Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: m t soule on October 02, 2013, 07:07:25 PM
-
Are dimarzios the only way to get the vai sound?
pedals and the man himself aside.
-
you gotta be more specific regarding the rig details
lot of models might work depending on the rest of the equipment
-
Vai has a really fluid mid and thick tone, at least for the neck, i had a holy diver and its sounds really great in his songs !
-
the miracle man is also a common choice
the stevie's special has quite similar specs and voicing
-
It's a hard one this as a lot of people don't realise that Vai used PAF Pros in both positions for the recording of Passion & Warfare. The Evolutions are a completely different style of PUP, but I can guarantee when Vai plays it live, it kicks ass.
I've read a few threads on this forum where people say that the Painkiller is like the EVOs. Obviously it is completely voiced differently and if you truly want Vai's tone then go for the Dimarzios.
I can't comment on which pickups would suit Vai's style better though. But I'm sure there are plenty in the BKP range which could suit your needs.
-
Holy Diver Bridge and Miracle Man neck would get you close. For that sound I'd go dimarzios though.
-
There really is not one Vai sound in a PU, heck, does he not have 3 signature sets by now?
It really is a lot about which of the sounds you are after.
-
I think it may be a stretch but thinking logically vhii's for his mid to late 80s sound given he was playing with david lee roth and doing van halen covers at that time. His sound didnt change massively for whitesnake either.
As others have said he may have used PAF's in the 80's so vhii's would again fit the bill but he was also using marshall jcm800's and a boss ds1 for leads so his gear has changed massively from what he uses now as well as having his new sig pickups too.
-
The reason I ask is because I would like to see what I could do using that medium in my rg550 as opposed to copy vai.
A friend has an indonesian jem(which would not compare with vais own) with dimarzios and the voicing was distinctively vai. Maybe the alder, maybe the pup, maybe his picking technique (which can't compare with vai's), maybe his Marshal amp(which can't compare with vai's), maybe any or all of the above. But the common, consistent factor is the dimarzios.
Thing is I would like that opportunity and I figured BKP are cool fellas so lets give em first shot.
at the moment I am fresh into learning about pick ups so apologies for my naivety etc
Vai material that has inspired me = alien love secrets(top of the list becsuse of its "simplicity"), fire garden(especially the last track), passion and warfare(audience is listning snd for the love of god)
my guitars at home are;
1998 Rg550 ltd npm v7 s1 v8 = love it.
2007 rg550 mxx nailbomb(b) irish tour(m) crawler(n) = love it in Eflat but not in E standard
1993 rg550 ca v1 s1 v2 = not sure hence the pup upgrade.
amp line6 spider.
Dont use pedals or any other garnish or gadgetry.
All the BKP sound bytes are in E flat which in my opinion makes a massive difference to sound compared to E standard which means i cannot judge accurately from there
Thanks so much for the advice so far
-
I think from the clips that I have heard so far that the new Juggernaut pickups sound closest to the Evolution Vai sound of any BKPs that I have heard.
-
What is it you hear to have that opinion?
T
-
I had an original 89 Jem FP: basswood body, maple neck, rosewood board, scalloped on the higher positions. And PAF Pro's in bridge- and neckposition. If you are looking for that sound from Passion and Warfare I would look at a VHII or a Holy Diver. For his later sounds Miracle Man or perhaps Juggernauts.
-
What is it you hear to have that opinion?
T
http://youtu.be/s_JgKOjTTqg (http://youtu.be/s_JgKOjTTqg)
Some of he tones in this clip made me think that they would sound a bit Evo like - especially with the right choice of material.
-
The Cold Sweat set has a fairly smooth sound like Evos only I think with more midrange (judging from what I've heard). That might be worth looking into as well
-
The Cold Sweat set has a fairly smooth sound like Evos only I think with more midrange (judging from what I've heard). That might be worth looking into as well
Quite the opposite to my ears - Cold Sweat is pretty open and almost scooped whilst Evo had a shedload of mids.
I use the Cold Sweat a lot - love it .
-
The Cold Sweat is definitely nice in my guitar. The mids are quite scooped on the pickup, which is great because the guitar it's in (an SG) has a lot of mids already. On some other guitars it might sound scooped, but in my SG it sounds very balanced, much more so than the A-Bomb, which was a hardcore mids monster when combined with this middy guitar. I imagine a Painkiller would be even more like that.
-
The Cold Sweat set has a fairly smooth sound like Evos only I think with more midrange (judging from what I've heard). That might be worth looking into as well
Quite the opposite to my ears - Cold Sweat is pretty open and almost scooped whilst Evo had a shedload of mids.
I use the Cold Sweat a lot - love it .
I've heard some clips where people get a passion and warfare era-like sound pretty nicely. They probably dimed their mids -- you'd know better than I. Regardless, they have a similar smoothness to the tone which is essential for a Vai sound.
I had a jem with evos and it did have a fair amount of mids to it, but I sold it a while ago...
-
I have had a play with the crawler in my neck and so far that is giving me what i am after in that position. especially for the tender surrender cleans.
So for the neck.........?
Thanks again for the input guys!
-
I think Vai's Legacy amp is quite middy to match the scooped Evo's.
But side by side at any G3, Satriani's tone is much better than Vai's.
-
I think Vai's Legacy amp is quite middy to match the scooped Evo's.
But side by side at any G3, Satriani's tone is much better than Vai's.
I have a modded Marshall SL-X and 2 cabinets but the one I mostly use has Classic Lead speakers, which is a very middy combo as well which saw most of my use with the Jem when I had it, so I'm probably not the best reference. That said, the Les Paul and Rebel Yells have far more mids than the Evolutions in the Jem did and also a clarify that the Jem couldn't match. What evos did really nicely was their smooth tone and also they're fairly dynamic -- both of which are why I think the Cold Sweat would be a good choice for a Vai tone.
And I've seen G3 several times and I always thought Satch's live tone was better than Vai's. Vai's live tone always sounds super scooped but with an excessive amount of high tones for whatever reason (where I wouldn't say his studio tones are), where Satch sounds like Satch either way.
-
The more i research Pick ups in whatever format it seems more like pot luck given the variables.
the guitar, the wood, the finger board, the player the amp, the pick up, the venue, and all the possible combinations etc etc.
The opinions all simultaneously conflict AND confirm each other but rarely with a solid 'fact' but mainly likes and dislikes.
There is one point of consistent hope however and that is the long dimarzio/ibanez relationship. Evos here i come.
Thanks for the advice!
I shall keep an open mind!
-
Vai's live tone always sounds super scooped but with an excessive amount of high tones for whatever reason (where I wouldn't say his studio tones are), where Satch sounds like Satch either way.
I only heard the G3 recordings - never seen them live - and Vai's tone came across to my ears as extremely middy - certainly nothing scooped.
The only DiMarzio which is associated with Vai and that I played is the Breed Bridge - a fairly dark and middy pickup as well - much darker than e.g. a Holydiver or Miracle Man. I don't think there is a BKP equivalent to that. I have never had the Evolution or Steve's Special, although I have tried an Ibanez with the Evolution in it, and I thought that was a monster output fizzy pickup - not my cup of tea at all.
Cheers Stephan
-
Just to be pedantic, a couple of people have mentioned the DiMarzio Steve's Special.... that's not actually a Vai pickup (although he may well have used it at some point).
"Steve" in this case is Steve Blucher, DiMarzio's pickup design guru.
-
Just to be pedantic, a couple of people have mentioned the DiMarzio Steve's Special.... that's not actually a Vai pickup (although he may well have used it at some point).
"Steve" in this case is Steve Blucher, DiMarzio's pickup design guru.
Interresting. Did not realize that before. Thanks for clearing it up.
So that only leaves the Evo, Breed and the Gravity Storm? Give the man some more signature PUs, guitars, amps, pedals, etc.
Disclaimer: I really love Vai. Great playing, inspirational talker galore and amazing live show.
-
Just to be pedantic, a couple of people have mentioned the DiMarzio Steve's Special.... that's not actually a Vai pickup (although he may well have used it at some point).
"Steve" in this case is Steve Blucher, DiMarzio's pickup design guru.
Interresting. Did not realize that before. Thanks for clearing it up.
So that only leaves the Evo, Breed and the Gravity Storm? Give the man some more signature PUs, guitars, amps, pedals, etc.
Disclaimer: I really love Vai. Great playing, inspirational talker galore and amazing live show.
I would never know that :lol:
thanks
anyway, the miracle man has been recommended for the Steve Vai stuff for a long time on the forum
but I've seen Tim recommending not only the MM, but also the nailbomb on early posts
none of them sounds like dimarzios anyway
-
Vai's live tone always sounds super scooped but with an excessive amount of high tones for whatever reason (where I wouldn't say his studio tones are), where Satch sounds like Satch either way.
I only heard the G3 recordings - never seen them live - and Vai's tone came across to my ears as extremely middy - certainly nothing scooped.
The only DiMarzio which is associated with Vai and that I played is the Breed Bridge - a fairly dark and middy pickup as well - much darker than e.g. a Holydiver or Miracle Man. I don't think there is a BKP equivalent to that. I have never had the Evolution or Steve's Special, although I have tried an Ibanez with the Evolution in it, and I thought that was a monster output fizzy pickup - not my cup of tea at all.
Cheers Stephan
Yeah the recordings never sound scooped. I wouldn't say his gear itself is particularly low on midrange by any means. I saw him in New Haven once where I was right in front of him all night and that show had tons of mids, but when I see him in larger venus with G3s, the mids just don't carry past the first few rows where Satriani's do.