Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: gwEm on November 29, 2013, 11:32:51 AM
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i hesitate to post this, since its been addressed before, but on the other hand i'm not really satisfied with whats been posted in this area.
reading comments one would think the ceramic and alnico versions are poles apart. the ceramic super surgical and the alnico practically defining the word organic.
in fact i never really considered this until recently but i might be in the market for a ceramic warpig. so i listened to the clips and in fact the alnico and ceramic version don't actually sound *soo* very different.
so what shall i do? bear in mind i don't play modern metal - its hard rock and NWOBHM style all in standard tuning.
what i like about the alnico warpig:
* versatile - good clean
* huge sounding chunky distortion
* silly amounts of gain
* friendly mids
what i don't like about the alnico warpig:
* bass end just a little bit woolly. ideally i'd like it to be 10-20% tighter
* i'd like more aggressive sounding and present treble and upper mids - get some of that ceramic-ish tone
clearly, i'm prepared to make sacrifices here. i still want a pickup with silly gain and huge sounding distortion. i don't mind loosing some clean and some mids to achieve that. however, i don't want anything "surgical" or "sterile".
i like the alnico warpig alot, and will move it elsewhere probably, but its not quite right for this particular guitar.
would love to hear what you all think
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Miracle Man. I think that will make you smile if you haven't tried it. Also changing the Allen bolts to screws will balance the bottom end of the tone a bit.
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Hi Phil,
thanks for the reply. yes, I've tried the Miracle Man in this particular guitar and its also not quite there, sounds slightly fragile.
my warpig has the screw pole pieces also. i've set them up to bring out a bit more treble.
the guitar in question is a steinberger GP with a carbon fibre neck and a hard maple body - so a bit unusual.
edit - side note:
i'm playing a bit of pickup merry-go-round.
i had the miracle men in my red all maple steinberger where they sounded absolutely brilliant. i want to put them back there.
the miracle men are currently in my white carbon/maple steinberger. the neck sounds really good, but the bridge misses some thickness compared to when it was in the red guitar.
the alnico warpig is in my black carbon/maple steinberger. it is really good there but misses a bit of "shizzle". i want to put the warpigs in the white guitar which is more classy looking and i think it will be perfect. i want something like the warpig but more aggressive in the black steinberger as it is more rough and ready feeling.
this will leave a set of cold sweats (currently in the red steinberger) to do something with.
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Painkiller for a more aggressive sounding pickup? Are you downtuning?
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Painkiller for a more aggressive sounding pickup? Are you downtuning?
tried that first actually, too much attack with the carbon neck. standard tuning - no br00talz here ;)
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Someone recommended a 'wound G' for my downtuned Explorer the other day. He said that when he switched to a wound G all of his tuning problems disappeared. Then I asked what tuning he was using. Turns out it is G# standard.
There's downtuning and then there's br00tz. He was going for the br00tz. I just wanted a set of strings that would let me play Iommi leads in C# standard ;)
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There's downtuning and then there's br00tz.
I believe thats true, and it works the other way. i realised recently alot of the earlier Rammstein stuff was in E standard or drop D, even though its super thick.
Anyway, my tone is more of your NWOBHM E-standard JCM800 type of thing :)
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I'd be tempted to go Holy Diver, Rebel Yell, or Cold Sweat for that kind of thing. I guess out of the three the RY is the most 'aggressive' sounding. Otherwise an A-Bomb, but that's getting out of NWOBHM territory altogether.
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traditionally, i would surely agree. the carbon neck seems to change things though. the cold sweats have been tried, but weren't powerful/low-endy enough. they sound very iron maiden in the all maple one though.
thats why i thought it might be better to talk about where i want to go from the alnico warpig, which is the best attempt so far. the alnico warpig does have the thickness and push i am looking for at least.
the holy diver or indeed nailbomb (a pickup i don't usually like) could work though. i've got an open mind, but don't want to buy a bunch of pickups if you know what i mean ;) tim recommended the holy diver in fact for this application, a while ago. i worry it won't have enough push.
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Have you spoken to Tim about it? The only other pickups that come to mind for what you're asking for are the Aftermath and Juggernaut, however I haven't played either of them.
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Get C-pig mate...It will get you there you want...Tighter low end,more bark in center mids and sharper and agressive highs...I went exactly oposite route from C pig to A pig and itīs still there but more usable and of course more versatile...
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The Holydiver makes sense actually as it has the smoothness of the A-Pig and is certainly ideal for NWOBHM. It won't sound as fat, bassy or brutal as an A-Pig but does still tick a lot of your boxes. GuitarIV once told me that he was sure I'd love an A-Pig because I love the Holydiver and Crawler so much. He described the A-Pig as the next step beyond those pickups along with the Miracle Man. The only thing that makes me doubt the Holydiver was that you seemed to think that the Miracle Man wasn't 'enough' and to me, that's what sits between the Holydiver and A-Pig. The A-Bomb is the only other one that leaps to mind, though I normally only think of that one working in guitars with lots of mahogany.
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I'd say it's between the nailbomb and the new juggernaut
both should provide all the qualities you listed and fix what you're not liking about the warpig
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The Holydiver makes sense actually as it has the smoothness of the A-Pig and is certainly ideal for NWOBHM. It won't sound as fat, bassy or brutal as an A-Pig but does still tick a lot of your boxes. GuitarIV once told me that he was sure I'd love an A-Pig because I love the Holydiver and Crawler so much. He described the A-Pig as the next step beyond those pickups along with the Miracle Man. The only thing that makes me doubt the Holydiver was that you seemed to think that the Miracle Man wasn't 'enough' and to me, that's what sits between the Holydiver and A-Pig. The A-Bomb is the only other one that leaps to mind, though I normally only think of that one working in guitars with lots of mahogany.
The A-Pig in deed shares a lot of characteristics with the Holydiver, just having "more" of everything if that makes sense. I really enjoyed the one I played as much as I enjoy the HD. If you're looking for more aggressiveness in your sound though, you might look somewhere else. The A- or C-Bomb might suit you better, but that's just a presumption of mine.
edit: hooray I get to quote myself:
I played both the Ceramic and the Alnico Warpig, the A-Pig sounded great from Standard tuning to Drop C (that's the lowest I played it so far), very warm, fat and chunky with that "wall of sound" thing going on. It basically reminded me of a Holydiver on steroids, however I'm not sure how well it performs in lower tunings such as Standard-C and B.
The C-Pig sounded harsh and abrasive compared to the A-Pig, played that one in Drop-B, and to be honest I didn't like it at all, at least not for the style of music I play. Very well suited to Death Metal but the lows would get a bit too much and lose some detail with the highs being a bit unpleasant. However the pickup was freshly installed into an ESP Horizon with an Alder Body, Maple Neck and Ebony Fretboard and I didn't tinker too much with the height, so I don't wanna give you any false presumptions.
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I'd say it's between the nailbomb and the new juggernaut
both should provide all the qualities you listed and fix what you're not liking about the warpig
thanks for this Eric, and also the other view points.
i hadn't considered the Juggernaut, and had assumed it was a djent-only thing.
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I'd say it's between the nailbomb and the new juggernaut
both should provide all the qualities you listed and fix what you're not liking about the warpig
thanks for this Eric, and also the other view points.
i hadn't considered the Juggernaut, and had assumed it was a djent-only thing.
I have a Juggernaut, and it's sure as hell not a one trick pony.
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Are you using a tubescreamer (or similar pedal) in your setup? I find that tightens up the bottom end a bit, at least through my Peavey.
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I'd say it's between the nailbomb and the new juggernaut
both should provide all the qualities you listed and fix what you're not liking about the warpig
thanks for this Eric, and also the other view points.
i hadn't considered the Juggernaut, and had assumed it was a djent-only thing.
I have a Juggernaut, and it's sure as hell not a one trick pony.
Interesting to hear. BKPs generally aren't generally one trick ponies of course. But we've only really heard about the contemporary potential of the pickup. Do you think it would handle some metal of a more late 70s/early 80s nature?
I've sent a message to Tim so I hope for a definitive answer. I will keep you all updated here, because I think its an interesting problem. I am really into the guitar in question at the moment.
edit: and Tim recommended the Juggernaut. I'm in mind to take his advice. But would love to hear what people think.
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Far be it from me to question Tim because I respect everything the guy has to say about guitars and pickups, however, from an entirely personal perspective I'd be cautious about pulling the trigger on a Juggernaut right now for a few reasons.
There are a few people here who have tried the Juggernaut now and they seem to be impressed so that is very encouraging indeed but although there is talk of some versatility, that doesn't seem to have been very specific so far. I find myself always thinking that if it's so wonderful and so versatile, why haven't a liked a single clip I've ever heard from it? I've also noticed over the years that whenever a new pickup is released, for some months afterwards it gets a disproportionate number of recommendations from both forum members and BKP themselves. I think this is entirely natural due to the enthusiasm for the new product but it doesn't always give you the most balanced perspective. The Aftermath was also recommended extensively when it was first launched for loads of applications but it doesn't seem as widely talked about now.
I'm certainly not saying that you shouldn't buy a Juggernaut as it may be perfect for you and I'm pleased that other people like theirs; it's just that these are things I've noticed and would make me hesitate a little.
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I hear you Slartibart, and agree to a certain extent. Having said that though I've just listened to the Modern Metal Juggernaut clip and quite like it, though not so much the djenty section of that clip. The EQ characteristics seem to make sense too compared to the Warpig.
Comment from Tim was
"I'm actually going to suggest the new Juggernaut humbucker:
https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/pickups.php?cat=humbuckers&sub=contemporary&pickup=juggernaut
as this gives you that mid range weight and clear but full highs coupled with a faster bass response. It works extremely well for all styles of driven tone and has a great clean too."
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The Aftermath was also recommended extensively when it was first launched for loads of applications but it doesn't seem as widely talked about now.
The Aftermath has barely been mentioned since the Juggernaut was released. Seems that the Aftermath was a Misha fanboy pickup, and now that he has a signature pickup out they are all over that. They will have to pitch the Aftermath differently. Maybe some ads with Luc Lemay or something?
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I still have the feeling that the AM would be an absolute ace for modern metal in a baritone guitar, which is where I hope to stick mine someday. Right now it is lying around cause in a LP type there is just too much in ways of mids for me, could not quite get it to work. However in a baritone for me this and the BD (if I was not after just modern metal) would be killer. So I just wanne score a nice baritone and use that for Machine Head, In Flames and such. I am only talking bridge btw, the neck is still great modern lead PU for many situations and much overlooked (also does an amazing early Petrucci lead sound I think).
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This is why I was amazed at it being recommended for an SG once. To my mind it would be a complete mids-monster, almost unlistenable. https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=25405.0
But then again I find djent unlistenable ...
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But then again I find djent unlistenable ...
Maybe that's why I haven't liked many of the Juggernaut clips so far. I know it's been shown in styles that aren't djent but it still always sounds like a djent pickup to me. It's an area of the range that I think is starting to get a little congested now yet we still don't have anything that is similar to (and inevitably a massive improvement on) a Super Distortion.
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Yeah, I'm with you on that one. I'd like to see something to replace the SD rather than another djent pickup.
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Guys, I feel as a comunity we can do this, make BKP release their version of the Super Distortion. I know there are plenty of forum members round here that feel the need for a BKP that does what the SD can do and there are plenty of Seymour Duncan pickups that were created through their forum, so maybe if we open up a separate thread on this and get enough votes Tim and the crew might give it a shot :D
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^ I like this idea
My vote is for a SD that is tried-and-tested in an SG. If it works there, it should work elsewhere. If it were close to the Ibanez V2 that was used in the Iceman IC50 that would also be good ...
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Oh dear, have I started a revolution :D
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Thread started 8)
https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=31070.0
I'd really love a Super Distortion + to be built because while writing the first post for the thread it struck me that this is actually the pickup I want for my Vintage as it would sit between my Crawler and Holydiver quite nicely. :D