Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Tech => Topic started by: 7thSon on April 13, 2010, 10:53:57 PM
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Tried to fit a pair of BKP's today, but the screws i've got are too thin they don't grip the pickup legs hole.
Even the stock Epiphone screws from the pickup I took out which were a little wider, are still too thin and just pass through the hole.
Allparts have US thread (#3-48 x 1-1/4 inch) or 3mm metric, do I need one of those, or something else?
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The screws you got with the pickup don't work? That's odd :?
Is it a second hand pickup or a new one?
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You need #3-48 US thread screws, metric screws won't fit. Didn't the BKPs come with screws?
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Yep it's a 2nd hand set so I'm assuming a mistake on the sellers part (too long ago though so couldn't find the contact info for him).
I have another BKP with the same screws and springs though, but it has a much narrower hole which the screws will grip (and long legs).
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The screws from your "new" BKP don't fit, but they fit your "old" BKP? They should always be the same size.
Could someone have drilled out the holes in the legs in order to direct-mount the pickups on a body, without pickup rings? :?
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Oh that's weird then, I thought maybe there were different size options.
The wider holes are about 3mm compared to 2mm for the normal sized one. Also the flat part of the legs (where the hole is) are triangular shaped, compared to rectangular on the other one (the one with the narrow / normal sized hole).
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I reckon they've been made that way to fit in something like this:
(http://www.makenmusic.com/productImg/MusicMan_Axis_TransGold_G45439-frontbody.jpg)
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yeah, sounds like they have been modified for direct mounting - with the holes enlarged for the screw to go right through
in such cases you have two options - a) use a larger screw and retap the hole or b) fix the hole so its the appropriate size - the best way to fix it is to get a humbucker baseplate like this:
http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics,_pickups/Pickups:_Parts/Humbucker_Pickup_Parts/Humbucker_Baseplate.html
http://www.allparts.uk.com/online-shop/allparts-guitar-amp-parts/pickup-parts/humbucking-pickup-frame-vintage-style-p-3555.html
http://www.allparts.uk.com/online-shop/allparts-guitar-amp-parts/pickup-parts/humbucking-pickup-frame-short-legs-50mm-1-3132-inch-nickel-silver-p-15218.html
cut off the bottom bit of the legs from this new baseplate.. then solder it underneath your current modified leg
you could also replace the baseplate, which is easy to do but generally means the potting will need redoing - or send it back to BKP so you still ahve one with teh appropriate engraving
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in such cases you have two options - a) use a larger screw and retap the hole or b) fix the hole so its the appropriate size - the best way to fix it is to get a humbucker baseplate like this:
http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics,_pickups/Pickups:_Parts/Humbucker_Pickup_Parts/Humbucker_Baseplate.html
http://www.allparts.uk.com/online-shop/allparts-guitar-amp-parts/pickup-parts/humbucking-pickup-frame-vintage-style-p-3555.html
http://www.allparts.uk.com/online-shop/allparts-guitar-amp-parts/pickup-parts/humbucking-pickup-frame-short-legs-50mm-1-3132-inch-nickel-silver-p-15218.html
cut off the bottom bit of the legs from this new baseplate.. then solder it underneath your current modified leg
Sounds a good idea, I have a Lollar Firebird pickup which has the legs "mended" in a similar way.
I might have some #3-48 nuts which could maybe be used rather than buying a new pickup baseplate? I'll have a look later.
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yeah, just got a new lollar firebird pickup in and it has the same thing - i assume the baseplates jason uses are different to the screws he provides so alters them like this. I was surprised he didnt just get some baseplates made to the size he wants but this is still a perfectly fine way to do it
a nut will work well too, just make sure its attached underneath the leg, then even if the bond breaks the springs will hold everything in place
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I see, thanks guys.
Sounds like it would be easier using a nut than cutting a baseplate. Would I need solder the nut or just let the spring tension hold it together like you say? I've read about the mounting difficulties with springs flying all over the place!
Are 3-48 nuts available in places like B&Q? Out of interest what tool would one use to cut a baseplate?
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yeah, just got a new lollar firebird pickup in and it has the same thing - i assume the baseplates jason uses are different to the screws he provides so alters them like this. I was surprised he didnt just get some baseplates made to the size he wants but this is still a perfectly fine way to do it
I would guess he makes his Firebird and Minihumbucker pickups on the assumption that they'll be using an LP Deluxe style mounting, so he then has to mod them for ring/scratchplate mounting. I think it would be more sensible to have threaded feet as standard, then let the customer drill the holes out for an LP Deluxe. But who am I to question? :wink:
Sounds like it would be easier using a nut than cutting a baseplate. Would I need solder the nut or just let the spring tension hold it together like you say? I've read about the mounting difficulties with springs flying all over the place!
The nut would need to be held in place on the pickup foot, because otherwise it would tend to rotate as you turned the mounting screw (although friction would help).
A couple of drops of superglue might be enough, so long as you were careful not to get it inside the thread.
It might be tough to get #3-48 nuts in a UK DIY store, I think they mostly have metric stuff although I haven't really looked for specific sizes.
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yeah, best to fix the nut in place with something.
nickel silver base plates are quite soft though, so cutting them is pretty darn easy
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Are 3-48 nuts available in places like B&Q? Out of interest what tool would one use to cut a baseplate?
Always give B&Q and the like a wide birth as for screws/sandpaper etc they're right rip off merchants. Take the screw up your local hardward store and give it to the bloke behind the counter.
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Just had a look in my nuts & bolts box - haven't got any #3-48 nuts, sorry.
Found some on eBay though, the cheapest are about the same price as the humbucker baseplate Wez linked to, but this way you'd have spares:
http://shop.ebay.co.uk/i.html?_nkw=3-48+nut&LH_AvailTo=3 (http://shop.ebay.co.uk/i.html?_nkw=3-48+nut&LH_AvailTo=3)
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Cheers Philly. I ordered the baseplate from Allparts in the end, now that i've finally got round to installing the BKPs after 2 years I didn't fancy waiting for postage from the states! Actually arrived today which was a nice suprise, and I had no problem bending the bits off with some pliers. But in my retardation as I've just gone to solder them on now, I've just realised I only bought one baseplate!
As for the soldering, do I need to heat the legs, or does it not matter if the joint is cold as long as it sticks? Don't want to risk damaging the p'ups.
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As for the soldering, do I need to heat the legs, or does it not matter if the joint is cold as long as it sticks? Don't want to risk damaging the p'ups.
That's almost closer to metalwork than electronics, so I'm not sure of the best technique! :wink:
But, if I was going to try it.... I would think it'll work best if you get both surfaces good and hot - a powerful iron should heat it quickly so the body of the pickup doesn't overheat. Make sure there's no wax on the feet, roughen them with a bit of sandpaper, and tin both surfaces before putting them together then re-heating to join them.
Or maybe I'd just glue it.
Hopefully someone else can advise better.
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give both surfaces a light scr@pe or rub down with fine sand paper, shouldnt take a second or two to tin them with solder - try it on the seperate bits first or practice soldering to the scr@p baseplate. then when you get a feel for it do it for real
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if you REALLY want it to bond, you could solder the two bits of the baseplate together, then use an epoxy chemical weld like the Bondloc stuff available from Maplin for under a fiver...
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=46006&TabID=1&C=SO&U=strat25&doy=search&ma=Maplin%20Bondloc%20B2013%20Cheap%20Deals
This stuff is VERY strong when applied correctly and left to cure over 24 hours. I generally rough up the surface with rough-grade wet and dry (left dry). Heat the surface slightly, then apply the epoxy - the heat helps to make a stronger joint that cures faster. The patter on the back of the Bonloc tube gives simpler instructions, but the PDF on their site says that doing it the way I have done is best for the strongest joint. Practical experience has proved this to be correct too.
I would just pre-mix the stuff, then apply it right after doing the solder joints as there will still be a little bit of heat in the metal.
Personally, I would've sent it back to Tim - I've taken pickups apart before and its a right fanny on.
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lol I'll pass on the epoxy considering the immense difficulty I've had just trying to solder the new 'feet' onto the pickup (well, to the discarded baseplate, as a test run).
I'm supposed to flow the solder onto the feet and not heat it directly with the iron right? It took ages to heat up one of the 'feet' when I was trying to tin it, to the point that the solder melted on its own. About a minute or so, is that right?
I'm using a 40w weller iron (SP40L) with a chisel tip , I also have a 45w weller station (PS3D) with a pencil tip (TCP 3), though I couldn't figure out how to set it to max temperature, im guessing the setting is on the handle, but it wasnt marked so not sure which way is max.
In fact I couldn't even tin the chisel tip, the solder just runs off it? The pencil tip tins fine though.
The solder i'm using is this which I saw recommended on another post here: http://www.rapidonline.com/sku/Tools-Fasteners-Production-Equipment/Soldering-Equipment/Solder-Fluxes/Future-HF-low-melting-point-halide-free-no-clean-cored-solder/60030/85-6372
Is it alright to tear a bit of solder wire off the spindle and handle the solder it directly, as long as I wash my hands afterwards? Or how should I be holding it?
Also any tips on how you manage 3 things with 2 hands :lol:
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you can touch the solder and even inhale the odd fume - as long as its not something you do every day
cant help with 3 hands but when working in guitars the guitar is stationary so i move the iron and solder towards that. just have something tha holds the p-up ring stationary and move the other two bits towards that
and dont forget, you do always have the option of sending it in for a new baseplate as has been suggested. but i understand sometimes things need to be done quicker so these other methods come in usefull
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Couldn't afford to send it back to Tim, so the baseplate solution was a big help thanks guys.
In the end I didn't solder the broken-off baseplate bits to the existing baseplate legs, I tried that on one of the stock Epi pickups I took out and couldnt get the hang of it, probably fried that pickup. Superglue didn't hold either, so in the end I just held it with pliers and screwed them in. I set both pickups flush with the ring, if I need to make height adjustments to balance them, will adjusting the screw poles be enough?
I got the pickups in fine, but also put in new tone caps and I think i'm having a noise issue with them, as when I turn them up there's an increase in noise.
And when the tone cap is turned right down its completely noise free, but then if I move the volume pot through the middle of its sweep I can hear noise which peaks then lowers again when reaching the other end of the sweep (still a little when tone is on 10 tho). It happens on both pickups.
I had to use some extension wire from a friend for the ground and shield wires because they wouldn't reach the pots, not sure if its the correct wire or not, or if there's a reason not to join the ground and shield wire like that. Or maybe it's the way I've put the caps in? Or just dodgy soldering :lol: