Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: one on September 17, 2016, 10:56:57 AM
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Hi, mates!
After almost a year of C-bomb use I'm considering changing it. My guitar is mahogany with walnut top, rosewood neck and ebony fingerboard. My amp an EVH 5153. I mean... it's not at all bad but while I love my Juggernauts in my other swamp ash seven stringer, god knows I've tried to like the c-bomb but I just can't stand the shrillness of that pickup. It sometimes sounds to me boomy, I feel it's treacherous, boosting all my mistakes and there's not to much sustain in solos, if you understand what I mean, palm muting sounds unfocused. Tweaking here and there in the amp and my multieffects I have ended up enduring playing it with my band.
Before ordering the pickup a couple of friends warned me about the C-bomb. They said it's the only pickup they utterly hate from the BKP catalogue. They are always praising the juggs and the painkiller. I was between the latter and the C-bomb and dediced to give it a chance. I should've listened to them. After all this time I'm considering giving it up and buying a painkiller or a C-hawk. The neck one is a Cold Sweat, which I am happy with. I play mostly metal, though I like plenty of styles from progressive rock to technical death metal.
What do you think about it? Will the Painkiller kill my pain?
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Having not tried a C-Bomb, I can't comment directly.
BUT, my Ibanez RG7421 MIJ has a Juggerset in it and my friend's Schecter (Maple neck, mahogany body) has a painkiller in the bridge. The Painkiller has lots of bite and definition in the highs. The pickup does need to be boosted with some amplifiers to tighten up the low end but I think this is endemic to 7 strings and not an issue with the pickup itself. Similarly, my RG needs to be boosted with some amps to tighten up the low end as well.
I have an A-Bomb in my Gibson Les Paul and that guitar has 10 - 46 strings and generally stays in E Standard / Drop D.
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Sounds like your guitar might be too bright for the C-Bomb. Walnut can be difficult to match pickups with. I would be careful in replacing it with something else.
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I loved the c-bomb in my 73 lp custom
sounded a bit dark, and more compressed than any other bkp I had, but in a good way
it actually pushed my amps harder, so it delivered more sustain than all the other bkp bridge models I had in the same guitar (riff raff, a-bomb, holy diver, black dog, aftermath, cold sweat)
it isn't really my kind of pup, but it sounded amazing with the stock 84 jcm 800 2203 I had
made that amp sound huge
based on your complaints, I'm not sure what yo recommend here
tighter sounding models with triple magnets, like the painkiller and aftermath, wil make your mistakes even more apparent
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Thanks for your help everyone!
Yeah, I also think the walnut top has something to do with the weirdness I find in this pickup-guitar combo.
In case I change it I'd go for Painkiller, Blackhawk or Impulse
I discarded Warpigs (I think too bassy, would pick those for a swamp ash or something alike) and juggernaut (I already have a pair).
It's not only that I look for a less unforgiving pup, I also want palm mutes more "in your face" and more rounded and warmer solo sounds, sorry, I'm terrible talking about tone.
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Personally, what I would do if the pickups in your other guitar are the same fitment (number of strings, leg length, etc) as this one I would try the Juggernauts out in the walnut top guitar and see if they work well there. The only worry would be time with the guitars in pieces, assuming you can do a bit of soldering and basic guitar setup yourself. Yo are not clear though even whether they are both seven strings, so this might not be possible. It would be the cheapest way to find out what might work
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I had a les paul copy with all brazilian woods: mahogany, rosewood board, imbuya top
some might call imbuya as brazilian walnut, but I'm not sure they are tone relatable
the guitar was extremely resonant but big and dark sounding
it had a bill lawrence pup (awfully scooped and single coily) and also a holy diver, a painkiller and a miracle man
I think the miracle man sounded best in it
palm mutes sounded huge and thumpy, without losing definition
the lead tone was amazing
I believe walnut is much brighter than brazilian imbuya, though, but I'm not sure
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Thanks for your answers. Yes, I already posted a pic somewhere in the forum:
(http://i.imgur.com/39Zar9P.jpg)
Juggs left, Cbomb right. Soldering scares the hell out of me, I don't want to damage anything. Anyway, it would be a temporal thing, because they are matched for each guitar, so...
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sweet
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Ok, I'll just stick to the Cbombs, By your answers maybe the change to PK wouldn't tame the highs and won't give me a more death metal thump palm muting. Plus, I should be getting used to change to the neck CS to make my solos.
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I've also got a C-bomb in my mahogany LP studio, and I know what you mean about it being a bit bassy and shrilly, its ok at the moment but like yourself I can't help but feel there's something else out there in the BKP range. I originally had an Aftermath too but found it too middy and washy for me. Haven't tried any of the other humbuckers to offer any advice unfortunately, but whilst the Nailbomb isn't a bad pickup, it might be a bit too high output/honky for my 6505+!
I have an Alnico Nailbomb in another guitar and it sounds great but its in a different tuning and model. I do more rhythm stuff than lead which might sway my opinion on them.
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Ok, I'll just stick to the Cbombs, By your answers maybe the change to PK wouldn't tame the highs and won't give me a more death metal thump palm muting. Plus, I should be getting used to change to the neck CS to make my solos.
I'd say the painkiller is probably the most "untamed" bkp model
but, like the nailbomb, it's a love-it-or-leave-it pickup
it does sound more in your face, it does deliver nice middy lead tones and it does have better low end definition
I think you should look into lots of clips and videos and see if you at least symphatise with it before making a move
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Thanks a bunch everyone for your help, perhaps I'll just go for the blackhawks in the future, but for now, I'll grow my love for the C-bomb for riffs and CS for solos :)
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This is what I got from a bkp expert, in case someone was wondering:
I could not disagree with your friends enough. The C-Bomb is super tight and clear, if its sounding boomy to you the problem may be with the inherent tone of the guitar or the amp. I also don't really like 5153's so that could be part of the problem. It is bright though, yes.
If you want something tight but not shrill, I would suggest looking into the Rebel Yell, Black Hawk, ceramic Warpig, or even some of the lower output models like the Mule and Black Dog. Also you may want to look into the Lundgren M6 (or M7 if youre talking about a 7-stringer). Tight as hell but thick.
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There's nothing wrong with EVH 5150 III amps. That someone 'doesn't like' them is irrelevant. What matters is that you have a certain guitar and a certain amp and you want a certain result. You are not getting that from that particular pickup. The expert is right in suggesting that it is the combination of elements that is the issue, but quite frankly he comes across as a dick in this reply. I don't know how you put the problem to him, maybe that is part of the issue. But basically you are working with these elements in pursuit of a goal and you are not achieving that goal.
I suspect that the issue is a mismatch between the acoustic properties of your guitar and the pickup.
The reason why I suggested trying the Juggs in your walnut guitar is that I suspect they might work okay there. Soldering really isn't that difficult, by the way. Main thing is that you make sure you don't touch the tip anywhere that it shouldn't be (e.g., your lovely wood or other wires in the harness).
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There's nothing wrong with EVH 5150 III amps. That someone 'doesn't like' them is irrelevant. What matters is that you have a certain guitar and a certain amp and you want a certain result. You are not getting that from that particular pickup. The expert is right in suggesting that it is the combination of elements that is the issue, but quite frankly he comes across as a dick in this reply. I don't know how you put the problem to him, maybe that is part of the issue. But basically you are working with these elements in pursuit of a goal and you are not achieving that goal.
I suspect that the issue is a mismatch between the acoustic properties of your guitar and the pickup.
The reason why I suggested trying the Juggs in your walnut guitar is that I suspect they might work okay there. Soldering really isn't that difficult, by the way. Main thing is that you make sure you don't touch the tip anywhere that it shouldn't be (e.g., your lovely wood or other wires in the harness).
Wise words, AO, thanks!
I also have the feeling the pickup doesn't take the wood combination or specific acoustics pretty well. Plus, I don't agree about the 5153 either, because it kills with my other three guitars. Do you think the Cpig will also fit this guitar since there are similar shared features with the Juggs? I'm leaning towards trying it with the C-hawks if not.
I will try to learn solder eventually, when I have a little time, maybe next summer. I think there's something important to learn for guitarrist, but I'll start practicing with an ibanez 520 I also have, before laying my big hands on my beauties :)
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I'm really not sure, because I am not an expert on seven-strings, walnut, or this kind of construction. I tend to stick to Gibson type six-strings, tune-o-matic bridges, 24.75" scale, lowest tuning C standard.
Has anyone got any wise words on walnut and it's effect on tone? I've heard a number of things but I am not sure how just a walnut top vs walnut body makes a difference.
I would go by how YOUR guitar sounds unplugged. If it has a relatively scooped sound I would go with a pickup that boosts mids relative to highs and lows. If it has a middy sound I would avoid middy pickups and try to find a pickup that is more scooped to even it out.
From what I have heard walnut tends to make guitars sound more scooped and from what you say it might be the slight scoop of the ceramic version of the Nailbomb that is the issue. You might have been better off with the alnico magnet.
Middy ceramic pickups can tend to be harsh. If you really like the Black Hawks I would tend toward the alnico version. Apparently they are very tight
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Thanks a lot, AO, splendid answer, I was also wondering about the ceramic kind of magnet as part of the problem here. I'll probably try the alnico blackhawk and come back here to tell you about it. :)
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https://youtu.be/7Pu5JEx5Deo
https://youtu.be/-wOUAcGBpws
https://youtu.be/Te9XK8KN5zg
https://soundcloud.com/don7v/skervesen-raptor-6-bare
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Great links.
Also see this one on the two Black Hawks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qacdnnbe2k
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Thanks, mates, the vids are great, though I had already seen most of them.
What is clear to me now is that I probably should go for an AV pickup.
1st option: A-hawk, impulse or even giving a chance to A-bomb (but I'm afraid the very high output also has something to do with my problem.
2nd option: Going more classic sound with Holy Diver, since the Miracle Man seems to have a huge amount of output, not to even mention the warpig, which I probably'd like because of my music preferences but it's too bassy.
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If you are looking for something in the ballpark of the Juggernaut in your other guitar the A-Hawk is probably your best bet. I have to say though that what little I've heard of the Impulse has been very positive
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Thanks, AO, good points, I'll make you know what I finally go for when I make my mind.
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the neck MM is not that hot, despite of the high dc resistance
reminds me of the neck VHII, but with more compression and sustain
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Thanks, Eric, though I don't have plans to change my neck CS, happy with it.
Now I just have to get to know the impulse better, because I know not much about it. The other contender, the A-hawk seems a good option, but I'm a bit scared the hi-fi character of that pickup makes it a bit sterile for me. I don't think so because I own a EMG 81/89 set and as I dig it considering it the paradigm of sterility, ehehe. I think I won't have problems liking the A-hawk at all then.
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Thanks, Eric, though I don't have plans to change my neck CS, happy with it.
ouch I actually misread your other post and confused with some other topic about neck pups
anyway, the miracle man isn't that high output
it actually feels less hot than both c-bomb and painkiller
it has a thinner wire, but it's not overwound like the nailbomb and doesn't have triple magnets like the painkiller
cleans up really really well
the leads have that ripping focused thing without sounding compressed
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To the OP:
The C-pig is not really as bassy as its made out to be IMHO. I had it in a All walnut strat style guitar and played through an Engl Fireball 100 which is an extremely bass heavy amp and it rocked. Don't get me wrong it accentuates the bass frequencies but it is TIGHT as hell and can even quack in the low end if that's what you want.
I moved on to the Painkiller bridge and was a bit worried it would be too bright and thin but turns out this is so far been my favorite BKP for thrash/death stuff. It handles gain amazingly well and with the utmost clarity, aggression and crunch in the mids. I had it in my all walnut Carvin ST300c and it absolutely slayed like no other. Palm mutes were huge, tight and menacing. High notes were open, articulate, bright but never harsh. The mids are so in your face, snarling, pissed off, and just pure awesome, if you like alot of mids of course. The Painkiller will handle all the gain and bass you can throw at it while remaining articulate and musical the entire time. Truly a work of art that pickup is :wink:
I pulled the PK two weeks ago and replaced it with the Rebel Yell bridge. Another awesome, ultra defined, tight aggressive pup. A bit less push and a tad more open sounding than the Painkiller. The low end is rounder than the PK but still tight as hell. The mids are searing with snarl and bite, and the highs again are bright, crisp and very present but not harsh. I like the Rebel Yell alot but plan on putting the Painkiller back in there because well... Its just that good :evil:
Here's a few clips I just put up in a Rebel Yell review thread I started last night. No studio magic, just a Zoom H2N sitting atop the empty box my Painkiller came in in front of my 2x12. No post eq'ing of any sorts.
As per always, excuse the slop and ....ty recording.
https://soundcloud.com/user-549632051/rebel-yell_original_savage-120_no-boost-straight-in_zoom0617wav/s-yAmq0
This the Painkiller_guitar straight into a Savage 120
https://soundcloud.com/user-549632051/savage120-no-boost-guitar-straight-in-0552wav/s-HCpDf
This is the Painkiller_guitar straight into a Savage 120
https://soundcloud.com/user-549632051/savage120-0550wav/s-29RR3
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Thanks a lot MHM
superb detailed explanation. Man, you know your pups!
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I found this video of Painkillers in a walnut top guitar
It might help
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swoT0fCy3DI
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Well, it does, although I was almost decided for the Impulse, omg :)
Can anybody tell me by the pics of my guitar, what would be the specific ordering details to match the Cold Sweat neck? I mean, it's chrome, but I'm not sure about the screws and maybe somebody knows that for sure at first glance.