Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: peter on November 03, 2013, 07:20:39 PM
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hi just bought a goltop standard les paul the tone is fine but missing the something i hear in bkp
so open for sugestions and dont want to loose gibson sound just make it better need a bridge pickup for all types of rock and blues blues rock and a neck that i can match bridge but still play clean that goes for bridge to open for sugestions
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Hi and welcome.
The HD can certainly work, but in my mind it is a little too metal if you are going for rock and blues rock applications. Depending on how the guitar sounds acousticly (darker or brighter side, how middy, etc) there are a couple of options I would say are better for that area. My main three would be:
Blackdog as it is not completly unlike the HD, but more vintage and better suited for your application, though maybe not best if the guitar is pretty dark already.
Mule as you just canīt go wrong with that in a LP especially for rock and blues sounds, it just is the gold standard for PAF tone. Plus: What is the oposite of a one trick pony? The Mule. Fits just about every guitar ever.
Lastly the RY set can also be considered, especially if the guitar is on the darker side. It is made for LPs and delivers insanely good rock sounds, but is so versatile it can easily do tight modern metal and vintage blues also. It is a modern take on a classic sound with a nice upper mid spike and a very rocking voicing.
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thanks :D
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im going RY bridge and mule neck if thats a possible combination withouth bridge being to hot if i play middle
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I personally use that combo and for my taste it works great. Got it in a Ibanez S series with an IT middle. That guitar is so versatile it is incredible. Alternativly, if you are concerned about balance of just like a hotter neck PU, you could also do an Abraxas neck. The Abraxas is in essence a hotter, pumped up Mule.
I can generally recommend to have a look at the sticky review collection thread, great source for more info on interresting sets.
Have another look at both the RY and the Mule, both will work wonderfully. While the RY is my absolute favorite bridge PU one should never count out the Mule without a proper look, it is impressivly versatile too. I am astonished everytime I see a certain ViK guitars clip of a Mule bridge, Manhattan neck guitar doing metal. Read up a bit more on both to make a really edjucated decision.
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i will thanks :D
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Mules and RY's both do well in Les Pauls. Where the hotter RY is agressive, in yer face with present uppermids, Mules represent the classic PAF-sound: a bit mellower but with a nice crispiness, more detailed and complex. If you play a lot of cleans and mediumgain stuff, Mules could be the ticket. They also handle loads of gain quite well.
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Personally I would just go for the RY set if you were considering the RY neck with a HD bridge. The HD is more metal, as Slart says. If I were to go for a HD bridge I would probably use the Emerald neck, because they seem to be a good combo, but I tend to think that the HD is more metal than you would like.
I'm not really a vintage guy so others can make better suggestions than me if you decide to go down that road. I play thrash metal and hardcore mainly, but for a rock guitar I would go RY for sure.
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The HD is more metal, as Slart says. If I were to go for a HD bridge I would probably use the Emerald neck, because they seem to be a good combo, but I tend to think that the HD is more metal than you would like.
Dude, me and Slarty agree often and are generally very much on the same page, but I did not realize that it was so bad that people are starting to confuse us! :mrgreen:
Sides that I agree with your entire notion about if HD then EM neck, but the RY being a better ticket. Well as Tele says RY or Mule, depending on preferences.
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LOL! :lol:
Sorry about that.
Your posts generally mention adjusting pickups and pole-pieces more
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The rebel yell set is wonderful in a lesPaul. I know from experience dude
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For Blues rock I would consider the Abraxas set. If you want to go a bit more aggressive on the bridge, then Rebel Yell set.
Cheers Stephan
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If the guitar is to be used for rock and blues I would defenitely look at the vintage hot or vintage department. The obvious choice in my eyes is either a set of Mules or a set of Abraxas depending on how hot you want to go.
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LOL! :lol:
Sorry about that.
Your posts generally mention adjusting pickups and pole-pieces more
Oh you do know me after all :oops:
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I have a PG Blues set in my Goldtop and love it for Blues and Classic Rock playing. Many of the original songs in this era were lower output humbuckers, and the classic Fleetwood Mac tones are solidly built into this set (not to mention it was used by Gary Moore too).
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I have a PG Blues set in my Goldtop and love it for Blues and Classic Rock playing. Many of the original songs in this era were lower output humbuckers, and the classic Fleetwood Mac tones are solidly built into this set (not to mention it was used by Gary Moore too).
Oh my yes, how could I forget those. Absolutly a phantastic option too.
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thanks for all replyes i checked out crawler neck on soundclips sweet so im gonna get crawler i think superb on clean and distorted neck that is bridge was poor in performance so still looking for bridge but its probably gonna be rebel yell bridge :D
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Crawler neck with an RY bridge could be a bit of a missmatch in my mind. The Crawler neck is sweet and powerful, but also rather compressed and full. Somewhat unlike the RY. Now this might just be what you are going for but consider that The Mule works great, the Abraxas is a fatter, hotter mule which also works great and then the Crawler neck is even hotter and fatter, so that might be a bit too much for the RY bridge which is not the fattest of HBs and has that upper mid spike. Very different.
Edit: The softness of the bass of the Crawler neck also needs to be noted. Again, the RY has a quite different character there.
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ok how would pg bridge and crawler neck do?
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You definitely want more output on the bridge pickup than on the neck. The neck will always be naturally louder so there is a real danger of it overpowering a bridge pickup of the same output rating.
If you like the sound of the Crawler neck, and you like the idea of a higher output bridge like the Rebel Yell but want something that sonically fits with the Crawler neck I would recommend the Crawler set.
All of the humbucker sets have been tested in LPs and all of the clips for them are recorded in an LP, so the clip should provide a good indication of what each pickup will sound like. What it does not tell you is how they will sound together. Calibrated sets though are always a safe bet.
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thanks a bit tired today but yeah crawler set it is i think
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I didn't realise when I started to read this thread that the tastes and opinions of myself and Kiichi are now so close that we're merging into one person! :D I'll need to say something that provides a bit of distance between us.
I've heard nothing but good things about the Rebel Yell in a Les Paul but for me, it's too much of a Rock pickup for what you want and it seems to me that the hotter you go, the further you move away from the classic Gibson Les Paul voicing that the OP is after. Providing the guitar isn't hugely dark and you do want some power in the pickup, putting a Crawler in the bridge is the obvious solution. It's hot and has some real growl to it but unlike other pups in the contemporary section, it's not massively tight and retains more of the PAF DNA than the others. Of all the pickups I've tried, the Crawler gives you the largest operating window, though I believe the Mule and Abraxas are also very good at that. You can play Blues with it, Blues Rock, Classic Rock and it will even take you into some early Metal styles. There's a real richness to its tone that is simply sublime. If you weren't going to get the Crawler in the bridge, I'd only really be looking at the Abraxas or Mule, though I find Kiici's suggestion of a Black Dog to be a really interesting one. If you want vintage tone in the neck, I'd just use a Mule regardless of which of these bridge pickups you select.
So that I don't distance myself too much from my good friend Kiichi, I'm also going to say that whatever pickups you choose, remember to spend time playing around with the height of the pickup as Bare Knuckles are incredibly sensitive to height adjustment. You can also do a great deal to tweak your tone by lowering the height of the pickup but raising the height of the pole pieces as this can do wonders in adding note definition and losing a bit of bass. 8)
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We're talking Les Paul here. I would not go with a Crawler-neck unless the guitar has a bright timbre. The Crawler-neck can smoother a LP. I think blues/ bluesrock ask for an open, deepsounding, dynamic, balanced PAF, which good chime in the inbetween-setting. I would really look once more at the PG Blues and Mule. If you want to rock a bit too: Mules. I get great hardrock-tones with Mules.
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I didn't realise when I started to read this thread that the tastes and opinions of myself and Kiichi are now so close that we're merging into one person! :D I'll need to say something that provides a bit of distance between us.
I've heard nothing but good things about the Rebel Yell in a Les Paul but for me, it's too much of a Rock pickup for what you want and it seems to me that the hotter you go, the further you move away from the classic Gibson Les Paul voicing that the OP is after. Providing the guitar isn't hugely dark and you do want some power in the pickup, putting a Crawler in the bridge is the obvious solution. It's hot and has some real growl to it but unlike other pups in the contemporary section, it's not massively tight and retains more of the PAF DNA than the others. Of all the pickups I've tried, the Crawler gives you the largest operating window, though I believe the Mule and Abraxas are also very good at that. You can play Blues with it, Blues Rock, Classic Rock and it will even take you into some early Metal styles. There's a real richness to its tone that is simply sublime. If you weren't going to get the Crawler in the bridge, I'd only really be looking at the Abraxas or Mule, though I find Kiici's suggestion of a Black Dog to be a really interesting one. If you want vintage tone in the neck, I'd just use a Mule regardless of which of these bridge pickups you select.
So that I don't distance myself too much from my good friend Kiichi, I'm also going to say that whatever pickups you choose, remember to spend time playing around with the height of the pickup as Bare Knuckles are incredibly sensitive to height adjustment. You can also do a great deal to tweak your tone by lowering the height of the pickup but raising the height of the pole pieces as this can do wonders in adding note definition and losing a bit of bass. 8)
Ah yes, height adjustment!!!! :lol:
Also you canīt really distance yourself too much from me with a Crawler recommendation when I was one of the (if the not the single) largest pushers for you to get one in the first place. 8)
However I am more with telerocker on this I must say, to a good part cause this is after all a LP. RY is cool, but on the modern side, but for true blues rock the Mule is hard to beat and the PG Blues I forgot is a no brainer too.
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Yes, you did indeed push hard for me to get a Crawler bridge and for that I am forever in your debt because it's just fantastic.
I'd agree that for true Blues and Blues Rock tone, the Mule or Abraxas might be best (I'd have thought the PG was more Blues than Blues Rock but I've never tried it myself) but surely if you want to go hotter and get that tone, the Crawler has to be a more obvious choice than the far more modern and Rocky Rebel Yell? Just because it's a Les Paul surely doesn't mean it has to be a Rebel Yell.
Anyway, it's not like we're a million miles apart. We agree that the Mule would be awesome and I am happy to defer to your experience in suggesting that the PG would be a good and more Bluesy option. As a hotter version of the Mule, I doubt you'd argue too much with a suggestion of an Abraxas so it's really only in the more contemporary interpretation of what he's after where we differ. I see the argument for the Rebel Yell perfectly well and if the emphasis is on Rock, I think it would be a very good choice, but if the emphasis is more on Blues Rock and a more PAF tone, I still think the Crawler is a more viable option. :D
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If you only you would have also liked the Crawler neck as much...well canīt have a perfect record. ;)
Oh the Crawler is viable in this case, no doubt. Could work wonderfully. I just advise caution in a LP. In a brigter, thinner guitar I would have less reservations. I am trying to extend Telerockers warning about the Crawler neck in a LP. We all know LP is not LP, so it can work perfectly, but the richness of the Crawler plus the richness of a LP can be too much and "smother" it. If the Crawler is the weapong of choice you gotta make sure the timbre works with it, cause that is the difference between bliss and "meh".
The Mule, Abraxas and PG blues are just much safer in a LP. Heck you can put the mule in anything and it will be great.
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I think it's a matter how open and articulate the OP wants his pickups to be. The Crawler is a great and my doing-all-tones-pickup in my strat, but compared to Mules it's quite compressed. And if you have a thick sounding LP you don't have to go hot anyway.
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In my defense, I did qualify my suggestion of a Crawler by stating that 'Providing the guitar isn't hugely dark' but I do think that in many Les Pauls it could work fine. When I first got the Crawler my immediate thought was that it would only work if the Les Paul had a thick maple cap but I've had to refine that since. OK, my Les Paul copy is only a cheap Vintage but it's entirely mahogany and I have no doubt at all that the Crawler would sound awesome in it. It all depends on the individual guitar but I think in many cases the description on the website is accurate and it will work in both Strats and Les Pauls.
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Well looks like we are like 99% on the same page after all, just had to read through it properly. :o
I can just sign everything you just sayd as usual. Oh yeah, Telerocker too.
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Yeah, we don't disagree at all, I think. Slarti you're right about why the Crawler was designed. Geoff Whitehorn wanted a pickup that would do great in a strat and a LP. Personally I think it excels in alder/ash-bolt-ons and can work good to very good in bright or - at least - not dark LP's.
Back to the OP. It would be nice if he refines his requirements.
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I am not a fan of Crawlers in Les Pauls, I think they are more suited to longer scale length guitars (PRS, Fender). I changed mine out for Abraxas and really prefer the sound. The PG Blues have a lot of definition, but are not just for playing the blues. They are a great rock pickup too. I have a lot of BK's in Les Pauls, and have also played a lot of Tim's guitars too, and for blues and classic rock, a lower output pickup set will give the best sound. You can always use pedals to boost the output (that's what we all did back in the 70's before there were overwound pickups). I'm also a big fan of Emeralds in Les Pauls, I have a set in one and one in combination with a mule neck in another. They give a really nice harmonicly rich tone and take overdrive really well.
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I couldn't argue with much of that to be honest. The Emerald is a very under-represented bridge pickup here yet the tone is fantastic. I only sent mine back because it was too bright but in any darkish Les Paul it would be incredible.
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the sound in my goldtop is very clean acoustic like not bright not dark im thinking crawler set but maybe pg blues set to not sure and probably gonna think it over maybe next month i buy crawler og pg blues set the soubnd from factory on the guitar is pretty sweet to
just a little weak its gibson burstbucker pros but they i dunno i like then and i dont like them kinda looking for a better overall sound usable for blues rock everything without loosing the gibson sound and havent found that perfect pickup in demo sounds yet im very picky :)
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I understand the concerns here regarding the darkness of the Crawler in a Les Paul.
If you like blues rock I am wondering if you have checked out the Emerald set. Personally that would be my first choice for blues rock in a Les Paul, and it's certainly a lot brighter sounding than a Crawler if clips and opinions here are anything to go by. I had a good listen to the Emerald clips one day and really liked what I heard.
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ok il check out emerald im into blues and rock was what i was thinking just typed it wrong and continued to sry lol
anyway im thinking crawler neck and pg or emerald bridge or just crawler something about that rock sound that gets me on the clips
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The Emerald is certainly more Rock than Blues, hence the Emerald neck is very much a modern interpretation of a more traditional PAF sound. The bridge Emerald is tight and bright whereas something like the Crawler is fat and smooth but with a real growl to the tone. They may be able to cover similar ground but they're very different beasts in my experience. One of the many things I love about the Crawler is its huge operating window. It splits really well, the cleans are fantastic and the distorted tones sublime. It will play Blues all day long and run all the way into Metal territory, covering everything inbetween. I never thought I would live to say this, but the Crawler has actually surpassed my beloved Holydiver and become my favourite Bare Knuckle pickup. In a dark Les Paul I agree, it has too much bottom end but if it's in any way similar to a PRS CU24 or Vintage V100, it will sound incredible. For neck pickups, I have no experience of the PG Blues but if Kiichi says it's good, I wouldn't argue. The Mule might also be a good one to consider as it's very similar to the Crawler and Abraxas neck pickups but a bit brighter. I used to run an Emerald neck with mine which worked really well as I like a slightly more modern cut to my pickups but I'm now running a Holydiver with the Crawler, which is a hell of a lot more vintage sounding than I expected and sits beautifully in that guitar.
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For blues/bluesrock I would narrow it down to Mules, or a little hotter and a bit more mids, Abraxas. You can't go wrong with those two in a Les Paul.
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Yep, both great choices in my book and in many ways the Mule, Abraxas and Crawler are related. The Mule is your ideal PAF pickup while the Abraxas is a hotter version of the Mule so it's a bit darker and a bit more compressed. The Crawler takes things a stage further so it's a bit darker again and more compressed sounding. To help give the hotter wind more clarity it switches to an alnico V magnet and as a result, although it's still VERY smooth and rich sounding, it has more of a growl to it.
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i was googling and the new dimarzio transition looks kinda cool a set of them in a les paul would be cool
but still i have that raw crawler set in mind to even rebel yell set maybe a second les paul for pg set i dunno only time will tell
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i bought a benedetto jazz a6 neck humbucker used it before super nice sound clear warm fath rich harmonics but need a bridge to
use with it etihter im going to use stock Gibson burstbucker pro bridge or im getting somekindsa duncan or bareknuckles but what to match benedetto a6 any sugestions they are produced by seymour duncan custom shop for benedetto guitars
some raw blues or rock bridge that still can do super clean notes any one know?
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Abraxas
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thanks