Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: Sanguinex on November 10, 2013, 06:07:29 PM
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Hey
At the minute I've got a Marshall Valvestate VS 100 combo and a couple of cheap practice amps. It feels like the Marshall is completely wasted as in my house I can never turn the volume above 3 even with the power soak button. Also i play in a symphonic metal band and a black metal band so the amp doesn't quite give me what i'm after anyway.
I was hoping to get some advice on a smaller tube amp that i could crank while still keeping it at relatively neighbour friendly levels.
Also I've never really looked at the 2nd hand amp market before, how much would i realistically get for a 100w Marshall combo amp?
Cheers for any help
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Second hand a valvestate won't go for so much, check ebay to get an idea.
Even a 4w amp is loud at bedroom levels (depends whether you're in a flat or semi or detached though)
Guess you're looking for gain? orange tiny terror tends to be the flavour for that round here, not my taste but plenty of high gain guys love em.
I think cornford do some lower wattage high gain amps for decent prices (they have a PCB based range rather than their usually P2P wiring) that are excellent, whether they'd be the sound you're looking for though, am not sure.
Marshall also have their anniversary 5w amps.
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I think the Laney ironheart studio or irt15 might suit you. Im considering it myself
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Yeah i essentially want a high gain amp that i can crank in my room without too much hassle, noise complaints detract from practice time. I've been looking at the ironheart series but i'd rather get a combo if possible as i don't have a speaker cab at the moment. What size speakers would be needed to accomodate a 15w head
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Do you just want an amp for practice or do you want to use it with the band also?
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you know, maybe this is worth mentioning, yes there is a point at which an amps power section will open up, but modern high gain amps rely on preamp distortion. for what you're talking about, i don't know how much you;ll be benefiting from having something to crank.
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At the minute we either use the amps in the rehearsal rooms, and for the foreseeable future any gigs i play in pub venues i'd just be using the amps already there.
Although if it's going to cost me £300 for a 15w laney then i may as well go and just buy something like a 2nd hand 6505
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If its for home use, forget about valve amps - go with Fractal or some similar route like a good preamp into a solid state power amp like the ISP Stealth.
Even iRig or something along those line will give you plenty of mileage for home use.
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At the minute we either use the amps in the rehearsal rooms, and for the foreseeable future any gigs i play in pub venues i'd just be using the amps already there.
Although if it's going to cost me £300 for a 15w laney then i may as well go and just buy something like a 2nd hand 6505
Ahh, so you're gigging - a 2nd hand 6505 would be a great decision. Even the Bugera copy is apparently much better these days since they worked out the 'glitch' of them catching fire, ha ha.
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you know, maybe this is worth mentioning, yes there is a point at which an amps power section will open up, but modern high gain amps rely on preamp distortion. for what you're talking about, i don't know how much you;ll be benefiting from having something to crank.
agreed.
and those lower wattage amps don't really hit the sweetspot at bedroom levels anyway, unless you don't share any walls with neighbours (and even then your own ears, if you're anything like me, will limit how loud you can turn it up). plus normally aren't aimed at modern metal tones.
If its for home use, forget about valve amps
I disagree, but it does depend on what exactly "home use" means, and the tones you're after. If you're in an apartment or something like that then valve probably isn't the way to go. if you live in a detached house and are after tones which are more in the preamp anyway, I think valve is fine. Obviously personal preference plays a large part, too.
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A genuinely low wattage tube amp will still be loud enough to hear next door when you push it enough to crunch up for metal. I've got a 6V6 MJW Goldstar that's a perfect low vol amp that you can talk over even when it's cranked. But if I get it cooking with an OD, the neighbours can still hear it and we're detatched...
A low wattage hybrid like a Blackstar HT-5. That can make some high gain noises at low volumes. For the money though there's not much to touch it, but it can't roll sonically with a good valve amp (which will inevitably cost more).
The last option is a clean amp and get the distortion with pedals. This is probably the best option as you can still have it as a giggable amp if needs be.
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I use my Peavey at home but I am living on a biggish house on a biggish block with plenty of separation between me and the neighbours. If you don't have that forget about practicing with the Peavey at home. Most of the time I don't turn mine up past one on the dial if anyone's home here and pretty much never past two if they are not, just because I don't want to annoy the neighbours.
Probably the best tube combo for home use is the Laney Iommi practice amp, but it's not that cheap. You can use a 1W option and headphones if you need to.
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At the minute we either use the amps in the rehearsal rooms, and for the foreseeable future any gigs i play in pub venues i'd just be using the amps already there.
Although if it's going to cost me £300 for a 15w laney then i may as well go and just buy something like a 2nd hand 6505
whats your thinking here? more watts doesn't = better. 15W would be plenty loud for most (if not all pub gigs). plus its got a 1w option and a speaker emulated DI out, so if you're going into a soundboard you don't even need to worry about a speaker cabinet. the 5150 (sorry, will never call it a 6505 because i was around when they first came out lol) is an industry standard, but it's LOUD, and the Ironheart seems way more appropriate for your needs as you#re describing them. Plus.. i suspect the reliability/build on the Ironheart may well be better. 5150's used to be tanks, but i don't feel they're as sturdily put together (QC isn't as good perhaps?) since they moved production out of the US. Also, think about portability. If it's a 5150 (6505) combo you're thinking about, well.. have you ever picked up one of those things?? even the head weighs a ton.
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As far as I know Peavey still make all the 6505 series (except for the 6505+ 112 combo) and Classic series amps in the USA. My 6534+ certainly was made there. Maybe you are thinking of the EVH 5150 III? Fender makes them in Mexico.
Cheap lines of Peavey are made in China, just like cheap Laneys. As far as I know only a few Laneys are made in the UK, namely the Lionheart (those pretty blue tweed Class A things) and the Iommi signature stuff.
I can confirm that the Peavey 6065 series heads weigh a lot. I think my 6534+ might be the heaviest of the lot with its EL34 power section.
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nope, I'd been thinking of the 1x12, but only because the OP had mentioned a combo. My brain somehow extended that to the rest of the line though :?
my thinking on the QC is maybe not something that people will agree with but.. here it is.
Just that basically in my own experience, in various industries (automotive, electronics etc) when a line has been consistently made for a long time QC "can" (not always) get slack, unless there's a major issue when everybodys ears prick up and they start paying closer attention again. The newer the line, the more a company is trying to make an impression on the market and the tighter control is.
That and I've just never felt the 6505's were as well made as the 5150's.. Don't ask me why, just an intangible feeling i have and is probably wrong. I would always recommend people buying an original 5150 anyways, they can be had cheap.
are the GH100/50L and VH100's still made in the UK?
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when i was playing in my old hardcore band we often played bars and places that had no PA. I 15, 25 or even 30 watt would have struggled to cut it at times. You need the headroom in a high gain amp, otherwise you end up with a massively distorted preamp signal going into a massively distorting power stage. It doesn't sound good. But if you're packed in next to a drummer and bassist and only the vocals are going through a PA, then you'd be surprised at how loud you have to be to get heard. But, use your experience to figure out what tools you need.
As for tha 6505 vs the 5150, the circuit is the same and they contain pretty much the same parts. The 6505's however dont have the power valve pcb riveted to the chassis, so it's much less of an issue to repair broken screen grid resistors in a 6505. You just un screw the pcb in the 6505, but you need to drill the rivets out in an old 5150. Those resistors are mounted under the pcb. The other really noticeable thing is at some point peavey swapped the ribbon connectors for push on connectors with individual heavier gauge wires. This probably helps stop the connectors burning out and in some cases destroying huge tracks of PCB. So even though the older 5150 is cooler, I'd say the newer ones should be slightly more reliable and easier to work on.
Still, a second hand 5150/6505 seems hard to find for less than £550 these days.
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If there's anything 'cheaper' about the newer Peavey 6505 series amps I'd say it's probably the valves, but how long do valves last anyway? All of the old 5150s from the '90s would have either had a valve change now, or sound like shite because their tubes are bad, unless there is some amp somewhere that the guy didn't like and was rich enough not to sell on to someone else.
Seems like they have made some little changes over the years though.
I read some reports of fuse problems with the Chinese 6065+ 112, otherwise the reports have been okay.
Bandits etc I've heard of bigger differences between the USA made versions and (at least the early) Chinese versions. I have an old teal stripe Bandit, possibly the one with the most mojo besides the 65W used on the first Entombed record, but it needs major repairs, due to years of being abused by various people, most likely junkies who have stolen it at various times and sold it to Cash Converters.
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def had wrong info on the 6505 then.. would still rather have an original 5150 though ;)
do they still construct the combo cab as closed back? that thing integrated with the amp sounded epic, actually preferred it to the head and 4x12.
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If there's anything 'cheaper' about the newer Peavey 6505 series amps I'd say it's probably the valves, but how long do valves last anyway? All of the old 5150s from the '90s would have either had a valve change now, or sound like shitee because their tubes are bad, unless there is some amp somewhere that the guy didn't like and was rich enough not to sell on to someone else.
Seems like they have made some little changes over the years though.
I read some reports of fuse problems with the Chinese 6065+ 112, otherwise the reports have been okay.
Bandits etc I've heard of bigger differences between the USA made versions and (at least the early) Chinese versions. I have an old teal stripe Bandit, possibly the one with the most mojo besides the 65W used on the first Entombed record, but it needs major repairs, due to years of being abused by various people, most likely junkies who have stolen it at various times and sold it to Cash Converters.
From what i understand the 6505s also have poorer quality transformers. They switched manufacturers sometime around the name changing.
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The 5150/6505 isn't suitable for at home, it needs a certain level to work properly.
I think the Orange Dark Terror would work well for black metal - it's among the most affordable but also the best of the small amps. You could probably sell all the other amps you own because it's so portable.
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def had wrong info on the 6505 then.. would still rather have an original 5150 though ;)
do they still construct the combo cab as closed back? that thing integrated with the amp sounded epic, actually preferred it to the head and 4x12.
I think the 6505 212 combo has been discontinued, and the 6505+ 112 is intended for that market niche. You might still be able to find one in stores. It is USA made
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The last option is a clean amp and get the distortion with pedals. This is probably the best option as you can still have it as a giggable amp if needs be.
I still vastly prefer a high gain tube amp for high gain tones, even at home volumes. Admittedly, as I said earlier, that does sort of depend on exactly what you mean by "home volumes". And obviously that's my own personal preference coming into play, too. EDIT: an od pedal used as a boost helps a lot, i find, in low volume situations.
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A number of amps have built-in speaker emulated DI outputs, so that might be an option for getting a cranked sound at home. The Blackstar HT have this, also the Hughes & Kettner Tubemeister.
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I have a Hayden Lil Mofo, which is 2W and perfectly reasonable bedroom volume. The gain is pretty thick and dark, although you will need a pedal to get black metal amounts of gain, unless you have super-high output pickups. It's quite a modern sound to my ears. It comes in a combo although the speaker is only 8", if that matters to you.
I tell you what is very popular on another guitar forum I frequent, the Orange Micro Terror with the addition of a fuzz or overdrive pedal. The Micro Terror is a hybrid, but an excellent one. I have one and it's good, but it didn't suit my dark SG. It also comes in a 8" combo. It's 20W hybrid and it gets LOUD when you want it to, but is fine for bedroom use too.