Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: Frank666 on December 11, 2010, 12:54:34 AM
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I play anything from blues to thrash metal, examples are gary moore for blues and mastodon for metal. I'm looking for a thick tone really, so far I'm thinking black dogs or maybe crawlers but not entirely sure. Cleans are not all that important for me, just a good thick tone. I'm playing through a jcm800 with an sd-1 overdrive if that adds anything
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Hi!!!
First time writing here....in the market for BKPs myself!
Did you listen to the Players section of the site? Bearing in mind the folks have different amps, effects, etc.,you might find a PU that you dig.... Miracle Mans or Cold Sweats? Best of luck!!!!
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It depends on whether you want to go for the organic tone of alnico's or the tightness of ceramics. When it's alnico take a look at the Black Dog. Good for fat PAF-tones but can do metal too. Stays tight in the lowend. The Crawler is less suitable for metal. On the outer side of the alnico-spectrum the hot Nailbomb could be a good choice. Aggressive but organic and cleans up well.
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If you like the tightness of ceramics with a slightly thicker sound I'd look at Cold Sweats. I used to have some in a mahogany bodied guitar and even with the added brightness of a maple/walnut thru-neck and locking trem it still gave me a far thicker and more organic tone than any other ceramic pup I've ever tried.
If you prefer the tone of Alnico V I'd agree that Black Dog and Nailbomb would be good choices and I'd also like to throw a Rebel Yell into the mix as it's very tight in the bottom end but still organic and versatile.
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I think your post is still too vague
"from blues to mastodon" doesn't say much
most BKP humbuckers were primarily made for les pauls
I love the cold sweats in my '73 lp custom
neck pup is extremely balanced and warm, but still tight and clear enough for rhythms
bridge pup is bright and crunchy, without any bass or mid bump, in a way that it really matches a good thick sounding les paul custom
it had nailbombs before and they sounded huge too
neck pup was a bit too hot and scooped, but very clear with a strong picking response
bridge pup was fat and focused, not scooped, but far from middy
like a metal PAF with a lot of sustain and huge output
I also love the holy diver and miracle man in les pauls
holy diver is very fat and powerful, lot of center mids,fluid leads, warm top
miracle man has a strong bass response, not much mids, sharp top, really clear lead tones and kinda reacts like a JCM... the louder you play it, the bigger it gets
for a stock JCM 800, I wouldn't go with a PAF model if you want to get real gain and sustain from the amp
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Hope you dont mind me barging in on the post :)
im about to buy a Les Paul Custom tomorrow, sooner or later i will upgrade the pickups. I have a Riff raff and painkiller in my musicman and cold sweet painkiller in my les paul standard so the choice is obvious.
The band i play in is proggy and covers a bunch of styles but always with a metal hint so i need something that can handle that. Think metallica/DT tones for the heavy stuff. I dont need pure Its mostly in standard but occasionally drop D but no lower. Amp is a Mesa Boogie Mark IV, usually running a tubescreamer or line boost at the front too.
I need something thats versatile + organic and suitable for lead playing. Lead Tone influence would be Joe Bonamassa (especially the Black county album) I wanted something different than a painkiller as i have two already but one that will balance well with the given neck pickup. My amp sound is pretty tight sounding as it is and i do notice on my musicman the massive difference in output between my riff raff and painkiller. Any suggestions??
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A Mule comes to mind for Bonamassa-leadtones. A Black Dog with big midrange could be an alternative.
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mules
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Nice! unequivocal answer. Thanks chaps. Just to be clear, are we talking a pair of mules or something slightly hotter in the bridge??
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For Bonamassa-tones I would go for a calibrated set. If you want something with a bit more output, consider The Crawler, which has a fat, but balanced hot-PAF-sound.
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I'd suggest trying out Cold Sweats for your LPC. It depends a lot on the unplugged tone as well....Play an open G, E or D and see if it rings (which means it's balanced). If it doesn't, I'd stay away from BKP's, as they only sound great in guitars with a great unplugged tone. However, that 'ringing' thing still doesn't say anything about the true tone of the guitar; it can still sound dark for instance, which means you'll have to stay away from Crawlers or Black Dogs. Also the difference between vintage and vintage/hot is quite important to mention; some guitars need a little more output, especially in the bridge position, COMPARED to the neck pickup. The Cold Sweat set gives that, while the pickups are perfectly balanced in tone and volume.
My LPC sounds tight, thick and rich unplugged and it rings with 10-46 gauge strings; the Cold Sweats are the perfect match for that guitar, no matter if its clean or distorted. Playing an open E with the bridge pickup on the clean channel just screams rock 'n roll. It definately has a vintage character, which might be part of the guitar as well.
Good luck.
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Sorry I couldn't get back earlier, I have it narrowed down to cold sweats or nailbombs. I've decided on the cold sweat neck, I have that in a prs and know how great that tone is. The main question is now how clean is the cold sweat bridge?
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Mastodon - I would definetly reccomend a Ceramic warpig for that
Gary Moore - I have no idea :S
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Sorry I couldn't get back earlier, I have it narrowed down to cold sweats or nailbombs. I've decided on the cold sweat neck, I have that in a prs and know how great that tone is. The main question is now how clean is the cold sweat bridge?
I'd suggest a calibrated CS set, even though many players use the CS neck paired with a different kind of bridge pickup (MM, NB, PK and so on).
Depending on the amp/settings the CS bridge can be really clean; you can hear it's power coming through, so the first thing you'll notice is that it definately wants to rock out. It's a really clear pickup, with slightly more bass response compared to the Rebel Yell, but it's still tight. The CS 'screams' more than it 'sings', but more in a vintage way (not like Zakk Wylde). It's also thick sounding for a ceramic pickup and probably even thicker than all of the other Alnico 5 BKP bridge pickups I tried in the same Les Paul before. For me it's the perfect bridge pickup, no matter if I play clean or distorted.
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interesting stuff guys. Will defo try the unplugged thing. Only had the guitar a couple of days, weighs a ton and feels great but already noticing the stock pickups arent upto the job. Just not tight or focused enough for me. I really dont wanna put a PK in the bridge so i might go for the CS set you mention. Hopefully its tight enough to rock out but sounds more balanced than my CS/PK in my LP Standard. Im thinking the mule set might just be a little to lacking in power. Im curious about the nailbombs but im concerned they are too powerful for the lead tones i want - i hate that metal lead sound - . Too many options!!! lol The holy diver Miracle man that eric suggested sounds interesting and it will offer something new to what i have already got.......his desription sounds right up my street!
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Wouldn't the Abraxas be a good alternative to the Mule? Like the Mule, it's Alnico IV so tonally similar but it's hotter. It should be the closest to the Mule in giving you that Bonamassa tone but the extra power should mean it will cover other areas too. I believe there are a few clips in the Players section of Abraxas pickups doing Metal as well. I'd say that you should give them serious consideration.
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from the description on the BK site the abraxas has always been what im looking for but i has never been recommended to me before, even by Tim. I will defo check out the players section as you mentioned, thanks. Were you thinking of the abraxas set or combined with another Bridge p/u?
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It has always seemed to me that the Abraxas is a bit ignored here. I think that may be because it's too easily associated with Santana and while that's not a bad thing, I've always had the impression that it's far more versatile than this might suggest. It has always seemed to me that if you want a really hot PAF tone, the Abraxas has to be worth a look. Now in fairness, I've never actually tried one so someone like Nolly may be better qualified to give an opinion but based on my understanding of the description, the comments I've read here and the clips I've listened to, the Abraxas has to be worth consideration. In actual fact, I was thinking of either a calibrated set or an Abraxas bridge with a Mule neck. My rationale for this was that as soon as you mentioned Bonamassa, the consensus of opinion was squarely in favour of a Calibrated set of Mules so it stands to reason that if all you need is a bit more power to that basic tone, a calibrated set or one of each was the logical conclusion. If, having heard the clips, you feel you need a hotter, more 'Metal' bridge pickup, I'd maybe consider an Abraxas neck with an Alnico V Nailbomb bridge. The Nailbomb is certainly a 'Metal' pickup but it's also very versatile and by sticking with an Alnico V magnet instead of ceramic, you'll keep an element of PAF tone in it and the versatility you need. So, to summarise, I'm fairly convinced that one of these three options is what you need, depending on where your priorities lie:
1) Abraxas bridge and Mule neck
2) Calibrated Abraxas set
3) Alnico V Nailbomb bridge and Abraxas neck
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There has been so many suggestions. All great and useful. Thanks guys. Seems like my options are this:
1) Calibrated Abraxas
2) Alnico V Nailbomb bridge and Abraxas neck
3) Cold Sweet Set
4) Holy Diver and Miracle man/Nailbomb
IIm edging towards 2 and 4 at the moment. Im going to pass on the mules. No doubts they do Joe Bonamassa as i asked but im worried they wont be able to keep up when i play with my band. Our whole album was recorded using painkillers in the bridge :)
Anyhow, gonna give Tim a call in the new year, ill let you know what he says. Thanks for everyones help :)
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You seem to have quite a preference for a more 'Metal' sound and that is pulling you away from the Mules but likewise, it seems to me that your fourth option is too Metal and won't give you those Bonamassa tones you said you liked. To my mind, the best balance is the Alnico V Nailbomb bridge and Abraxas neck as that offers the best of both worlds.
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I'd pick the holy diver over the nailbomb
cleans up better, it's a bit less aggressive, more versatile, a lot fatter in the center mids and more fluid on leads
not as tight, but still tight enough for faster metal riffing
for some reason, I loved it for old Metallica stuff, although it's not as appropriate as a hot ceramic model
and it's also more sensitive to boosting than the nailbomb, in my experience (maybe because the nailbomb is already hot as $%&#?)
if you're into Alice In Chains tones (from any era), this is the ultimate AiC pickup
also great for Doug Aldrich and Jake E. Lee stuff
the cold sweat neck is a great match for most models
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Well ive been listening to the abraxas on here and YT and it sounds sweet. I think it can handle heavier stuff too. Its finding a balanced bridge P/U. Im tempted to go with the calibrated set as well, they were designed to match but maybe a HD or NB would be good to.
There are two songs i recorded here with the painkiller. http://www.reverbnation.com/tunepak/3115554
Would the AX/HD or NB be able to handle it?? The heavy riffs kick in pretty soon so no need to listen to the whole song if you dont wanna!
Thanks again guys
getting ever closer :)
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Think twice about it 8)
All BKP's are high quality pickups and I'd recommend looking more at what the guitar needs, instead of basing your pickup choice on your music style or amp you're playing through (which changes through time). Of course these last two things are important, but a great guitar should always sound great when you know it's all in the fingers and when you know how to play with the natural tone of the guitar. Some guitars really want you to play jazz all night long and/or fluid metal leads, other guitars want you play blues, country or twangy rockabilly. When you listen to the guitars voice, you'll find the right pickups for it (EQ-wise..more bass, more mid, less treble for instance). The guitar has the tone, not the pickups. O, and I love to play clean jazz/classic rock with both the CS neck pickup and CS bridge pickup (with both tone knobs down to like 7). Sounds thicker than any A5 BKP bridge pickup I tried before (Mule, RB, HD, Lollar Imperial), while still being clear.