Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: marmoset on November 12, 2005, 01:44:32 PM
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Hello everyone!
This is my first post on this forum, but I've been reading it for a while now. I'm looking to upgrade the pickups on my H-S-H Cort X-6, which has a basswood body, maple neck and rosewood fretboard. It has a licensed Floyd Rose. My amp is a Line 6 spider 30, but I go to a practice room with my band, where there are lots of good amps, so I have a wide choice.
I started electric guitar three months ago, but have been playing classical guitar for four years before, playing Gavottes and things like that, and I'm grade 5.
Here is a list of the sounds I'd like to get, in order of importance.
1) Iron maiden (by far my favourite sound)
2) Rammstein, Judas Priest
3) Dream Theater and Metallica, as well as some punkier stuff like Alkaline Trio.
With my band I play lighter stuff like The Strokes, but I'm not too worried about nailing that tone.
Cleans are also important, so at least one pickup I choose has to have a decent clean sound. I play a range of metal, as well as some hard rock. I'd like a really nice palm muted sound. I'd like my guitar to respond to changes of picking strength, and to vibrato and stuff.
Thanks for helping,
mole
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Hi,welcome to the forum.
This sounds like a job for the Nailbomb,great cleans, gets really aggressive if needed and has a great tone.Does classic and modern rock with ease.Check out the players room.
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haha - welcome welcome man.
I was thinking the same thing - but i didnt want to say it, because the Nailbomb seems to be the right pup for the job for everyone lately - and i didnt wanna seem like i was telling everyone the same thing... :P
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Welcome!
What Steve and Indy said. The Nailbomb is great for what you want and work excellent with your type of guitar.
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Chalk up another vote for Nailbomb's then.
Do you want to keep the single coil? Maybe a Trilogy or something to go with the Nailbomb's. Don't know too much about single coils though.
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Welcome to the forum!
My only concern would be whether the Nailbomb will capture that classic Maiden sound. I'm able to get it with a VHII. Has anyone tried a more old school type tone with the Nailbomb? As the name implies, it has a really rich distortion characteristic, and fat bottom, that I don't associate with the NWOBHM tone. Maiden's tone was like a slightly more gainy version of Thin Lizzy, imo.
As for the Dream Theater/Rammstein style, the Nailbomb is probably the best choice.
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Might be worth also looking at the new Rebel yell pickup that Tim and Steve Stevens are working on or the revised version of the Holy Diver.
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what about the new painkiller (for bridge), out after christmas? it's supposed to be aimed at that NWOBHM sound...
would you be willing to just use your middle single coil for cleans, or do you want to be able to get neck humbucker cleans too?
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I also think the nailbomb would be best for stuff like the Alkaline Trio. I know the stock pups in my SG do a good trio sound. Which are basically a hot PAF pickup.
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I also think the nailbomb would be best for stuff like the Alkaline Trio. I know the stock pups in my SG do a good trio sound. Which are basically a hot PAF pickup.
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+1 for Painkiller on the bridge. If you're up for those maiden-tones, you're more likely to get closer with the killer, from the description. But the wait's two months, if you can bear it.
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The painkiller sounds really good. Does it have a tight bass? Because I quite like palm muted sounds.
I was kinda hoping to get it around christmas time, but I'm sure it will be worth the wait. Is there a definite release date?
And could someone describe the new Painkiller's tone please? I think I've been living under a rock, but I don't know what sort of sound it will have (bass, mids, etc).
EDIT - Oh yes, and what's the output of the Painkiller like, compared to say the VHII and other BKP's
Thanks for helping!
mole
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The Painkillers are still in development. Only Tim and his evil henchmen know the exact details and specs.
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I was gonna say nailbombs because they're a very versatile pick up, but after reading the posts i'm stumped, best people to ask would be Tim and his homies :wink:
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I'd have said nailbomb too :wink: I want to see Ben try a Nailbomb - he seems to be all against them, whilst everybody else loves them.
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The Painkiller has not definate release date yet, It is still in the road testing stages.
For a good all rounder I would go for a Warpig, Its got a killer palm muted sound, is very responsive and has a good clean tone.
For Rammstein tones the Miracle Man would be good it has a tighter bass, more highs and smoother mids. But the disadvantege is it wouldnt clean up so well.
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For a good all rounder I would go for a Warpig, Its got a killer palm muted sound, is very responsive and has a good clean tone.
I though the Nailbomb was supposed to be the "all rounder"? Not that I mind hearing the Warpir is a good all-rounder! My heart always sings "'Pig! 'Pig!" to me, though I get cold feet whenever someone describes it as a "modern metal" pickup. I'm not sure I've heard whatever modern metal is when its at home -- not recently anyway ;). Is the 'Pig too extreme? Should I back off from that level of output? But then y'all come back round and talk about the great cleans, great playability -- even the great versatility (reminding me of Ratrod's Rockabilly Warpig clip :)). And I get all warm'n'fuzzy toward the 'Pig again, reminding myself that, in the end, there is nothing better than playing a power chord that sounds like somebody just dropped a planet. :twisted:
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Didn't someone say somewhere that jazzers where starting to use warpigs in their guitars?
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In parallel for the neck position.
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The warpig is VERY versatile. In the ten minutes of time i've had playing one, i covered everything from bluegrass to modern metal. If you ever don't need the output yu can always just roll back the volume - it'll still sound awesome
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The warpig is VERY versatile. In the ten minutes of time i've had playing one, i covered everything from bluegrass to modern metal. If you ever don't need the output yu can always just roll back the volume - it'll still sound awesome
Ah, I love hearing what I want to hear :)
So, do folks reckon an Abraxas in the neck would keep up with a Warpig bridge? I love Santana-style neck tones, and have been jonesin' for a neck pickup voiced for just that sort of thing, so I feel good about an Abraxas in the neck. But equally, I love to unleash the power chug of doom from the bridge (while still being able to sprinkle out pretty clean tones for that light/shade thing). I guess if folks have had success with the Mule/'Pig combo, an Abraxas/'Pig combo oughta work even better (thanks to the Abraxas being even hotter than the Mule).
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The Abraxas would be the best bet if you want to match it with a Warpig.The Mule may drop a bit in volume going from the Pig.
Abraxas still does a great clean tone!Just turn the volume down.
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I've worried that the Warpig would be too supersaturated, and that dialing back to the Nailbomb be more workable (I've little doubt that a neck Abraxas would keep up fine with a bridge NB).
In any case, my main thing with the bridge is that my stock 498T has always felt kinda muddy or blurry, at least when the gain ramps up. I've always want to feel more string definition at gain (though without going to Ceramicland -- Alnico is where I wan t. Any BKP will have more life to it than the stocks, but I wonder whether the 'Pig would have better definition than the Nailbomb or whether the 'Pig would simply be overkill ....
(But what am I thinking? Overkill must be good, surely?! :twisted: )
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When I was looking for new pickups, I mentioned to Tim that I wanted pickups that could do AC/DC and Mansun type overdriven sounds but still have the Rammstein sound. He recommended the Nailbombs to me which I then bought. I was originally thinking of the warpigs but I'm glad I listened to Tim's advice. I think the warpigs aren't clean enough to do really high gain stuff without getting messy, although I love the custom covers.
Even though everybody in modern metal seems to be using EMG's, I'm convinced the Dual Rectifier is more important than the pickups. Also I've had it on good authority than the EMGs are a one trick pony (unlike the Nailbombs), and don't work well with tubescreamers and fuzz pedals. Having said that David Gilmour uses them and he has a nice sound.</rant>
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Even though everybody in modern metal seems to be using EMG's, I'm convinced the Dual Rectifier is more important than the pickups. Also I've had it on good authority than the EMGs are a one trick pony (unlike the Nailbombs), and don't work well with tubescreamers and fuzz pedals. Having said that David Gilmour uses them and he has a nice sound.</rant>
i totally agree, i'm a regular in a couple of other forums and it's depressing how many kids seem to think having the same pickups as their idols will make them sound the same, and they forget that they're using rectos while they have a marshall mg practice amp (MDV knows what I'm talking about ;) )
first get the amp, THEN get great pickups! And EMG's sound best through something like a recto anyway...
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I'm presuming these are the same sort of kids who give 10/10 on Harmony Central to their first 10 watt amp even if they haven't heard any others? They are probably the sort of people my friend calls "fashion metal".
Totally agree with the statement about amp first. The trouble is many of them don't understand that valve amps still are used by the majority of professionals (excluding Dimebag RIP). I can see the point in modelling amps for practice amps, but it will never be as good as the real thing.
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The warpig is VERY versatile. In the ten minutes of time i've had playing one, i covered everything from bluegrass to modern metal. If you ever don't need the output yu can always just roll back the volume - it'll still sound awesome
Ah, I love hearing what I want to hear :)
So, do folks reckon an Abraxas in the neck would keep up with a Warpig bridge? I love Santana-style neck tones, and have been jonesin' for a neck pickup voiced for just that sort of thing, so I feel good about an Abraxas in the neck. But equally, I love to unleash the power chug of doom from the bridge (while still being able to sprinkle out pretty clean tones for that light/shade thing). I guess if folks have had success with the Mule/'Pig combo, an Abraxas/'Pig combo oughta work even better (thanks to the Abraxas being even hotter than the Mule).
Why not just the Abraxas set! :)
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When I was looking for new pickups, I mentioned to Tim that I wanted pickups that could do AC/DC and Mansun type overdriven sounds but still have the Rammstein sound. He recommended the Nailbombs to me which I then bought. I was originally thinking of the warpigs but I'm glad I listened to Tim's advice. I think the warpigs aren't clean enough to do really high gain stuff without getting messy, although I love the custom covers.
Even though everybody in modern metal seems to be using EMG's, I'm convinced the Dual Rectifier is more important than the pickups. Also I've had it on good authority than the EMGs are a one trick pony (unlike the Nailbombs), and don't work well with tubescreamers and fuzz pedals. Having said that David Gilmour uses them and he has a nice sound.</rant>
The Warpigs cope very well under a lot of distortion, Ive got a set in an RG. They retain their clarity very well... thats what they are designed for!
I wouldn't say your amp is more important, afterall if you've got a top of the range amp and bad Pickups you are still just amplifing a poor signal.
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Would the Nailbombs be more suited to high gain though? I'm getting a new guitar and want another set, but trying to decide what to buy. The guitar is one of the Gordon Smith Graduate models, and I'm going to have the pickups delivered to their factory. The guitar is mahogany so I'm after something with bass weight but doesn't get lost in the mix.
My thing about buying a decent amp was really about not having a bad amp but expecting a good guitar to sound good through it, although I agree that bad pickups wouldn't help - thats why I am here!
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The Warpig has more output so has more saturation to start with, The Nailbomb handles it very well too. The nailbomb has a very organic open tone where as the Warpig is more compressed.
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[I wouldn't say your amp is more important, afterall if you've got a top of the range amp and bad Pickups you are still just amplifing a poor signal.
i didn't mean pickups weren't important ;) what you ideally want is a kickass amp coupled with a kickass guitar coupled with kickass pickups (and kickass fx too!) ;)
i just mean all these kids see their idols playing emg's through rectos, and wonder why emg's through their fender frontmen (frontmans?) practice amps still sound like cr@p
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hell yeah, dave!
But steves right in this case. Me and dave see alot of n00bs in other forums that are trying to perfect their sound through MGs and such with new pickups. We keep having to tell them the amp makes more difference, by far.
But I think if Mr threadstarter feels that the tone he needs is in his amp somewhere already, then the pickups become the bottlneck, and its time for some different ones!
I can vouch for the Pig all the way. For basically anything. Its super-high gain sound isnt the most saturated around by some way (for example I just got a Kramer Imperial, purely for the looks, love that tread plate, and the quad rail HBs are psychotic, more saturated than the pig by quite a bit). Its very clear and articulate. You back the volume off and it almost sounds like a different pickup, its got great sounds right back to just-barely-on. Great cleans. The best I have, and have heard in person from any humbucker.
You could always, of course, just play at a lower gain :wink: .
I have a sudden craving to try my miracle man....not here yet....hint hint :wink:
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^ i wasn't arguing wth steve, mark! I agreed with what he said! ;)
of course, if you already have a decent amp, new pickups is the next thing to get ! (and they won't hurt through a cr@ppy amp either, just don't expect emg's to make your mg sound like a recto!)
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Thanks!
I've narrowed it down to a nailbomb, warpig or miracle man (leaning towards the warpig), and I'll decide after I've considered a bit more.
And about my amp, I have a cheap Line 6 spider, but I go to a practice room with my band with lots of good amps so I get to try out lots. So, I plan to change my pickups and so get a nice tone at the practice room, then buy a new amp when I have a few more pennies.
Thanks again, you people are really super helpful :D .
mole
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Yeah dave, I saw that :wink: I couldve worded my post better. Quite a bit better. I was just reinforcing a point!
Marmoset: I havent tried the nailbomb but from what I've heard its quite plenty heavy. However if you need that "holy sh how heavy does that wanna be?!?!?!' sound every now and then, I know the pig delivers that, plus a whole range of other great sounds.
The MM is reputedly tighter, TIm says its even bassier and the mids are less, treble more, and its smoother sounding. I'd question the versatilty of a ceramic, though. Theres a clip of its clean in players, and its dammed impressive for a ceramic, but its not quite 'it', y'know? Still a litte sterile. I reserve full judgment on it till mine gets here, though.
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mark: meh, my original post that caused th "argument" was pretty feebly worded to be honest, and gave th impression that i thought pickups weren't important (nothing could be further from the truth! ;) ), so it was my fault. sorry!
anyway, i can't WAIT to hear what you think of the MM versus WP, mark! keep us posted!
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The Warpig has more output so has more saturation to start with, The Nailbomb handles it very well too. The nailbomb has a very organic open tone where as the Warpig is more compressed.
Would you suggest the Nailbomb as opposed to the Miracle Man pickup then? I know the Nailbombs are very open sounding, and it was just a soundclip that steered me away from the Warpig.
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The Miracle Man has a very tight bottom end, more highs and smoother mids.
The Nailbomb is very different, way more versitle.
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Why not just the Abraxas set! :)
Well, I've thought of that ;). What I really want is to load my LP with Pigs and to have another PRS-type guitar to load with Abraxases (and a Tele for some Country Boys or something :)). But at present I only have the LP, and I'm not in a situation to get a load more guitars anytime soon, so I want the LP tricked out to cover as well as possible my favorite bases: power chords of doom, Santana-esqe neck leads, and nice organic cleans. I'm pretty sure the Abraxas will work well in the neck, and it's very unlikely to be worse than what I got in the bridge ;). The only question is whether a Nailbomb or Warpig would work better for me in the bridge. Haven't heard any clips of the Abraxas playing detuned sabbathoid chug yet :)
And of course someday, when I've got a pile of guitars, I can just get more BKPs and redistribute them appropriately :)
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But steves right in this case. Me and dave see alot of n00bs in other forums that are trying to perfect their sound through MGs and such with new pickups. We keep having to tell them the amp makes more difference, by far.
That makes perfect sense, though in my particular case a big kickass valve amp just isn't practical. Nevertheless, good pickups will, I think, sound better than OKish pickups even through a digital model.
I can vouch for the Pig all the way. For basically anything. [...] Its very clear and articulate. You back the volume off and it almost sounds like a different pickup, its got great sounds right back to just-barely-on. Great cleans. The best I have, and have heard in person from any humbucker. You could always, of course, just play at a lower gain :wink: .
Yeah, if people only talked about the 'Pig as a "modern metal" beast, I'd probably steer away -- but actually everyone talks about the fab playability on tap and the versatility. I don't really have a target or reference "artist's tone" that I'm aiming for. I just think my stock Gibsons don't have the vibe, definition, or guts that I would like to hear.
I keep thinking of the Warpig as maybe the "11" setting: you can be playing some blues-rock stuff and classic metal there and it's all good -- and when you reach for the chug to push you over the cliff, it's there! ;)
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Why not go for a small valve amp then? It'll sound delicious the lower the wattage is probably because yu'll be able to crank it further. plus it'd be cheaper
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Why not go for a small valve amp then? It'll sound delicious the lower the wattage is probably because yu'll be able to crank it further. plus it'd be cheaper
Well, space is very tight and there's not room in the "house" (which I think is literally smaller than my parents' garage!) for my combo as it is. Plus, I'd need to run it through a hotplate or something, silently into a cab model in any case, cause I can't really make any noise to speak of ;) And the last nail is we keep talking about moving to either North or South America in a year or two, and I dunno about schlepping a valve amp across a darned ocean. I'd need a very compact valve head that could handle UK and US current and a hotplate thingy to go with it. And a cab model anyway. So perhaps I'll wait on a proper amp until we're a bit more settled!
Pickups (and even guitars) are easier to move :)
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And the last nail is we keep talking about moving to either North or South America in a year or two, and I dunno about schlepping a valve amp across a darned ocean. I'd need a very compact valve head that could handle UK and US current and a hotplate thingy to go with it. And a cab model anyway. So perhaps I'll wait on a proper amp until we're a bit more settled!
Pickups (and even guitars) are easier to move :)
I just shipped a Marshall Silver Jubilee Combo and a Fender Princeton II from London to Hoboken, so I wouldn't worry about shipping. Take out the valves though and wrap them in bubble wrap. Since my amps were bought in England, they already had voltage selectors. So it was just put the valves back and crank them up!
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Why not just the Abraxas set! :)
Well, I've thought of that ;). What I really want is to load my LP with Pigs and to have another PRS-type guitar to load with Abraxases (and a Tele for some Country Boys or something :)). But at present I only have the LP, and I'm not in a situation to get a load more guitars anytime soon, so I want the LP tricked out to cover as well as possible my favorite bases: power chords of doom, Santana-esqe neck leads, and nice organic cleans. I'm pretty sure the Abraxas will work well in the neck, and it's very unlikely to be worse than what I got in the bridge ;). The only question is whether a Nailbomb or Warpig would work better for me in the bridge. Haven't heard any clips of the Abraxas playing detuned sabbathoid chug yet :)
And of course someday, when I've got a pile of guitars, I can just get more BKPs and redistribute them appropriately :)
What type of music/bands do you want to play in the bridge position?
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What type of music/bands do you want to play in the bridge position?
A question I've always had difficulty answering! I guess my vibe tends to run from reasonably traditional blues-rock, up through "stoner rock", to doom metal kinda stuff. (Not nu-metal ;) and not really death metal). I like classic guitar tones, though I always feel like "that sounded good, but the guitar should have been more crushingly heavy :twisted: ).
I always have difficulty separating style from guitar tone; like, I love old Sabbath, but don't really want Tony Iommi's tone from 1970. :) That said, I like the guitar sound on Iommi's two recent solo albums. I really like the guitar sounds on Bruce Dickinson's last two solo albums, too (though have slow and sloopy fingers, and am no shredder!).
I'm trying to think of bands where I really like the guitar sounds .... Kyuss and Cathedral and Down and whatever band Wino (Scott Weinrich) is playing in(OK, haven't heard anything new, but Spirit Caravan certainly held it up for me!). I like the two 90s albums I have from the Gathering .... On the somewhat less heavy side, I like Warren Haynes and Trey Anastasio .... I like Slash's tone better than most of his bands ;). And Santana is always great; I even love his recent sound, and could listen to "(Da Le) Yaleo" from Supernatural all day .... so go figure! :)
In the end, I've always found the stock 498T in my LP "good enough for the moment", but lacking definition and low-end ooomph. It gets even flabbier and muddier when you tune down, and I'm almost always tuned down to D, sometimes C. I like the vibe of the Abraxas neck for getting towards those gainy but smooth "woman" tones on solos, and want to peel off riffs of doom and silly harmonics from the bridge :). If I had two humbucker guitars, I'd probably put an Abraxas set in one and a Warpig set in the other and think no more about it, but I've never been quite sure how to balance things in my single LP Std.
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Which pickup would be best for Rammstein's tone on Mutter? I like the sounds particularly on sonne and mutter(the title track).
thanks
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For Mutter era I'd go for the Miracle Man, it’s got tight bass and plenty of highs. I love Rammsteins tone, Mutter especially. I play allot of Rammstein and I use Warpigs, but I feel that the high end doesn't cut through enough to get their tone exactly. The Miracle man would do this alot better.
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Excellent! I think I'll go for the miracle man, since I really like the tone on mutter.
How soon would I have to order if I wanted to get it before Christmas? (I need to consider more, and may well change my mind which one to get, or I might restore an old banjo instead, who knows :? )
And can you do the miracle man or warpig in that lovely burnt chrome?
Thanks again to every one for being helpful.
mole
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I've just ordered my set of Miracle Man's as well, although it will be at least 4 months until I get to hear them as I'm having them sent to the company who are making my guitar.
This forum is such a good idea as it's helped me decide on the model I want without really bothering Tim or Steve too much. It's good to hear what other people are buying as well.
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Burnt chrome can be done, give us a call or write it in the special instructions box when you order.Dont worry you'll get them before christmas if you order them now!