Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: ibanez4life SZ on June 22, 2006, 06:48:35 AM
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Hey guys!
I realize there are very similar threads going, but the more opinions I can get before next week, the better, and all your help is greatly appreciated!
My band is going to puchase a recording setup next week. I have everything planned out....all I need to do is decide on what mic(s) I would like to mic up my dual recto.
I was originally planning on just a single mic...then I heard that having two different mics in different positions can give a very nice recording tone (better mix/representation)......
So what would you guys recommend for me? Will one mic be sufficient, or can you guys convince me to go with two? I'm willing to go with two mics tops......I was thinking that maybe a Shure SM57 and Sennheisser e609 would be an interesting mix....
All input is appreciated!
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i'd go for the 57
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SM57' s are pretty reliable and have been used for years. There are better mics around but the '57 does the job pretty well. If you can stretxh to a reasonable condenser mic also and use the signal from both. I think the SE1 mics are pretty good by all accounts but have not used them- they are inexpensive too. TO did an excellent post a while back.
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So is there really no point of running two dynamic mics in different positions?
So a condensor would be better to pair with it?
Sorry, but what brand is the SE-1 mic?
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I personally don't like the sound of condenser mics for guitar amps (not anything affordable anyway). I have some Groove Tube GT55s that are VERY nice mics indeed but an SM57 sound a million times better for guitar & will withstand the high SPLs infront of a blasting 4x12.
If you can get a ribbon mic that will withstand high SPLs then that would be my suggestion for a 'distant' mic. The Russian-made Octavia mics from always get great reviews and you can push it into service for vocals too if you want a different vocal tone (maybe for backing vox). If you have some serious cash to spend then get a Coles ribbon mic (favourate of Bob Rock and Steve Albini)
For another moving coil mic I'd suggest a Sennheiser MD421-II
:twisted:
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SE1 mics are made by a company called SE I think- I will check for sure though and will post again.
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Here is a link to GAK's site for the sake on convenience.
http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/options.php?id=10847
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:D Try this one
http://www.dv247.com/invt/2859
Havn`t tried it myself yet but will be seriously looking to buy one for my recording setup as well as a Shure SM57
:D 8)
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seriously lads, save your money - don't buy cheap condenser mics, they sound shite. you can get decent moving coil mics like the SM57 for cheap (around £75) but a decent condenser mic is gonna cost in excess of £250.
If you can find them, the best bargains are the discontinued Groove Tube mics - those are awesome and many places were selling them with upto 75% off.
:twisted:
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So what would be your suggestion on the two types of mics to get?
Two dynamic mics (SM-57 e609 types)? Dynamic and a different one? My budget won't allow for a quality condensor mic, as they are fairly pricey, so what else would you recommend?
What is your opinion on the dual dynamic mic setup (in different positions.....2 SM57's, Sm57 and e609)?
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You could also consider something like a Hughes and Kettner Red Box in addition to the SM57. It won't be as good as a decent condensor mic, but it will offer another sound alongside the SM57. I haven't used one of them, but I believe you can run 'em at the same time as you have your cab mic-ed. They are supposed to sound pretty good.
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But are the lower end condensor's of good quality? Or would I better better of with two dynamics in the price range?
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The only reason I suggested a condenser mic to accompany an SM57 ( which I think is a benchmark mic for the money and has performed well for many years) is because it can be great to have 2 differing recordings to be mixed together- this is a whole subject in itself. If you are considering a condenser and are on a budget and want a decent cheap condenser then the SE range always seems to get good reviews in respected mags such as Sound on Sound. There is no reason why you cannot get 2 sm57s and record from 2 different mic placings but you can get phasing problems and the effects can be, erm, underwhelming. On balance, I would say stick to one mic until your budget allows you to do more, read up on recording techniques- TO posted something on this forum a few months ago which was superb.
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I nicked these clips off a different Forum.
http://home.arcor.de/d.ter/gitarrenmikros.zip
There are different clips from these Mikes:
(1) Sennheiser MD441
(2) Sennheiser E906
(3) Palmer PDI-09
(4) Shure SM57
(5) Sennheiser MD421
There is also A Behringer DI-100.
I'd further recommend to check my clips in the thread below, which are made with 50:50 Mix of Palmer "The Junction" attached to the speaker out of the amp and a T.Bone SCT-800 Tube Mic 1m away in the room.
http://www.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4228
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I like to use a dynamic to record electric guitars and the like, and at times vocals, while I use a condenser for acoustics, vocals and that like. I also happen to like Audio-Technica and Shure.
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:D That was a great comparison test Hunter !! :D
The idea of recording with different types of mics is to give many different types of sounds you can then select one above the others to use or as 38th said blend`em together to help create one sound.
Remember you can also double track as well.
:D 8)
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I'll see how it goes! All your help has been great....maybe just going with one dynamic for now, and saving up for a good compressor later is the best idea.
How prone would I be to phasing problems with two dynamics? I guess I could always double track, like said....
We'll see how it goes! Thanks for everything, and please feel free to share any more info, as I have another week to think everything over.
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It's pretty easy to tell if you're out of phase. And it's just a click of a button to fix it if you're recording digitally.
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:D Hunter have now been able to check out the mics & prices BUT the Behringer DI 100 is a DI box ? not a mic
How or why would this help ?
:D 8)
EDIT ignore this as my brain has just started working !! :oops:
It`s a DI box that goes between Amp & Speaker as is the Palmer
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If you're just getting into recording you should spend lots of time experimenting with just a single SM57 on your cab. Listen to the effect mic placement has, i.e. on/off axis, distance from speaker etc.
Once you have played around with this, try incorporating a second mic. I personally prefer to add a Sennheiser MD421 close mic'd on a different speaker - you will notice that certain speakers sound better than others in a 4x12 and seem to record better (I have anyway)
The Sennheiser e606 and e906 look very interesting indeed - developed specifically for micing guitar cabs. I'll have to check them out.
Lastly, if you don't have a decent mixer then your guitar sound is always going to be compromised. I have found the Mackie mic preamps on their mixers to be of very high quality. You could alternatively go for a single rack unit mic preamp but these tend to be crammed with features more suited to recording vocals.
:twisted:
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:D Ok what happens if you want to go straight onto your PC what PC mixer would you recommend ?
:D 8)
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what do you mean by 'pc mixer'? :?
to record directly to you pc you will need to following setup (forget 'mic' inputs on soundcards, they are rubbish)...
mic >> mixer preamp >> soundcard input >> recording software
SM57 >> Mackie 1604 >> Delta1010 >> Cool Edit Pro
good quality soundcards are very cheap these days, I would stand behind my recommendation of the Delta1010 100%, same with the Mackie mixers. Mackie mixers are have the same mic preamp so even the basic model still sounds great.
:twisted:
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:D I`ve been using a all in one 8 track. Boss1180CD & i hate it it`s shite so i`m looking at upgrading to a PC based recording setup. I was thinking about getting a Laptop & doing it all on that so i could book time in a rehearsal studio take in the laptop & plug in so that i could really drive my amp hard & record it. It would be alot lot cheaper than studio time & it would be less preasure.[ i sufer "red light" fever when recording ! :P ]
A recent thread warned me & some of the others off of this idea as Laptops bring with them there own problems. I live in a little flat so it`s impossible to record here. My problem is i want seriousley good quality recordings.
I`ve never done any recording on PC before so this is all new to me. I need simple to understand & use systems that`ll give really professional finish`s. I`m a complete novice when it comes to PC recordings so all the info & advice you can give is very very much apreciated. If i ask what may appear to be [to you guys with all the experience] silly questions then just indulge me !! :D
How much would the setup your talking about cost. Not including the cost of the PC ?
:D 8)
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since you're already in London, get yourself along to Turnkey just off Denmark Street & have a word with that lot - they really know their onions in there.
:twisted: