Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Tech => Topic started by: chrisheyes on November 23, 2005, 07:16:35 PM
-
I've just upgraded the volume and tone pots on my guitar, soldered the Trilloy's onto the pots and 5 way switch.
The volume pot doesn't appear to be doing any thing, but the mid tone pot is working as the volume, but only when the mid pickup is selected
I'm well confused, any suggestions ? :(
-
Start again!!
Sorry :D
-
Jee Thanks Hayden :wink:
It's a prewired harness, so I didn't start this mess :roll:
-
Huh...so you just installed the guard???!!
Check that there are no shorts happening when you put the guard on the guitar - shielding paint can cause issues iff it touches anything it shouldn't!
Does the selector work OK? - if it does take a look at the vol/tone pots.
hope that's a bit more helpful - if you'd done it yourself the easiest thing would be to go back over everything.....
-
Is it a pre wire that we have supplied? or did you just replace the pots and switch yourself?
-
Hmmmmmmmm i've found there is no resistance in the bridge pickup - It's totally dead :cry:
I'll have to eat humble pie and send the Sinner pickup back to Tim for re-winding
There was a short across the 5 way selector that was the ghost in the machine.
-
I take it your testing the bridge pup without the switch hooked up to it?
-
Steve-Mr Pig 2U
Is it a pre wire that we have supplied? or did you just replace the pots and switch yourself?
It's not a KNP prewired harness,it's from elswhere. The guitar is a '79 Tokai Silver Star, a '70 Style Strat copy. The pots and switches were scratchy and the jack plug intermittently failed. I decided to upgrade them to give full justice to the tone of the BKP Trillogy's previously installed.
HJM Posted:
I take it your testing the bridge pup without the switch hooked up to it?
That's correct. I got the multimeter out and started testing the circuits.
I found the short across the 5 way switch but also found that the brigde pickup was giving a reading of zero.
On closer inspection of the pickup I found that the very fine copper wire that goes round the bottom flat, through the hook up wire eyelet was frayed. I desoldered it from the harness / scratplate and tested the ends of the hook-up wires and found it to be dead.
Should the volume and tone pots touch the shielding foil. I had the wided the holes for the new pots, could this also have contributed to my tone / volume problems ?
Cheers for all the help supplied so far guys :)
-
There's obviously something amiss - have a look on this site re your question about the shielding foil, it shouldn't casue a problem as long as it's not touching the lugs.
http://www.guitarnuts.com/wiring/index.php
-
HJM
There's obviously something amiss - have a look on this site re your question about the shielding foil, it shouldn't casue a problem as long as it's not touching the lugs.
By 'lugs' do you mean the washer and nut that hold the scratchplate to the pot Hayden ?
-
No - the bits you solder to, sorry!
-
Cheers HJM - I get your drift now :D
-
can you post some pics of the electronics?
-
Will do HJM
I contacted the guy that made the harness for me and sent him some photo's of the electonics. He confirmed that he has made it up wrong :cry:
The ground wire between the volume pot and the middle pot went from the back of each of them. I should also be connected to one of the lugs on the volume pot. I've sorted that out but still get the following strange actions of the pots:-
The 5 way selector is working perfect, however I'm still not getting 1 volume and 2 tones.
Taking the convention that position 5 on the 5 way is the Neck Pickup and position 1 is the Bridge only, this is what happens
Position 5 - Volume pot working as a tone, Middle pot working as a Volume, Bottom Pot - nothing.
Position 4 - Volume pot working as a tone, Middle pot working as a Volume, Bottom Pot - working as a tone.
Position 3 - Volume pot working as a tone, Middle pot does nothing, Bottom Pot - working as a tone.
Position 2 - Volume pot working as a tone, Middle pot does nothing, Bottom Pot - working as a tone.
Position 1 - Volume pot working as a tone, Middle pot does nothing, Bottom Pot does nothing.
Any further ideas ?
Could it be I've wired the jack socket the wrong way round ?
I'm going insane here trying to track the fault down. Keeping taking the scatchplate in and out of the guitar with the strings still on has already cost me the Bridge Pickup - it's dead. I've sent it back to Tim for rewinding :(
-
I'd guess he's hooked the switch up wrong...sounds like a real mess! Pic would be easier!
-
Sorry it's taken so long to get the photos up, my camera batteries were flat.
General Views
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/Topview3.jpg)
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/TopView2.jpg)
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/TopView.jpg)
Volume pot connections
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/Volumepot.jpg)
Bottom Tone Pot Connection
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/BottomTone.jpg)
5 Way swtich Connections
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/5waytoneconnection.jpg)
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/5WayPickupConnection.jpg)
Middle Tone Pot Connections
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/BottomTone.jpg)
Jack Plug Connection
(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y78/chrisheyes/Jack.jpg)
Thanks for your assistance HJM :D
-
Everything looks good in those pictures apart from the pickup grounds (black wires) look a bit suspect. There seems to be a lot of exposed live wires to the switch too. Push the cloth cover closer to make sure they don't get pushed into a short.
-
First thing I've spotted - the tone cap is wrong. The two lugs of the tones need to be joined together, then the cap goes to ground, at the moment the cap is in between the two lugs. As it is you have the middle pot wired ike a second volume!
There's a nice clear diagram here
http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/I-3192.html
-
Dr HJM and Dr Phil King you have diagnosed the problem
Many many thanks chaps.
1. There must have be a cold joint on the back of the vulume pot
2. The tone capacitor did go to ground after on the middle tone pot, but again the joint was cold !!
Holy moly that took an age and almost my sanity.
I've put a Van Zandt Vintage Hot in the bridge until the Sinner comes back from Tim.
The guitar now has a whole new tonal dinemsion that the old wiring harness didn't allow.
-
Glad it is all working now. Cold joints can be a buggar (I am speaking from experience!).
-
Excellent...be interesting to hear what you think about the vintage hot vs the sinner!
-
Excellent...be interesting to hear what you think about the vintage hot vs the sinner!
The differece better the two is dramatic. The guitar now has output volume problems as the Trilogy pickups are not calibrated to work together with Van Zandt Vintage Hots.
The Vintage Hot has a lot more top end frequencies but cannot give the harmnic tones when driven hard like the Sinner can.
The Sinner gives the high output overdriven tone - The Van Zandt is a different animal altogether.
I can't wait for my Sinner to return.
With the new high quality components in the guitar the Sinner will deliver at it's best.