Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Tech => Topic started by: CommonCourtesy on July 09, 2014, 06:20:39 PM
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So I've had this problem for a few years now, my lower strings keep breaking at the bridge, the 5th and 4th ones especially. I have a Gibson Les Paul Studio in drop c tuning, and use 12-56's. When it kept happening before I started (and still am) using Big Bends Nut sauce in the saddles to lubricate it a bit, and the problem seemed to go away, I still had like 2 breakages in 2 years but significantly less than I did before. I change my strings every 3-4 weeks as I gig about 2-3 times a month.
My last break was in December 2013 and its been fine since, however I was riffing away and SNAP! The 5th string broke, I had applied the nut sauce to it last week, do I need to use it that often? I have also checked for any sharp edges or burrs and there appears to be none. I may wish to add I hadn't restrung for 5 weeks due to no practices and gigs. Don't know if that was significant.
I have a gig next Saturday and 2 practices before that, the next 2 Thursdays. I usually as a ritual restring the night before the show, but looks like they're going to get a few hours of play before I hit the stage.
So is it the string or the saddle that's the offending issue?
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Sounds more like you may have a sharp edge on the bridge - maybe a small burr of metal that you can't easily see.
I would have it looked at and maybe see if the contact surface can be smoothed. Nut sauce is good stuff but won't help if there is a sharp edge digging into the string.
Also it could be that the nut was cut for 10-46 and the grooves in the saddle aren't quite big enough for the 12-56 and as a result dig in a bit and ultimately cause string failure
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You could consider installing these saddles, but they will change the sound of your guitar a wee bit. I have one of their wraparound bridges with these saddles and I like it a lot. You get more harmonic content across the range but less in the 2KHz frequency, basically, but my SG Junior was a bit shrill in the highs anyway. The lower range harmonics are probably more useful for you anyway
http://www.graphtech.com/products/brands/string-saver/string-saver-originals-tune-o-matics
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Agent Orange - you forgot the link it seems
However I suspect the saddles jst need some attention
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Agent Orange - you forgot the link it seems
Cheers, I fixed it above
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Hmm if it's supposed to be the saddles 2 string breaks in 2 years is slightly strange? It'd break a bit sooner and more frequently I would think, unless the last breakage caused a sharp edge.
I've had it looked at before but cos the break always occurs at the saddle then it can't be anywhere else.
Have thought about graphtech saddles but like Agent says there'll be a change in tone.
Maybe the stock saddle is just a bit dodgy and I should switch it out? It has been set up for drop c and for 12-56's, for your information.
Might have to consider getting a guitar with a string through body!
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I had sharp saddle-edges on a Yamaha Pacfica. I broke many E-strings in one year. In your case it can't really be the saddle, though I would give them an inspection. I think it could be a bad string. I sometimes break them when setting up new strings and pull them heavily to stay in tune for a gig.
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Hmm if it's supposed to be the saddles 2 string breaks in 2 years is slightly strange? It'd break a bit sooner and more frequently I would think, unless the last breakage caused a sharp edge.
I've had it looked at before but cos the break always occurs at the saddle then it can't be anywhere else.
Have thought about graphtech saddles but like Agent says there'll be a change in tone.
Maybe the stock saddle is just a bit dodgy and I should switch it out? It has been set up for drop c and for 12-56's, for your information.
Might have to consider getting a guitar with a string through body!
I don't see how a string through body guitar will affect the string breakage issue (not doubting that it wouldn't be a nice guitar though)
If the string break occurs at the bridge then it figues that the saddles are the issue (if we have to find anything that needs looking at)
I'm presuming that you change strings quite often and that we are not just seeing the effects of string fatigue - especially if you pedal tone on the low E and A a lot.
Djent can be surprisingly hard on lower strings :shocked:
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"I still had like 2 breakages in 2 years"
one breakage a year is nothing to worry about I think..
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In the last six months I've broken two strings on my SG Junior, one string on my Explorer, and one string on my acoustic, all at the bridge. I've since changed to the string saver bridge on the Junior, but really two strings in two years is nothing!
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Hmm if it's supposed to be the saddles 2 string breaks in 2 years is slightly strange? It'd break a bit sooner and more frequently I would think, unless the last breakage caused a sharp edge.
I've had it looked at before but cos the break always occurs at the saddle then it can't be anywhere else.
Have thought about graphtech saddles but like Agent says there'll be a change in tone.
Maybe the stock saddle is just a bit dodgy and I should switch it out? It has been set up for drop c and for 12-56's, for your information.
Might have to consider getting a guitar with a string through body!
I don't see how a string through body guitar will affect the string breakage issue (not doubting that it wouldn't be a nice guitar though)
If the string break occurs at the bridge then it figues that the saddles are the issue (if we have to find anything that needs looking at)
I'm presuming that you change strings quite often and that we are not just seeing the effects of string fatigue - especially if you pedal tone on the low E and A a lot.
Djent can be surprisingly hard on lower strings :shocked:
It was just a thought and an excuse to buy more guitars haha.
What I've noticed is its ALWAYS one of the bottom 3 strings that has broken, and in the same place - at the saddle. I'll probably bring it in next week for you to look at, you might recall me coming in a few times before as you fitted my BKP's in it!
I change every 3 weeks so probably yes, cos it was left it on for 5 weeks it wore it out!
Djent can take its toll on the lower strings I agree! I'm a hard hitting mofo!
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Thanks for popping in with the guitar
Suspect it was a slight burr on the bridge saddles - the heavy strings seem to have left an impression of their wind in the slightly soft metal of the saddle material.
We gently recut the grooves in the saddles and smoothed them with Mitchell' abrasive cord (like a thread covered in wet and dry grade abrasive
Also took a smooth file to the flat faces of the saddles to eliminate any burr on that face too
Get all that smooth and add a little nut sauce to help the string glide and it should be ok - fingers crossed.
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No worries, thanks for fitting me in at short notice, hopefully it'll be ok at the festival next weekend!
Just wanted to mention the high e string broke on my strat yesterday after the nut was only filed on Saturday! Could this have been cos of the abrasive bending before the nut was filed or is there something else? I'm hoping its string wear but the string broke at the nut which is worrying, and so soon after it was filed to accommodate the high e string.
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So I've had this problem for a few years now, my lower strings keep breaking at the bridge, the 5th and 4th ones especially. I have a Gibson Les Paul Studio in drop c tuning, and use 12-56's. When it kept happening before I started (and still am) using Big Bends Nut sauce in the saddles to lubricate it a bit, and the problem seemed to go away, I still had like 2 breakages in 2 years but significantly less than I did before. I change my strings every 3-4 weeks as I gig about 2-3 times a month.
My last break was in December 2013 and its been fine since, however I was riffing away and SNAP! The 5th string broke, I had applied the nut sauce to it last week, do I need to use it that often? I have also checked for any sharp edges or burrs and there appears to be none. I may wish to add I hadn't restrung for 5 weeks due to no practices and gigs. Don't know if that was significant.
I have a gig next Saturday and 2 practices before that, the next 2 Thursdays. I usually as a ritual restring the night before the show, but looks like they're going to get a few hours of play before I hit the stage.
So is it the string or the saddle that's the offending issue?
This happened to me recently and this is how I resolved it: Take a piece of fine sandpaper, Like 400 grit (or finer) and fold it around a credit card, or something of that nature. Run the card thru the string saddles like a file to knock off any burrs or sharp edges that would catch on your strings. I haven't had the problem since.
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5th string broke again in practice on Thursday evening, first time in over a year I had a string break! The string was about 3-4 weeks old, I even changed out the lowest 3 strings the day of the last gig I did on 27th June, cos I sweat so much and wanted the strings as fresh as possible.
Does anyone know where I can get this "Mitchell abrasive cord" from? The only place I can see is from US sites and its going to take ages to get over here. Can't see a visible burr but could be cos of the thickness of the string its digging into the saddle slot and causing it to break.
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Sounds more like you may have a sharp edge on the bridge - maybe a small burr of metal that you can't easily see.
I would have it looked at and maybe see if the contact surface can be smoothed. Nut sauce is good stuff but won't help if there is a sharp edge digging into the string.
Also it could be that the nut was cut for 10-46 and the grooves in the saddle aren't quite big enough for the 12-56 and as a result dig in a bit and ultimately cause string failure
This right here. Pick up some abrasive cord in a few gauges and carefully clean out the saddle notches and round off the notches edges - gently. You only want to break off the sharp edge.
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Had the saddles smoothed out again, also raised the height of the tailpiece a bit cos the original position made the string touch the edge at an angle where the saddle is on the base against the edge of the metal. Now the strings don't come into contact with the edge of the saddle.
Had rehearsal tonight and everything is still intact at the moment!
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Nice! Hope she treats you well, brother.
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Yeah, if I get any further breakages in the next 3 months I may just give up and get a Jim Root tele haha. I noticed the tailpiece on my back up guitar (also a Les Paul) is higher and I never break strings on that, even though I don't use it much for band stuff and its got a lighter gauge on it (10-52). Can only hope this small adjustment is the fix it needed!
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It's usually something minor! Doesn't take much to pop a string.
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I've had this guitar for 5 years now and I must have experienced about 3-4 breaks in each year, always at the saddle. No other guitar with a saddle I've got has this problem, I started to believe there was a faulty saddle or even faulty strings!
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Daniel - I think that much of the problem may have been that the tailpiece was down hard on the body and the tension for the strings over the back lip of the bridge and consequently over the saddle was a bit punishing for the poor bass strings. It may be the reason also that the strings were marking up the saddles with string winding marks which in turn could be a burr than eats into the string.
Now that we raised the tailpiece it will help a lot to ease that for you. Just have to remember not to tighten it back down to the body when restringing or cleaning the guitar.
You could look to have the Tonepros tailpiece studs which will lock it in place and hold it at the chosen height
or look at the Faber tonelock parts we briefly mentioned - this is a series of washers that will hold the tailpiece at a height and lock it all down solid.
Here is a link: http://www.tokaiguitar.de/xtcommerce/product_info.php?info=p5_TL-ING--Inch-thread--nickel-gloss.html (http://www.tokaiguitar.de/xtcommerce/product_info.php?info=p5_TL-ING--Inch-thread--nickel-gloss.html)
Also be interested to hear how much disconnecting the tone pot helped with the sound.
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Thanks for looking at the guitar Jonathan, I think the raising of the tailpiece may just do the trick now, as I never noticed that it was making the strings rub against the edge of the saddle. I'm still going to change strings often though!!
And when I do change I'll change half at once before the other 3 so the tailpiece doesn't move.
Will definitely consider the Faber or Tonepro in the future, just hoping this fixes what was troubling me before.
Disconnecting the tone pot made the guitar brighter and somewhat louder, as I had to raise my noise suppressor threshold level! Presumably as the signal was now hotter, no more complaints from Mr bass man for being too "low-endy" haha.
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One of the main reasons I went for TonePros bridge and tailpiece sets on my Nashville type guitars is that the set up is locked in and the tailpiece and bridge stay solid even with all of the strings off the guitar.
The only PITA with that is that you lose the setup still if changing pickups on a 'batwing' SG as the bridge has to be removed to remove the pickups but that is not a concern with Les Pauls.
You can see the TonePros set in this photo (note the grub screws). I've also top-wrapped mine, which allows me to keep the tailpiece low while retaining a good break angle. It is more difficult to restring that way however and some brands of string don't like it too much. With the TonePros set the top wrap is aesthetic really, and makes no difference soundwise because the tailpiece is locked tight anyway at any height. You can see how the pickups mount to the pickguard, and the bridge does through the pickguard ...
(http://i.imgur.com/PA31HMz.jpg)
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Hm, that's interesting, never been a fan of top-wrapping as I find it loses its sustain. I may not even need to change my bridge and tailpiece hopefully but its something to think about should I get regular string breaks again in the next few months. As I mentioned before when I change strings I do it 3 at a time so the tailpiece never has to move so I won't accidentally lower the position inadvertently.