Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
At The Back => Time Out => Topic started by: hunter on January 21, 2007, 10:43:55 PM
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I mean, let's face it, low cost instruments are really getting better in quality. Think of what you can get for 200 Euro from Vintage or even more traditional brands.
Think what you got 15 years ago for that money. Or even worse, in the 70s, guitars with plastic parts all over the place and microphonic pickups and electronics that fell apart after 2 months.
Are there still real cr@p guitars on the market?
Post your links if you find one ...
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yes there are.
the lowest ibanez line, apollo, SX guitars feel like toys (at least the ones in the 200$ range .. havent seen any higher priced ones)
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I think there ae guitars that are absolutely cr@p for their price (pretty much anything that says Gibson on it for a start), but I don't think there are many unplayably bad guitars for sale in the UK these days.
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the market's getting more and more competitive, which is great - anything that's no good goes bust nowadays :D
Fender and Gibson seem to be slipping in their quality control - If they carry on down the route their taking, i'd like to say they'll be going bust too - but i seriously doubt it with such established names.
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We find that we are busier than ever in our workshop doing setups and fret-dressing on fairly new guitars.
I think that the quality of what you get for your money has shot up over the years, but many do not leave the factory playing as well as they might.
It does seem that some shops that have in-store techs and workshop facilities often have then adjusted to make them more tempting to buy.
However there is a lot of buying online for best price from "box- shifters" who may give you the best price but the guitar is untouched from the factory.
Some folks spend some of the money that they save by buying online by paying for a decent set-up or a fretdress and set-up which can result in an excellant playing guitar - no matter what name it has on the headstock
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From what i can tell from the short time I've been playing, the spec "on paper" seems to be improving, but this doesn't always translate to a better guitar, much like feline said.
I know when I started playing (around 2000?), you wouldn't have seen a guitar under about £800 with name-brand pickups stock on it. Now you can get guitars with duncans for under £300.
However, I think at least some of this is to sucker newer players into thinking they're getting a pro guitar ("it has duncans! wow!"), since you can clearly see the "Seymour Duncan" written on the pickup. You can't judge the quality of the wood in the guitar just as easily as that, especially if you're a less experienced player.
To be able to afford to give you quality hardware and electronics, they have to cut corners elsewhere- worse wood, worse quality control, etc., etc. They frequently give you name-brand pickups with cheapo pots and wiring, which is retarded.
That's not to say quality isn't improving- but it's maybe not improving just as much as it would appear.
I'm probably biased against big guitar companies, but there you go. Few of them have done anything to make me feel any different. Too many are willing to sell something on a false premise (the amount of amps which are claimed as "true class A!" only adds to that) to persuade me otherwise.
EDIT: back on topic, I've played plenty of guitars I wouldn't want to buy. Recently.
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I know when I started playing (around 2000?), you wouldn't have seen a guitar under about £800 with name-brand pickups stock on it. Now you can get guitars with duncans for under £300.
You have to wonder where those pickups are being made
If said pickups would have a retail value of £150 here and you get a whole guitar with them for £300- either the pickup manufacturer is supplying manufacturer with USA made product for pennies (which I cant see) or has found a way to manufacture them cheaper somehow or somewhere
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Might be that manufacturers like Seymour Duncan make very low rates for guitar companies like ESP, Heritage ... just to have a positive image effect.
The margin might be really low on this supplier business, and therefore they print their brand name on the pickup and have more upgraders buy their brand ...
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Also, it might be worth mentioning that over the last couple of years, the popularity of the electric guitar has shot through the roof, giving us a huge wave of beginner guitarists, leading to a huge demand of cheap, beginner's guitars.
As a result, most guitar manufacturers and music shops are trying to provide for these beginners more than anyone else, so a good guitar is harder to find.
And I think that while low-end guitars are getting better, most of the high-end guitars are getting worse (ie, fender and gibson). I think this is largely because companies with bad reputations have to prove themselves worthy of being bought, whereas large reputable buisnesses can bludge off their name.
Rant over
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i think fender are miles infront of gibson in terms of quality control, i've never played a bad Deluxe USA strat or Tele.
theres always room for improvement for sure but they're pretty damn good.
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I think there are bad guitars out there, yes. I've seen and played bad examples of £300 Epiphones and £1000+ Gibsons. Price does not always reflect quality.
What I've found in the last few years though is that you can get very good guitars for very reasonable money. Two examples from my collection for you:
New Epiphone '65 SG. Bought for £350 as my gigging guitar. Fully pimped up with Riff Raffs, CTS pots, new nut and bridge etc. Owes me £650ish. The best SG I've played and heard so far, and I've tried everything up USA Standards at £900+.
Used Epiphone Casino. Bought very recently for £425 including hard case. 2004 model, nicely played in, mint condition, had a pro setup and (I think) upgraded wiring. Total Beatles vibe and very bluesy - it's hard to put down!
New or lightly used you can get cracking guitars for under £500 now. For that amount of cash you could also squeeze in upgraded electrics if you're handy with a soldering iron (or willing to learn). Guitarists have never had it so good. I will add though, that I've played other examples of the above two gutars and none were as good as the ones I have (one '65 SG had a horrendously mis-matched body grain, sloppy paint finishing and a clubby feeling neck; one Casino had a broken selector switch, on-off pots and a rattling bridge). You have to try several out until you find the one for you.
Now if only the amp world would do the same thing. There's the odd steal (Epi Valve Juniors, Laney GH-Ls etc) but generally you gotta pay big bucks if you want something new that's "great".
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i think fender are miles infront of gibson in terms of quality control, i've never played a bad Deluxe USA strat or Tele.
theres always room for improvement for sure but they're pretty damn good.
I agree. Fender do all the things I normally do myself on a new guitar - fit Schaller straplocks, file the edges of the nut so they're not like razors, and actually adequately shield the body cavities! All they need is a change of pickups. :wink:
Having said that, whoever put together my American Ash Tele decided to re-drill the neck-mounting holes in the body and totally f*cked it up. But I like to think of that as a one-off aberration by some idiot who had too much to drink the night before. Hope he's been sacked by now.
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However, I think at least some of this is to sucker newer players into thinking they're getting a pro guitar ("it has duncans! wow!"), since you can clearly see the "Seymour Duncan" written on the pickup. You can't judge the quality of the wood in the guitar just as easily as that, especially if you're a less experienced player.
ding ding ding ding ding, we have a winner!!!!
remind me to buy you a beer in london!
that is what most people think.. it has quality parts, but that doesnt mean it's a good guitar.. who knows what wood it's been made of, does it need a fret dress, or even re-crowning (low end epis and ibanez guitars especialy.. horrible horrible)
like i said, they look good on paper, but what's underneath the paint?
like the ongoing jacskon/ltd arguement.. ltd has all this name brand stuff, where jackson (only recently) got just name brand pickups.. and they're still a bit more expencive, so people go for ltd, cos they think they get more bang for the buck.. if you want real bang for the buck, buy used 80s'early 90's ibanezes, jacksons/charvels. that's where the gems are
i know for a fact that duncan tried to shift regular production models over to korea (where their duncan designed pups are being made), but cos people said they buy USA products, for the quality, cos who knows what quality the MIK will be, and that they would lose a lot of their customers, they (for now) left the production in the santa barbara facility.
for dimarzios, i wouldnt be surprised if they were already made overseas. i had a PAF pro in my hands the other day and the build was so flimsy.. it looked like it would break :P dunno.. maybe it was tinkered with, but the guy claimed it was new... but over in these parts you never know
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i had a PAF pro in my hands the other day and the build was so flimsy.. it looked like it would break :P
How dare you even touch one ... you know that you can get the measles from pickups that aren't the one and only right make :P
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i had a PAF pro in my hands the other day and the build was so flimsy.. it looked like it would break :P
How dare you even touch one ... you know that you can get the measles from pickups that aren't the one and only right make :P
LOL
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It's been great marketing for SD. If they take a bit of a hit on selling bulk trade orders, they're making it up A) in the sheer increased turnover (SPQR), after all, there must be somekind of ceiling which limits how many Pups they can sell as aftermarket, and they've already invested in all that R+D and machinery. B) In exposure. Dimarzio must be REALLY hurting at the moment, because Seymour has pulled the rug out from under them in a big way. Pretty much every guitar with 3rd party pickups now has either SD or EMG, and so now when you think pickups (unless you're us) you think SD and EMG.
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Agree with alot said here.
Cheap guitars are getting better. But they're still cheap guitars - And therefore get replaced fairly quickly.
Expensive guitars are getting worse, much worse. Played some les pauls recently and only 1 of about 4 were playable... This is similar to a guy I know who had to rummage through a guitar shop's entire stock of 12 Les Pauls to get one he'd actually want to hand money over. Which ended up ofcourse in a colour he didn't want as much - He bought it anyway.
High end Korean guitars are getting better than low end US or Japanese guitars I've noticed which is a plus for specs in the whole specs vs setup war.
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Yeah Maverick are MIK and they have one of the best factory setups available on the market. Add to that they will not allow a shop to deal them officially unless they take a course to learn how to setup a guitar perfectly and efficiently plus the guys who own it are all really nice in person.
I would never dare lose my Maverick, which I bought second hand through a registered dealer. It had 11's on it, which is still my preferred guage to this day, and easily outplayed a second hand top range Ibanez RG in the same shop.
The only guitar which came near was an Alvarez, which didn't sound as good.
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well.. if you look at it from the other end of the spectrum (not us, who want top quality in everything, from pickup to amp)
the guitars are amazing for starters. they already got good parts for the most part and as a starter guitar it's really good. it's NOT for the musician who demands a certain level of workmanship, but for the aspiring guitarist, who doesnt know anything about wood and construction, let alone difference between frets/nut on a poor vs good guitar.
for that, they are amazing.
now only the amp market has to step up... we already got the lil epi amp, which i hear good things about, the laney VC10 and the LC15 (which i must try out the non reverb edition)
so i say.. yea, today are good times for the low and medium to high market for us musicians, as you can get pretty much anything without overpaying (much)
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Is it not alot to do with supply and demand?
Figures show the massive boom in guitar playing and buying. Why would a company capable not step in to fill the void.
For instance Gibson making it's 'female' friendly Vixens etc. is at least a good marketing step (although wether a female, none I have known, would buy one as they wanna be seen on equal terms is less a forgone conclusion).
Gibson have 'dropped the ball' for years, nothing new there and no-one seem's to be able to give a better answer.
As for new guitars needing set-ups. Of course some do. Hell alot of new cars (which cost ALOT more than a guitar) should never leave the showroom as they do. Price to sell.
A new'ish' phenomenum is taking over, global internet marketing. To my mind (the masses) are caring less about quality/customer service/longevity than price (this is across the board).
This is a two way street. How many on here rave about great deals (many on the internet). Who would go to a shop to try a guitar that they will then buy cheaper online? Many I would expect, human nature.
Is this hurting the industry though? Doubtful, just the mom and pop store.
We have way more choice now than ever and stores are having to compete to survive.
Now in a market as huge as the US this is great. For a smaller market like the UK this is more aggrevating as we don't have the big chain stores. However we all should win.
Guitars are like anything else, they are a tool to use, wether it be a learner, a moderate player or a pro. And all have their place.
Many will not be perfect and many will be cheaply made, but if they serve their purpose, job done.
I would not buy a child a £800 instrument only to find they get bored with it within days. Cheap guitars have a place.
A Ford Fiesta gets from A to B and does it's job, yet it is not a BMW or Mercedes. All have a certain ratio of cost to sales price, but research on what one requires would derive a decision.
I would fathom buying power has alot to do with things too. A company like Fender can buy so much from a manufacturer to allow that companies book's to be well in the black for along time, thus pleasing shareholders etc. and they can make their profits from the other companies.
I 'parted out' the Fender I have bought. Basically if you take (which is obvioulsy not the point/way to do it, as it dos'nt work like this) the pups, tuners, nut, strap-locks, case etc. outta the equation, the guitar (body/neck) is free??? Cos it dos'nt work like that, sounds funny still though.
The more choice (in ALL price ranges) the better I say (although maybe not for GAS) and ya just got be 'informed' to pick the right guitar for the money you are able/prepared to spend.
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I 'parted out' the Fender I have bought. Basically if you take (which is obvioulsy not the point/way to do it, as it dos'nt work like this) the pups, tuners, nut, strap-locks, case etc. outta the equation, the guitar (body/neck) is free??? Cos it dos'nt work like that, sounds funny still though.
Good point, and there are dealers on eBay who dismantle new Fenders and sell all the individual parts. They could probably buy the guitars at full list price and still make a tidy profit, but from the customer's point of view the prices are very fair. Everybody wins, I suppose!
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well Philly, I actually mourn some of it. I love (in general) the small mom and pop stores, the specialist stores the curio, but they are dying. Alot because of the internet but also because of the big chain stores. How many cities now are different? I.E. have smaller unique stores? Not many, all are getting like 'alot, not all' of the US with same stores everywhere. But sadly I do not seeing this being reversed.
Oh, and to be clear, was a take on things. I just bought a Custom Shop Fender and am NOT parting it out LOL, just did the sums to what could part it for :)
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Oh, and to be clear, was a take on things. I just bought a Custom Shop Fender and am NOT parting it out LOL, just did the sums to what could part it for :)
I wasn't thinking for a second you were going to strip down that Flathead Tele! :lol:
I know what you mean about the mom and pop stores, but I suspect it's one of those situations where everyone says they want small independent retailers in their local High Street, but they probably still shop online or at the big Tesco because it's simply cheaper and more convenient. It's sad, but the world is changing...
In some ways the internet, especially places like eBay and Amazon Marketplace, is keeping those small retailers alive, because you can run a business without the overheads like business rates and renting a shop premises. Even the ones who do still have a shop can reach a much wider customer base.
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aha, price :)
But don't alot of the said supermarkets now have Deli style counters, gourmet food sections and butchers/fishmongers at hand? It's big industry aligning to the want for the personal/quality of the mom/pop store. But alas, as said, they are dying like a terminal cancer and although evilbay/amazon etc. is ok for some, many 'of a certain age' do not know how to turn on a PC.
R.I.P. small mom&pop specialist store, sniff
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many 'of a certain age' do not know how to turn on a PC.
Oh well, $%&# 'em, they'll be dead soon.
SORRY!!!! Don't know what came over me then. :oops: It wasn't me, it must have been my evil twin. As Love/Hate so neatly put it.
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(sorry for so many quotes, lol, it's better than a quadruple post though)
You have to wonder where those pickups are being made
If said pickups would have a retail value of £150 here and you get a whole guitar with them for £300- either the pickup manufacturer is supplying manufacturer with USA made product for pennies (which I cant see) or has found a way to manufacture them cheaper somehow or somewhere
that's a distinct possibility, jonathan. I suspect they maybe can do it (for example, duncans in the USA are less than half what they are over here even to the average punter and you'd assume the guitar companies buying thousands of the things are getting them cheaper than me buying one), but even if they are the bona fide pickups, that means less money to go into the actual guitar. And if they aren't, it's a gip.
:drink:
Might be that manufacturers like Seymour Duncan make very low rates for guitar companies like ESP, Heritage ... just to have a positive image effect.
The margin might be really low on this supplier business, and therefore they print their brand name on the pickup and have more upgraders buy their brand ...
true, I didn't think of that, it's advertising for them too. :drink:
ding ding ding ding ding, we have a winner!!!!
remind me to buy you a beer in london!
that is what most people think.. it has quality parts, but that doesnt mean it's a good guitar.. who knows what wood it's been made of, does it need a fret dress, or even re-crowning (low end epis and ibanez guitars especialy.. horrible horrible)
like i said, they look good on paper, but what's underneath the paint?
like the ongoing jacskon/ltd arguement.. ltd has all this name brand stuff, where jackson (only recently) got just name brand pickups.. and they're still a bit more expencive, so people go for ltd, cos they think they get more bang for the buck.. if you want real bang for the buck, buy used 80s'early 90's ibanezes, jacksons/charvels. that's where the gems are
i know for a fact that duncan tried to shift regular production models over to korea (where their duncan designed pups are being made), but cos people said they buy USA products, for the quality, cos who knows what quality the MIK will be, and that they would lose a lot of their customers, they (for now) left the production in the santa barbara facility.
for dimarzios, i wouldnt be surprised if they were already made overseas. i had a PAF pro in my hands the other day and the build was so flimsy.. it looked like it would break :P dunno.. maybe it was tinkered with, but the guy claimed it was new... but over in these parts you never know
:drink: (that's interesting about duncan, by the way, I didn't know that)
A new'ish' phenomenum is taking over, global internet marketing. To my mind (the masses) are caring less about quality/customer service/longevity than price (this is across the board).
This is a two way street. How many on here rave about great deals (many on the internet). Who would go to a shop to try a guitar that they will then buy cheaper online? Many I would expect, human nature.
Is this hurting the industry though? Doubtful, just the mom and pop store.
(agreed with most of the rest of your post, nick, but it's too long to quote, lol)
I agree. In almost everything now, price is the deciding factor in what counts as value. "wow, cd players at £15! what great value!"
Not to mention they'll break in about 15 minutes. Value isn't just about how cheap you can get something.
Far as I can tell, mass production is good for making th cheap stuff cheaper (so is good for the casual user who doesn't want/need top of the range), but for the avid individual, the decent stuff is getting more and more expensive.
I agree about what you said about starter guitars (or starter/budget anything), but a lot of companies milk it too, building in obsolescence or inherent faults in the hope you'll have to buy a new model of theirs sooner.
one other thing about mom and pop stores- any time I go into one they always try to sell me something I don't necessarily want! I'm not fussed on somewhere like Sound Control, but (I feel at least) that you can go in there and try loads of stuff with much less pressure. Whether that's just because I know they're a big concern so I don't feel as much for them, I don't know.
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Dave, course they milk it, they're in it to make money. Inherant faults? Hmm, guitars are'nt THAT technological are they (for most part)?
As for mom&pop fussing on ya :) They prob. like ya ;)
BTW, prefer THAT service than going into a damn Guitar Center and all thats there are guitars that Crazy Joe has abused every day after school for sale. If I am spending money I want service and somthing NEW (if indeed it is meant to be new) not summit a 15yo has been abusing ad hock! HATE GC for guitars. Love em for price matching though. DOH, there goes me mom&pop eulogy :(
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For anything under £1200, the Internet is where to buy good as far as I can see.
This includes guitars - You can save a $%&#load and then spend the money you save on a good fret dressing and set up. Just make sure you try the guitar in a local shop first - Risky buying can be dangerous...
Most guitar shops are pretty chilled out nowadays - Metalheads at the counter who don't wanna bother you but if asked they're a tremendous help. Much superior to the parent flocking you get in Soundcontrol etc.
Decided that Soundcontrol is the worst place on the planet btw.
PS: What does MIK stand for? One of the things I need to learn :p
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ya wanna use F word and spend $1,000 on a guitar yet do not know what MIK is?
Good luck bud.
Made in Korea.
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Ever so slightly off topic, Mrs 38th owns a little health food shop and finds herself competing with supermarkets and a certain well known chain of stores.She tries to treat her customers as people-going out of her way to help, giving discounts etc-it is a constant battle however she sends me out to check on prices of products they sell in competition and you know what, our organic ozone friendly macaroons are cheaper than Waitrose, now hows that for value? All the independent petrol stations in my town were put out of business by T*scos and S*insburys ( major chains to our non UK brethren) and they are regretting it now as you can guarantee a queue whenever you try to get some-unless you go late at night. Back to guitars, I can't understand someone buying a guitar that they haven't played.I know that many problems can be remedied after sale but for the money saved, they could have gone to a decent store and have it set up properly-assuming they can't do it themselves. I do think, though, that you can get more guitar for your money these days.
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Hooraa for Mrs.38th, stick it to em :)
See Blair, we STILL fight back :twisted:
BTW Steve, wish could have tried a bloody Flat Head, serves me right for liking very hard to find cr@p huh. Agree else though.
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Dave, course they milk it, they're in it to make money. Inherant faults? Hmm, guitars are'nt THAT technological are they (for most part)?
As for mom&pop fussing on ya :) They prob. like ya ;)
BTW, prefer THAT service than going into a damn Guitar Center and all thats there are guitars that Crazy Joe has abused every day after school for sale. If I am spending money I want service and somthing NEW (if indeed it is meant to be new) not summit a 15yo has been abusing ad hock! HATE GC for guitars. Love em for price matching though. DOH, there goes me mom&pop eulogy :(
inherent faults = locking trems with tin foil knife edges. To name the one that sprung to mind when I wrote that, lol. Poor quality electronics aren't great either, when you consider the price difference between good and cr@p (maybe 50p? less?). And many companies (not just guitar) frequently put in cr@p components to try to entice you into buying the higher up models.
Heh, crazy joe again.
I see plenty of old guitars in smaller shops too, though, that have been played a lot.
For anything under £1200, the Internet is where to buy good as far as I can see.
This includes guitars - You can save a $%&#load and then spend the money you save on a good fret dressing and set up. Just make sure you try the guitar in a local shop first - Risky buying can be dangerous...
Most guitar shops are pretty chilled out nowadays - Metalheads at the counter who don't wanna bother you but if asked they're a tremendous help. Much superior to the parent flocking you get in Soundcontrol etc.
Decided that Soundcontrol is the worst place on the planet btw.
PS: What does MIK stand for? One of the things I need to learn :p
I wouldn't buy a MIK (or chinese/indonesian/worse) guitar on the internet, that's for sure. They'd probably put the neck on backwards.
and good work, 38th/mrs 38th. That'll show them. I can't work out who those blasted supermarkets are, though, damn your asterisking!
;)
:lol:
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ya wanna use F word and spend $1,000 on a guitar yet do not know what MIK is?
Good luck bud.
Made in Korea.
So not knowing specialist internet abreviations is equal to being a bad guitarist with no money.
I see.
Got no excuse for the language, and I retract the £1200 - No idea why I wrote such a huge figure.
Basically I'm talking about Korean guitars, since they're all built the same whether you buy it set up from a guitar shop or sent over and set it up yourself makes little difference right?
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^ exactly.
rofl lol 133t pwnt
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^ exactly.
rofl lol 133t pwnt
zomgwtf q_q
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ya wanna use F word and spend $1,000 on a guitar yet do not know what MIK is?
Good luck bud.
Made in Korea.
So not knowing specialist internet abreviations is equal to being a bad guitarist with no money.
I see.
Got no excuse for the language, and I retract the £1200 - No idea why I wrote such a huge figure.
Basically I'm talking about Korean guitars, since they're all built the same whether you buy it set up from a guitar shop or sent over and set it up yourself makes little difference right?
Not at all. You have retracted. Being newest member and going on like you have makes a $"%$"£&.
And, MIK is not a specialist internet phrase me thinks.
What I am getting at (and I try to help, ask many here) is that research is your friend. An older Jackson or Charvel (for instance) may be a good bet for you. The interent (amongst other things) can be a very powerful tool. And you have the advantage of a US connection which many would envy. Just be patient and figure out what ya want and need, then go for it. Don't get hung up on woods, materials. It's the basics that are not easy to change. Body routing, trem/no trem etc. I have had a cpl. of neck thrus and although very nice, they can have their own specific issues. Research, question, try and try (not always poss.) and then use ya choices (maybe in your case US connection).
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BTW, cannot speak for other brands but have (well just sold) a Schecter and have noodled on many others, MIK checked in US which are Excellent instruments. In fact ONLY reason selling my Schecter was due to the Flat Head (same basic guitar in design).
Very difficult to make sweeping statements with instruments that are not plastic. Only real way is to spend some time with em, then decide cr@p or not :)
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^ :drink:
just remember, not everything written on the net is true, lol.
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^
ummm exactly, So why do so many here qoute what they have read and not tried and then attempt to pass it off as ver batum? Weird huh LOL
(not u btw Dave)
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I DIDN'T DO NUTHIN :roll:
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^ heh, I'm sure I've done it on occasion too, lol.
But yeah, it can get annoying. this forum is one of the better ones for that, actually. it doesn't happen too much here.
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I DIDN'T DO NUTHIN :roll:
am just ranting in general, NOT pointed at you :)
You, should be in a GREAT buying position (I should know I have a House in the US and live there too) so should be able to obtain a great guitar for your money. Just research and bide ya time.
Check the better US online dealers, for instance www.chrisguitars.com there are lotsa great deals out there if ya have US connections.
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Well, I have tried the ESPs, since they were the first to catch my eyes at the beginning of the endeavour, but it seems that either:
1. The ESP I played had Magic powers,
2. The ESPs which everyone else played were shockingly awful, or
3. I'm just totally wrong.
Such a damn shame I'm a sceptic :(
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Decided that Soundcontrol is the worst place on the planet btw.
Why?
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Well, at least the one in London.
The only Ibanez they have are 2 GRGs when they used to have almost every RG. They got rid of all their Warwick basses,
They're the only Schecter dealer in the UK yet they covered a WHOLE FREAKING WALL in Omen 6s in different colours. Infact, the best Schecter they have is a Diamond series with Duncan Designed pickups for £300.
The Gibson section has halved (not that I care) they lost the PRS private stock!!!
The Ibanez section has been killed off, and they've decided to make it the "bass" section, (in other words they only have enough basses to fill a section designed for 1 manufacturer).
The Fender section's thriving, as is the PRS section, but other than that the shop's in shambles.
Best thing is the Peavey Cabs they sell, yet they sell no Peavey Heads.. :D
At least they have some Mesas in stock now, but I can't imagine them shifting that many with those prices being beaten 3 mins down the road in Denmark Street, (rockers for example).
Their sound tech stuff I have no idea about, but hell, I'm a guitarist, and this is a guitar based forum, so screw that :p
Other than that, the whole atmosphere of the place is toxic - If you're a college student with a nasty coat, you'll get ignored, but if you're a 12 year old with a parent wearing Gucci you get flocked by the whole staff.
I know that's the same in every guitar shop, but it's magnified in Sound control.
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Well, I have tried the ESPs, since they were the first to catch my eyes at the beginning of the endeavour, but it seems that either:
1. The ESP I played had Magic powers,
2. The ESPs which everyone else played were shockingly awful, or
3. I'm just totally wrong.
Such a damn shame I'm a sceptic :(
You might have played a good one, and personal preference obviously plays a part too.
also, I was treated fine when I was in that sound control over the summer, they let me play PRS's and Musicman, and I wasn't wearing Gucci, lol. EDIT: I'm not a fan of sound control, but they always treat me ok. It's more the prices/business practices that I don't like.
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Okokok guys, you had your fun and all, but can we please get back to the original thread?
Roight, so please post links to cr@p new guitars on the market. I haven't seen many yet, which almost makes me think they don't exist. ...
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SX guitars, apollo guitars, GIO ibanez series, Roytek ... ... ..
they dont usualy have online stores, but they can be found in local stores
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Okokok guys, you had your fun and all, but can we please get back to the original thread?
Roight, so please post links to cr@p new guitars on the market. I haven't seen many yet, which almost makes me think they don't exist. ...
it's hard to post links, as a lot of the time cheaper guitars have worse quality control, so you could get a good one, or a rubbish one.
That being said, westfield aren't great.
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Well, at least the one in London.
The only Ibanez they have are 2 GRGs when they used to have almost every RG. They got rid of all their Warwick basses,
They're the only Schecter dealer in the UK yet they covered a WHOLE FREAKING WALL in Omen 6s in different colours. Infact, the best Schecter they have is a Diamond series with Duncan Designed pickups for £300.
The Gibson section has halved (not that I care) they lost the PRS private stock!!!
The Ibanez section has been killed off, and they've decided to make it the "bass" section, (in other words they only have enough basses to fill a section designed for 1 manufacturer).
The Fender section's thriving, as is the PRS section, but other than that the shop's in shambles.
Best thing is the Peavey Cabs they sell, yet they sell no Peavey Heads.. :D
At least they have some Mesas in stock now, but I can't imagine them shifting that many with those prices being beaten 3 mins down the road in Denmark Street, (rockers for example).
Their sound tech stuff I have no idea about, but hell, I'm a guitarist, and this is a guitar based forum, so screw that :p
Other than that, the whole atmosphere of the place is toxic - If you're a college student with a nasty coat, you'll get ignored, but if you're a 12 year old with a parent wearing Gucci you get flocked by the whole staff.
I know that's the same in every guitar shop, but it's magnified in Sound control.
LOL, to be fair to them, they're coming right off the back of christmas, and are about to be stock taked, so there's probably a lot of stock being delivered thats not being turned over on the floor.
Prices wise, they can beat everyone in the UK on virtually everything when they want to, just takes some haggling.
Can't comment on the atmosphere of the place, have only been in the Oxford Street branch once. But I was certainly approached by plenty staff, in a gorgoroth t shirt and combats no less lol.
I have to say, I found denmark street to be immensely disapointing when I first went there.
I'd like to see some of the bigger stores carrying more high end gear, and more variety in gear too. But I guess that whats good for business, and whats good for the majority of buyers, isn't the same as whats good for the more discerning customer.