Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
At The Back => The Dressing Room => Topic started by: genocidal tendencies on September 13, 2006, 04:42:13 AM
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Strange topic, and even stranger place to post it I know but of all the internet forums I can think of you lot are probably in general the sanest.
Basically I'm wondering if anyone's ever been to see a psychiatrist? I'm thinking it might be a good idea, but I'm not insane or chronically depressed or anything so I don't need one as such. It's just that there are a few things about myself I'd like to explore and change, anyone know what I mean? Also, how in the name of all that is holy do you actually find these people? The only way I've ever heard of is being referred by a GP, and if at all possible I'd rather not have to stick pencils up my nose and pretend I'm blackadder...
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I've seen a psychiatrist, some psychologists, and everything in between. I've also studied psychology and counselled many people over the years.
I strongly recommend against going to see one. Most of the time you'll walk out more of a mess than you went in. If you're truly unlucky you'll be given presciption drugs for one thing or another and come away more messed up than you can imagine.
There's a quote from Crocodile Dundee on this topic that goes something like this:
SUE: He's seeing a psychiatrist.
MICK: What's that?
SUE: Well, it's a doctor he goes to, to talk about his problems.
MICK: What for? Doesn't he have any mates?
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From what you've said if you feel you simply need to explore some history you do not need a psychiatrist and there are many more appropriate routes.
I don't want to pre-judge anything you might be going through or feeling so if you want to PM me or post again in the open forum with more detail I'll do my best to point you in the right direction in a totally non-judgemental way.
Here are some great links and resources for you to clarrify your thoughts and learn more.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/health/conditions/mental_health/
http://www.mind.org.uk/
http://www.sane.org.uk/
If these links seem like overkill then that's all good.
If you are simply looking for self improvement / transformation - I warn you there is a minefield of gurus and tools - be very careful who you choose to follow.
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A good friend of mine (an excellent guitarist) was truly messed up by what is known as "British justice" and after many years of sufferring, was referred to a psychiatrist and ended up on medication which sent him off in a very bad direction. Fortunately, through the help and support of a bit of what is called alternative therapy, mates and family, he quit the medication and slowly but surely got back to a place where life is not all bad. Based on his experience (not fair to judge them all I know), a psychiatrist is the very last place I'd go if I wanted to understand myself. As Dave says, be wary of who you check out. There are, for example, great hypnotherapists and very poor ones. There are tons of "self-help" books out there- the advantage is that they are cheap and you can put them down (or in the recycling) if they don't do it for you.
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It's just that there are a few things about myself I'd like to explore and change, anyone know what I mean?
Think I know what you mean, but think about it - how much can someone help you with this who might not at all have outstanding experience or capabilities, but has just done certain studies that are designed to helping people who have lost their sanity.
The danger is indeed (as others said) that he is going to treat you like if you were incapable of fullfilling your social and professional duties without despair.
Probably reading some good books that can give you a kick in the right direction or starting to thoroughly plan the changes you are looking to achieve would help you more, if there are no mates with the necessary depth and experience to help you through it.
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Just to chip in (no change there then), I would agree with what has been said here. Having been treated (pretty unsuccessfully for depression) and my wife spending 5 weeks in the care of these 'professionals' I will give you these observations.
Firstly they adore medication, give them the a hint of a problem and they have their perscription stationary out.
Secondly they form an opinion and will continue to make things fit that inital poinion regardless of further evidence.
Unless you have to see one I would say avoid them like the plague as Searcher said they will often make things worse.
Personally my GP was of greater help to me than the psychatarist (a phamacologist my GP consulted with went ballistic when he saw the medication doses the psychaterist was perscribing me).
If you have to explore something there are several methods, your GP for example can give you a referral for 'cognative therapy' which allows you to 'explore' things which may be a source of worry or irritation to you.
An ex boss of mine found that Trancendental Meditation helped some of his issues.
Rob...
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It does sound more likely that a counselling service is more likely to be useful - certainly iniatially.
A chance to arrange your thoughts about what has gone on in the past and understand it better.
Some people are very lucky and have a sensible and impartial friend or family member that they can turn to to talk things through.
Most people have need for something like this at some stage in the lives - it's like a "pit stop" for the mind. The fact that many never get a chance to do it is a shame in many ways
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Most people have need for something like this at some stage in the lives - it's like a "pit stop" for the mind. The fact that many never get a chance to do it is a shame in many ways
I like the Pit Stop analogy...
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Yo its hard to give advise unless u say whats wrong with you. Psychiatrists are for people who are mentally ill tho and I don't think you should go see one unless you see no alternatives.
My father is a psychologist so I have a fairly good idea about this kind of stuff.
I think everyone gets down at some point, you would have to be 100% ignorant to be happy all the time. You just gotta make the best of what you got, if somethings bad change it no matter whar u gotta do. One thing never to do is get heavily drunk or take drugs as this makes things worse trust me.
I have a very close friend who is really messed up hes had a bad life and pretty much a recluse, hes been on meds, come off them no joy. I tried to help him but nothing seems to work, sad thing to say but as my old man sais sometimes u just gotta let em get on with it, oh well ho hum.
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:D And i`m the other end of the spectrum.
I was really messed up for about 10 years & had got into a serious rut. No work, no descent housing, No future & no Prospects it was a very very bad place to be. I went to see my Gp he refered me immidiatly to a crisis team who inturn got me into see a Psychiatrist & to be fair it helped me get my head together big time. But i did need to see a psych. If you have a few issues to deal with then maybe a Psychotherapist might be more what your after. Your local authority will have lists of local psych`s that they recommend. Give `em a call
As for the drugs bit they use drugs to help stabilise people whilst trying to help them, Its not allways sucessfull. I personnaly decided not to take any of the drugs. But to be fair i didn`t need serious medication anyway
:D 8)
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As for the drugs bit they use drugs to help stabilise people whilst trying to help them, Its not allways sucessfull. I personnaly decided not to take any of the drugs. But to be fair i didn`t need serious medication anyway
Unfortunitely they overdo the drugs side of things (it's cheaper and requires less effort). They perscribed my wife lagactyl (perscribed on price not effectiveness) and in 5 weeks hospitalisation she saw a doctor twice (30 minutes total).
It's not to devalue what they do for anybody who requires their services.
But once the 'professionals' decide on a diagnosis (often from case notes) you are stuck in that catagory and anything not agreeing with this diagnosis is usually twisted to fit or discarded.
Having several friends involved in the mental health world (in a professional capacity) and their biggest worry (apart from lack of funding) is the inability for consultants to reappraise an diagnosis (and any associated medication). Whhen it's something as deep as mental health it is an incredebably worrying attitude.
Still if it want for them and my GP I may not be here, but it still worries me.
Rob...
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I just looked at those links and i've realised that i've been suffering from work related stress. no shite! when you work the hours i do i surpose it's hard NOT to get stressed.
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you lot are probably in general the sanest.
Are you sure? We have got Sambo after all :drink:
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Some people try to 'find themselves' and go to Tibet or a South American Rainforest.
I'm never in Tibet, and I'm never in a rainforest so there's very little chance I'll find myself in one of those places.
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I went to find myself but I wasn't in.
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I went to find myself but I wasn't in.
I went for an IQ test, it came back negative.
:P
i can dig the 'pit stop' thing.
I think back a few years where i was suffering from migraines alot and my GP thought it was stress\depression related so he gave me some light anti depressant medication, it just made me hungry so i ate loads lol... stopped that quick, made no difference in helping me really.
BT we're right, its GOOD to talk... better out than in etc etc
I would explore mates \ free services before professional ones. Hell, start a blog and fill it with what you want, the net can still be anonymous and you can always delete afterwards or get feedback on your thoughts
I could go into a rant and turn EMO but i wont, lets just say i could do with one aswell... going to check out those links.[/quote]
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Are you trying to 'unlock' certain areas of your brain you didn't know existed or just tying to change the things you don't like about yourself for the better?
For what you are describing I'd say you are looking down the barrel of some kind of meditation perhaps? Save your cash and buy a new guitar when you feel a better :D
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see a priest and drink a pot of tea, even if you're not catholic or whatever (i'm not).
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Yeah, psychiatrist is not the way to go.
If you feel that you have serious emotional issues such as cripplingly poor self esteem, uncontrollable anger, severe anxiety etc, then you probably need to see a psychologist. You can access these through your GP, but you may need to wait 8-12 weeks for an appointment (although studies have shown that the very act of seeking help creates a measurable improvement in people). If you don't want to wait then you can probably find a private one though the yellow pages or at your nearest complimentary therapy centre.
If you feel that you have some issues to work through, or there are aspects of your life that you are struggling to understand or come to terms with then a counsellor is probably the best initial option. These are usually accessed in the same way, although many large employers now offer counselling for staff as well, and the wait/cost will probably be less.
Or, you can always go to the pub with me 8)
There are numerous good self help books on the market as well, and as long as you steer clear of the wackier or slicker stuff then there's some really good info to be had. There's a really good sries on cognitive therapy which are titled "Overcoming..........With cognitive therapy techniques"
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It's just that there are a few things about myself I'd like to explore and change, anyone know what I mean? .
I do know what you mean by the above, and I guess that many of the other members here can relate to a greater or lesser extent - whether they be 15 or 50.
We all find ourselves doing some things over and over, even when we know we shouldn't or that it doesnt bring the right outcome. You know- "that thing" that when you look back at what you have done you feel frustrated or disappointed with yourself.
We all get conditioned in one way or another and often the way we react to a particular stimulus is from a deep ingrained response rather than being a response that is carefully thought through based on the evidence before you.
Things can trigger a response whether be it emotional, mental or even physical and somehow the thing that triggers you off isnt always so relevant to the state it puts you in.
For myself it has previously been responding to situations with a new girlfriend based on expectations of where a particular train of conversation might be going based on the nightmare arguements with a previous girlfriend (who was a neurotic disaster).
I found that reading helped and what proved to be a complete turning point was getting an iPod and finding some audio books that got me thinking differently ( I was travelling a lot at the time so had time to listen)
I tended to listen to the stuff, stop the player and think about it all and maybe listen again . Just got the grey matter processing in a different way.
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I have been told that the following are quite good (my wife has the former title)
Embracing change : Tony Burzan (part of the mind mapping series)
an I have been told that the Anthony Robbins books are pretty good.
One of the most useful bits of offical help I received was list making (this is featured in many self help books).
It helps you to decide how you are (really) feeling, your prioritys and what you need to do to improve things.
Other things like working too many hours coupled with not eating properly can cause what would normally be an irritation to become a monster.
Food supplements can make a considerable improvement in how you feel (Mr 38 seems to know about this).
The humble GP is usually an wonderful resource if help even if it's not a physical health matter. A company doctor (if you have the option) is often an even better option as they have more time to listen and are better resourced. Plus (I know this sounds very cynical) it often means you can get some assistance much earlier simply becasue it will save your employer money.
Rob...
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Rob's right about supplements.In theory they should not be needed if you have a good balanced diet.The reality is that a lot of so called fresh produce isn't and has little nutritional value left- which is good for Mrs 38th as she has a health store. The importance of good nutrition cannot be overemphasized- it will help with the prevention of the majority of commonplace ailments-physical and mental. If everyone ate only good fresh truly organic food, the annual health bill for the majority of countries would plummet and would therefore upset a lot of pharmaceutical companies so lets hope that doesn't happen :roll: Mrs 38th could go on for ages about essential fats and their effect upon mental wellbeing. All this is slightly off topic but it is something I feel strongly about and have spent a great deal of time looking into. Tony Buzan's books are all good too.
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soul searching, meditation and a complete detox, no beer for months.. clear thinking, early nights and restraint.. just see what u discover about yourself.
better for your mental health than seeing someone who might diagnose you with something you dont have... but if u have serious problems go see someone.
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As a practitioner of the practice being discussed, this thread caught my eye. Is mental health care over there really as fouled up as it sounds? Are the psychiatrists there really that stuck on medications only? I've treated tons of people with many different modalities, from traditional psychotherapy to medications to full-spectrum light to naturopathics to ECT to, on occasion, a good, stiff "What in the hell is wrong with you?" I've seen all of these things work well, and I've seen all of these things work poorly. No matter why a person comes to see me, I figure it's my job to help them not need to see me!
cjpm
the "head" doc
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Well this has been oddly popular.
As for more details, it's just things like I have a bit of a superiority complex, I tend to be a bit self absorbed, that sort of stuff. Really nothing serious, but I figure I'm 17 with a lot of time on my hands so I may as well do something about it. You guys are probably right, a psychiatrist is a bit extreme, so thanks for the various suggestions and witticisms, I'll bear them in mind. Except the no beer one, that's just stupid.
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...it's just things like I have a bit of a superiority complex
Great news, I have the perfect cure for that - just meet up with me and you will soon realise how vastly inferior you are to me in looks, intellect and talent!
I am also kind and benevolent - which is why I have taken this time out from my busy day to cure you…
Go in peace young man and let this affliction trouble you no more….. :roll:
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...you forgot modest.
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As for more details, it's just things like I have a bit of a superiority complex, I tend to be a bit self absorbed, that sort of stuff.
Beleive me thats much better than an inferiority complex.
As for self absorbed that's being 17 ;) wives manage that well into old age :)
As for avoiding beer, although it's one of the 4 basic food groups (beer, donuts, caffine & kebabs) sometimes it's a good idea to avoid anything that is mood altering if you are not 'on form'
Rob...
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As a practitioner of the practice being discussed, this thread caught my eye. Is mental health care over there really as fouled up as it sounds? Are the psychiatrists there really that stuck on medications only?
Unfortunitely it seems that the answer is often yes it is.
Partially I feel it's because of a lack of accountability in the Health Service, the sheer workload and the pressure to reduce costs all contribute. To me this means that once a course of action is settled upon it is seldom reappraised (there is no pressure to do so)
Ok treatment that improves matters is a good thing, but the right treatment is a much better option and that takes time, money and the will to discard an earlier diagnosis.
Rob...
Rob...
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Well this has been oddly popular.
As for more details, it's just things like I have a bit of a superiority complex, I tend to be a bit self absorbed, that sort of stuff. I'm 17 with a lot of time on my hands
I would recommend volunteering to give some time helping others.
There are plenty of opportunities to get involved helping others less advantaged or less able than yourself.
Whether it is helping with the elderly, young people (even coaching sports or activities) or people with disabilities
This would serve several purposes
Get you mixing with new people and seeing the complexity and value in their lives and allow you to focus less on your own abilities or qualities.
Give you perspective on what gifts you have been given and allow you to be grateful for them - gratitude is a very powerful emotion and can help balance your focus
You may still see yourself as more able and talented, but it my have the benefit of humility to go with it and the determination to use those skills and not allow them to go to waste
I guess you also have college type studies too unless you have joined the workforce already ....so you may not always have so much time on your hands
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How about Tai Chi or yoga, both are good are allowing to you to meditate and reflect in ways that we don't often get chance to, great for the health too and no bad side-effects whatsoever.
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I dunno if this has been said, I dont have time to read the whole thread at the moment, but its a proper scientific fact that exercise helps with depression. I doubt it would bring you back from the edge of suicide, but the endorphines help re-esablish a healthy chemical balance in the brain.
We all have some terrible times in life and I really hope you get sorted by whatever way is right for you.
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My dad did a university backed study of psych's of all types...a team of academics he worked with came to the conclusion (informally) it was little better than pub talk....no I am not joking.
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My last post sounded flippant. It was not meant to be. I am not going to go into detail, but you are not alone in how you feel. It's not any easier to take, but all you are being is human, it's when you stop feeling that you should worry. The modern world is built for machines, politicians and businessmen not humans.
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Not convinced about tai chi or yoga (I already have enough trouble convincing people I'm straight) but some form of martial art is definitely a good idea. I'm not sure right now where I'll be for this next year but when I know I'm going to look into doing something like that. Muay thai ideally, but it depends what's available.
As for volunteering and helping people, it's a nice idea in theory, but it wouldn't work because I just don't get on with people. At all. I always seem to just upset them and make myself angry.