go out of business fast fixing returns. If they honour that warranty for gigging as well then that's pretty cool.
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Five year warranty implies they probably had problems in the past
And this is based on what exactly? Zvex have a lifetime warranty on all of their handpainted products and I rather suspect that this isn't due to historical problems. Surely warranties are included as manufacturers have great confidence in their products. Maybe I'm being naive but I don't think I am.
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Laney have been going 42 years so they must be doing something right.
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My VC30 ( bought off ebay and therefore history a little unknown) has proved to be dependable and great sounding. In fact, only last night I had a grizzled old rocker telling me I had the best Strat tone he'd heard for ages and had a look over my rig.The VC has a bit to play in that I think ( along with superb BKP's of course).
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5 year warranties are pretty much industry standard for guitar valve amps (Fender, Marshall, Laney, Crate etc) - I don't think its anything to with production issues.
Of course, the warranties are all void if you mod the amp; is there anyone here who doesn't mod their amps? Mine go under the soldering iron on the first day.
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I havent modded any amp I own. Mostly because I think I'd end up killing myself with all the dangerous currents in there..
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Of course, the warranties are all void if you mod the amp; is there anyone here who doesn't mod their amps? Mine go under the soldering iron on the first day.
I mod all my guitars, but never touched an amp, except to put wheels on it!
Guitars have, at most, 4 pots and a switch, I can cope with that. But amps are a lot more complicated.... and I wouldn't even know what I was trying to achieve.
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Yup sorry that came across as wrong I should have said that 'if they had problems in the past ....... ' As I said earlier this was hearsay but it did put me off.
Some companies are great then go through bad patches due to a change in production technique, location or cost cutting.
Seems I was misguided and shoulda tried them out lotta happy users here.
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Nice to see I have a started a good ol' discussion on here.
The one thing I did manage to get out of my time playing the VC-30's was the fact that the single 12" Celestion definately had more of the 'quack' that I like over the twin 10" Jensens. That alone makes me happier to consider the Lionheart as it's only available with a 12" Celestion. Obviously my ears have become attuned to 12" Celestions over the years :D I know we've got into some deep discussion here about tone produced from various appliances, but my 10 pennorth is that sadly everybodies ears are going to be different. I'm a Bass Baritone opera singer, and tone and penetration is what I live for, because with opera singing you have to do it all with the voice as you have no microphones to help the voice. This means that everything is heavilly technique dependant as you have to be able to place the voice in the right areas to get the resonance that will carry straight off the stage, over an orchestra and out into the audience. You have to be able to hear this tone and resonance, as well as feel it, but it doesn't mean that the sound I produce is music to everyones ears. You will always get those people who prefer the edgier sound of a tenor over the larger sound of a Baritone, which is almost like the difference between a Stratocaster and a Les Paul. I know that trully I'm the only person who can identify what I want in an amp, but it is superb to get the valued opinon of you good people who at the very least all have Barekuckle humbuckers like me,
The Cornford Harlequin looks like a nice beastie from the on-line reviews I've seen of it, but is it just me missing something or does it not have a second channel? I really don't want to go down the line of paying out £400+ for a secondhand Cornford, only to have to then throw out another £100 for one of those excellent Blackstar footpedals. Maybe though I need to re-think my attitude to footpedals. I only really have my Jim Dunlop Crybaby.......and then a couple of little chorus and delay pedals that I pull out every now and then for silly noodling, but which spend most of their time tucked away in my guitar cupboard so that the wife doesn't trip over them!
Anyway.....enough mindless rambling
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Consider the Blackstar HT-5 head with a 1x12 cab. The cleans can't match the Matamp Minimat I used to have, but then neither could the Minimat do a surprisingly realistic impression of a really small Mesa Rectifier. Versitile little thing that IMO, is a complete bargain at a little over £200.
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the cheaper and/or smaller cornfords only have one channel. if you can switch from clean to dirty with your guitar volume control, it should be ok (or if you use a cleanish boost or something), but if you definitely need two channels, then it's probably not going to cut it. and if you need to go from pristine cleans to br00talz, again that's not going to happen with just the volume control, most likely.
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I've used single channel amps for so long now that it's a non issue but I do remember first thinking that it may be restrictive and in some situations I suppose it can be.