Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: jonathanf on October 10, 2010, 08:46:39 AM
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Hello.
What 6-string guitar pickup would you recommend to suit my style. My guitar is an H/S/S alder body, maple neck, rosewood fretboard. I only want a humbucker, I play metalcore tuned to drop B and drop C(Parkway Drive, Killswitch Engage), so I need it to be very tight but not necessarily a ceramic magnet, I also play thrash metal(Metallica, Slayer) so It needs to sound just as good in E and I also play modern metal(All That Remains, As I Lay Dying, Trivium). I want to get the best sound possible but also not totally different from the bands sounds(but its not a big problem since I have a Pod X3, I play through headphones only but will be getting some studio monitors in a few months). Which pickup do you think would sound the best for my style but can also get quite close to bands sounds? I think I’ll look in to a Miracle Man, Ceramic Warpig, alnico warpig or ceramic nailbomb. Do the pickups come with all the pots needed?
Thanks.
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I'd pick the miracle man for pretty much all the bands you listed
any of BKP ceramic models will work, though
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Thanks, so it comes with all the pots needed right?
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Are there any diagrams, tutorials to install these pickups(being H/S/S, will it be different).
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bump
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Hi
If you buy it as a pre-wired gaurd then all pots will be included but if you wish to install them yourself you can buy pots off BKP too.
As for diagrams if you order online just request one in the comments box or if you order by phone ask the person talking to you.
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Thanks.
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Sorry for all the questions. Do BKP's run on 500k pots? I'll look on the website.
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Will I just need to get new pots(mine are 250k, I think)or do i need to other stuff, I mean I've got a 5-way switch, tone and volume knob and an input jack, so anything else? I guess the installation is gonna be really annoying.
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they all sounds good in E as well as in lower tunings... the only one able to sound downtuned even in E is the Pig, anyway! for me the MM is the less aggressive of the bunch, but Eric will argue for sure! :)
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Thanks, I'm pretty sure I'll get the miracle man but its all this installation thats the problem, I've read that you need to replace nearly all the electronics in the guitar, but I'm pretty sure only the pots need changing, my guitar is routed with passives, except the pots are 250k.
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Also, do you think I should pay for installation or do it myself. I mean, you just need to follow the instructions. :?
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Is the guitar already HSS? And you're replacing just an existing bridge humbucker?
If it works as is at the moment, you've already got pots/etc that will do a job, if not the job.
In that case, in your situation, I'd probably leave the wiring/pots as is at first and see what happens. If you do it that way, the wiring/soldering is not too difficult. Go slowly and methodically (only undo the wires that need undoing to take the old pickup out, make a note of where they went, etc).
If you're new to soldering, maybe practice a bit first, and get ready for burnt fingers! I learnt to solder inside guitars and never damaged anything. I tell a lie - make sure you protect the finish with old towels or something! You learn that pretty quickly - hot solder and soldering irons go through guitar finishes very easily, burnt fingers heal quite quickly, guitar finishes don't :lol:
I reckon you could do it, and you'll feel better for it. And, in the long run, learning to do this sort of thing yourself is loads cheaper. But, if you do decide to take it to someone, there's no shame in that either :D (the best would be if you know someone who knows about this stuff, and they're willing to do it while you watch).
Welcome to the forum :D
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for me the MM is the less aggressive of the bunch, but Eric will argue for sure! :)
:lol:
not gonna argue with that, but it's still the closest to those band tones
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Yeah, miracle man.
500k or bks 550k pots.
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@AndyR.
Yes, the guitar is already H/S/S(yamaha pacifica 112v limited edition)and I am only replacing the existing bridge humbucker. Yes, everything works but will 250k pots work fine?(actually, I might have 500k pots, dont know, but I think I have 250k pots).
Anaway, thanks A LOT.
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But can the miracle man work fine on 250k or will their be problems or it won't work?
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It will work, in that it will relay guitar-like sounds to the amp, but its not gonna sound like it should.
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So I guess I'll buy 2 bkp 550k pots(1 tone and 1 volume). Whats the difference between the 2 bkp 550k custom pots?
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Tim recommended a painkiller :? and for electronics:2 550k pots and a 0.022mfd capacitor and new jack socket. The guitar will also need to have an earth wire fitted from the bridge through to the wiring cavity.
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Then get what tim says.
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Yeah, but a lot of people say that a painkiller in alder is very bright, and as for electronics I'll probably just buy the pots. Can that capacitor thingy and other stuff make a big difference?
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Bank holiday today and tommorrow for spain.
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I looked in my guitar and it turns out that I have 2 500k pots. Can I use the pots again right or do I have to buy new ones? I'm getting a painkiller, they also run on 500k or 550k pots, right?
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The 500s will be fine. Or they're the right value at least. Cant tell the quality of the pots from here! 550s from BK are just supposed to add (or allow, rather) that little extra bit of cut and clarity from high output pickups.
As I said any pickup will WORK on 250k, 500k, 550k, 1M pots, its a question of how well matched they are. The higher the value of the pot, the brighter the sound, up to no pot at all and direct to jack wiring, which is the brightest, highest attack sound you can get out of a pickup.
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I don't know anything about electronics(I'm only 12) but do passive routed guitar all have a .022mfd capacitor or very similar at least.
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So wouldn't a painkiller be better anyway with 500 instead of 550 since their meant to be bright?
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Just stick with the cap thats in there for now. Theres no need to complicate things if youre a bit green to this. Dont worry about it for now.
Not all capacitor values are the same in all guitars, no. Very broadly speaking the higher the value of the capacitor the less high end the guitar will have and the more dramatic an effect lowering the tone control will have, because the capacitor takes high frequencies out of the sound.
When the tone control is on '10' or max or whatever then the tone control is in fact off, or as close to off as it can get, and the capacitor isnt having that much effect on the sound (it does still have an effect, just not much). Lowering the tone control routes some of the signal through the capacitor and cuts out some high end from the sound. (Though in reality some high end is lost from the existance of a tone control at all, but its not a very big deal and I wouldnt worry about it for now if I were you).
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So wouldn't a painkiller be better anyway with 500 instead of 550 since their meant to be bright?
I've used them before with 500s, and never 550s, so I cant say for sure.
If its too bright, but you like the overall voicing of it, then you can try changing the pots to 250.
BE CAREFULL though; if youre 12 and new to this then you want to read up on soldering technique, be uber-vigilant around the soldering iron, only do it while theres an adult with some at least modest experience with soldering irons around. They can burn you, they can set fire to stuff. Dont get paranoid and scared about it or anything, but do the job safely, carefully and responsibly. I'm all for kids learning practical skills, and I was using soldering irons at your age (with dad around), but if youre unsure at all, then get someone to do it for you.
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One more thing, miracle man vs painkiller or other recommendations.
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Tim says Painkiller, get a painkiller :)
I'm personally rather surprised he didn't say Miracle Man for this, but don't let that sway you at all: Tim knows his pickups better than anyone else on this planet. I always follow his advice when buying pickups!
Oh, and remember to take some pictures so we can all look at your lovely BKP-loaded axe when you're done! :)
Roo
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Unfortunately, it won't be totally BK-loaded until Christmas. Bridge pup now, 2 other single coils for Christmas.
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BTW, I've heard the painkiller is voiced a lot like an emg 81 but with more mids and a miracle man is voiced like an emg 85. Is this true? Because Tim recommended a painkiller and I love the emg 81, so.... I guess I'll love the painkiller.
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How much does it cost extra to customize a bkp?
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Actually, the ceramic nailbomb might be what I want, a bit darker than the PK and not so many mids, or am I wrong?
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BTW, I've heard the painkiller is voiced a lot like an emg 81 but with more mids and a miracle man is voiced like an emg 85. Is this true? Because Tim recommended a painkiller and I love the emg 81, so.... I guess I'll love the painkiller.
not really
the miracle man is less middy than both EMGs, more bass heavy than the 81, but not fat and middy like the 85
it sounds quite original, IMO
lead and rhythm tones are closer to the 81, but smoother and very organic
the painkiller has its own thing
more surgical picking response and it's middier than any pickup I've heard
mids are wild and more raw sounding
the miracle man sounds more modern and controlled
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On the PK/81, MM/85 thing
I've heard the MM-85 comparison; I dont agree personally. The MM is a sharper and smoother pickup, clearer top end by quite a long way, and as eric says, its less middy and the voicings and characters of the pickups are really very different. They feel really dissimilar to play through too, but thats quite hard to explain, and quite a personal style thing I suppose.
I've occasionally said that the PK is the MOST similar BK to an 81, but that doesnt really mean to say that they sound all that alike. 81s have a really, really strong pick attack and a high mid biased sound with very tight, but not terribly large bass response. The PK shares these characteristics, but its not as compressed and congested sounding, and is much more organic, and not quite as hot.
The C-Bomb is a little darker than a PK, with more low mids, less high mids, and the top end doesnt extend quite as far; its got a sweeter, smoother top end than a PK. It would get about as close to the darker, thicker, smoother more 'modern' sounds you want (like KSE for example), but would struggle with the crunchier, grinder old school thrash stuff (like slayer and pre AJFA metallica) compared to the PK.
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@eric and to everyone else. So would you suggest my final choice to be a miracle man then?
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@eric and to everyone else. So would you suggest my final choice to be a miracle man then?
NO
Buy a painkiller, like Tim suggested. He is not wrong. TRUST!
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OK!
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@MDV and everyone else. So, you think the PK can do a modern and thrash sound. You are all thinking just buy the PK already!
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Yes it can, very well indeed.
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I have a Schecter Blackjack with Painkillers, atm tuned to dropB. It suits the "more modern", but still agressive and brutal (meaning modern but not as smooth as bodylotion) sound perfectly, while it really brings out every single note! the amazing thing about the pu is, that it sound 10* better with a band than without, at least it seems to me (just like the "Marshall-phenomenon").
So, just to add my 2 cents to the canon:
Buy it :D
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How much darker is the ceramic nailbomb than the painkiller, a tiny bit, quite a bit or loads.
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How about this:1 guitar with emgs to get the bands sounds and 1 guitar with a C-bomb for a unique sound. Pretty cool, huh?
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Seriously, just buy the painkiller and stop worrying about it! If I were to hazard a guess at the rate of Tim's suggestions being unsuitable (from reading the forums), I'd have to put it somewhere in the 0.1-0.5% range.
His suggestion for PK for your requirements is spot on. If you actually turn out not to be in the 999 out of 1000 category of happy punters, then you send the pickup back for a miracle man or ceramic nailbomb (Bareknuckle Pickups have EXCELLENT customer service!). But, here's the big one, you won't be unhappy with it. Just take that from us here who have all bought pickups with Tim's recommendations and been extremely happy with them.
IMHO, it's not worth you trying to second guess how the pickup will sound. When you have it in your guitar and playing through your amp, you'll find out. Anyone who tells you they know exactly how it will sound before hearing it is lying. We can tell you it will be awesome, and it will be able to nail the tones you mentioned, but that's as far as we can go, and as this is your first BKP, so you haven't yet had the delight of hearing one in your rig, you'll just have to trust Tim's and our advice on this one.
Now stop worrying about it, and buy it! We wanna see pics and hear clips! :)
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True!!!
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Seriously, just buy the painkiller and stop worrying about it! If I were to hazard a guess at the rate of Tim's suggestions being unsuitable (from reading the forums), I'd have to put it somewhere in the 0.1-0.5% range.
His suggestion for PK for your requirements is spot on. If you actually turn out not to be in the 999 out of 1000 category of happy punters, then you send the pickup back for a miracle man or ceramic nailbomb (Bareknuckle Pickups have EXCELLENT customer service!). But, here's the big one, you won't be unhappy with it. Just take that from us here who have all bought pickups with Tim's recommendations and been extremely happy with them.
IMHO, it's not worth you trying to second guess how the pickup will sound. When you have it in your guitar and playing through your amp, you'll find out. Anyone who tells you they know exactly how it will sound before hearing it is lying. We can tell you it will be awesome, and it will be able to nail the tones you mentioned, but that's as far as we can go, and as this is your first BKP, so you haven't yet had the delight of hearing one in your rig, you'll just have to trust Tim's and our advice on this one.
Now stop worrying about it, and buy it! We wanna see pics and hear clips! :)
Listen to this man, he speaks much truth :D
(Unless he starts lecturing you on telecasters, Sir Paul, and various other subjects close to his heart - feel free to ignore or abuse him strongly when he passes any comment on those :lol:)
Seriously though, what Roo says is absolutely "it" on choosing a first BKP.
We all know how you're feeling, we all went through it to some extent. It seems like a huge commitment, what if I choose the wrong one? I spent weeks worrying about it. I needn't have bothered...
Personally, I believe that for a first BKP, as long as someone doesn't go and pick a vintage when they know they want modern, as long as they pick one of the ones in the right ballpark... then their choice is going to be right no matter what they do on a first BKP - the minute you stick it in a guitar and hear the difference from the old pickup, you know it was the right decision.
And if you have a Tim recommendation as well, then it's a no brainer, that's the one to get.
You'll be fine :D
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I ignored tims recommendation once.
I ended up sending the pickups back to get a replacement. I got what he recommended, I used them for years.
Tims most recent recommendation for me has become my go-to favourite pickup.
Get the painkiller. Stop procrastinating.
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+1 to the above, Tim's recommendations are always (in my experience) spot on.