Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
At The Back => Time Out => Topic started by: BloodMountain on April 12, 2007, 09:48:00 PM
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hi :x
my dad, when he found out i want to buy a Ceramic Warpig, started burying his head in his hands in disbelief. he was saying "i don't understand this," and some other cr@p.
this just ISNT fair. i have spent ages on here, gathering information and listening and learning about these pickups, and now when it comes to it, i am not allowed to buy one.
it is ridiculous, you can all spend money on as many BKPs as you want, and i even have the money, and all i get is a stupid restriction.
i _REALLY_ want one, especially after hearing Evilfrenchy's sound clip.....
end rant. but i am hating this, after all, it is my money, that i earned, so who are they to judge my decision on what i spend it on?
how can i persuade them to let me get one?
thanks all, BM.
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When you have kids you can torture them all you want - right now it's your parent's turn :P
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When you have kids you can torture them all you want - right now it's your parent's turn :P
oh dear.....
but this is very bad..... i came on here because i was interested in these pickups, and now i am being denied them, even after about 3 months of me making a final decision of which one to get.....
:evil:
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Unlucky mate.
They probably want you to learn to use money 'wisely'. Of course, I would argue with them that buyin things that give you satisfaction and enjoyment is wise, and I'd win (have many times: after asking why I have 'so many guitars' once, no one ever mentions it again ;))
So, you could show that the pickup is a tool to achieve something that they'll recognise more. Probably money :( So get gigging!
or some other form of couterballance to what they regard as an excessive indugence when they still have much sway over your life.
Or failing that, youre gonna have to switch to the blues and sing about wanting a warpig ;)
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Or, you could try and make him 'understand', rather than stamp your feet and say 'I WANT', when hes been giving to you since you were born.
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Or, you could try and make him 'understand', rather than stamp your feet and say 'I WANT', when hes been giving to you since you were born.
yeah, but how????? he thinks that 100 quid is too much for an amp head.
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Is he by any chance Jewish?
Wondering if the Stereotyope's accurate...
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hahaha no he's not.......
he's just annoying and a noob
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Hard lines BM! :(
Maybe some comparrisons to what 100 quid gets elsewhere ... 2.5 console games, 1 ticket to Glastonbury, 1 weeks groceries, 1 meal for 4 ... mightn't seem so bad then.
Or you could always try reverse psychology and threaten to spend it on the Nags or Crack :twisted:
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i had the same problem here. I have two gibson guitars, and that was a bad decision. My dad thinks that they make the best guitars, so he thinks they make the best pickups. But, i've now waited nearly a year since i first asked about them and after doing really well so far this year in school, they're letting me get them.
Also, do you have a job? I know you have the money as you said, but they may not want you to spend all of your money. With a job i'm sure you'll convince them.
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get used to it - I just used to tell my parents that I was buying stuff with money I'd earned and to be expecting some noise from upstairs :lol:
I remember wheeling in a battered old 70s Marshall 4x12 and a (then fairly new) 50w Marshall Jubilee. I paid £430 for that rig (bargain eh?) - told them £250 (lol).
Your parents are just looking out for you thinking you're wasting money on a 'new fanged' toy - if you stick at it they'll eventually realise you're serious about playing guitar.
:twisted:
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Maybe some comparrisons to what 100 quid gets elsewhere ... 2.5 console games, 1 ticket to Glastonbury, 1 weeks groceries, 1 meal for 4 ... mightn't seem so bad then.
Or you could always try reverse psychology and threaten to spend it on the Nags or Crack
awesome!
erm, i had a job until about a week ago, not because i got fired, but because i wasn't needed until September.
i also told him that i need to sell my MG combo, which he didn't take very well either (more head in hands stuff.....)
maybe i should try approaching him tomorrow.... and try some of 99's techniques....
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get used to it - I just used to tell my parents that I was buying stuff with money I'd earned and to be expecting some noise from upstairs :lol:
I remember wheeling in a battered old 70s Marshall 4x12 and a (then fairly new) 50w Marshall Jubilee. I paid £430 for that rig (bargain eh?) - told them £250 (lol).
Your parents are just looking out for you thinking you're wasting money on a 'new fanged' toy - if you stick at it they'll eventually realise you're serious about playing guitar.
:twisted:
thanks for the advice dude!
i could offer him work, although it sounds like bribary hahaha
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Or, you could try and make him 'understand', rather than stamp your feet and say 'I WANT', when hes been giving to you since you were born.
i agree. if it sounds like you know what you're talking about, etc., but also don't just sound like a spoilt kid, it can work wonders...
though, i can't really talk from experience, my parents are pretty cool, and normally let me get what i want, apart from a drum kit back in the day, which was fair enough.
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If it's your money why not just buy them?
If you didn't tell him he'd never know - unless he's monitoring your cashflow...
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hmmm yeah dave.
i told him that they sounded amazing and that i had heard loads of sound clips of them so i am reassured......
he still didn't take it that well..... i will talk to him in the morning.
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If it's your money why not just buy them?
If you didn't tell him he'd never know - unless he's monitoring your cashflow...
my account isn't online, and he'd realise that there is a different pickup in there eventually.
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Well I speak as the father of two sons-one of whom is a gear head, I can see your Dad's point of view however, if my son was a very keen musician and earned his own money(and I am speaking here from experience)it is always best that my son gets the best gear available in order to push the performance envelope to the maximum-become a rock star and supports his wonderful hardworking parents (OK the last bit hasn't happened yet but here's hoping). Seriously though, if you have earned the money and you have thought ought your choice then, with the greatest respect to your Dad, I think he ought to cut you some slack.
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thanks for the support, dude. maybe i should show him that post...
heh, my parents say that about me and my bro (drummer in our band)... they want us to become rock stars haha
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thanks for the support, dude. maybe i should show him that post...
heh, my parents say that about me and my bro (drummer in our band)... they want us to become rock stars haha
It worked for Eddie and Alex ;)
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This thread takes me back about 25 years! :lol: My parents could never understand why I "needed" to sell my Arbiter Les Paul copy and Laney Mighty Eight practice amp.
I think they'd still go ballistic if they realised how many guitars I've got. And I'm 42 years old... :?
Seriously though, if you have earned the money and you have thought ought your choice then, with the greatest respect to your Dad, I think he ought to cut you some slack.
+1!
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Here is an interesting thought that you might share with your dad - just chose the right moment and do it tactfully.
These days anything that is decent and made in the UK does cost quite a lot of money. Show him sites like mine if he appreciates well made stuff so he can see that is not just cheap junk that you are obsessing over.
Bare Knuckle pickups are finely crafted and made in the UK with care and precision.
Tim makes a professional product that will gives years of great service.
If you kept the pickup for a year it has cost you just over £2 a week
If you kept the pickup for 5 years it has cost you less than 50p a week
That is cheap if it will satisfy your cravings
Here is the good bit
Bare Knuckle pickups seem to keep their resale value to a greater extent on the second hand market because the market is not flooded with them.
Your dad may be worried that because of your age, your desire for this pickup may prove to be a 5 minute wonder and that it would thus prove to be a waste of money.
But you would be able to get a pretty good return if you had to sell it for some reason
Also look at the number of hours that you spend actually playing through your gear and see the value for money on an hourly basis that your purchases represent.
Other teenagers may be always tapping their folks for money to spend on entertainment and even going to the cinema costs a fiver.
And it keeps you off street corners as well or hanging with the troublemakers!
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another way even if a bit sneaky
what pickups are in there atm if they are plain coverd or just open coils with no writing on
ask tium to make you one that looks same then hell never notice unless he has a ear for better sound quality :D
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I hope ya dad comes around bro!
I wish ya luck!
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My parents are pretty cool, they see gear purchases as an "investment in my future"... You see, I'm planning on becoming a high-school music teacher! I can buy all the gear I want! They're too proud of me, and it's kinda spoiling (Mum: "Oh, you've finished 8th grade piano in 2 and a half years blah blah blah, have whatever you want)
Oh, and good luck to you BM, and Feline, you are a genius :)
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thanks a lot Feline!
i will try to use some of those arguments..... but i'll try not to get him mad :wink:
Hate_growth, it's a Dimebucker, which is extremely hard to replicate in terms of looks.
cheers 808 and muzzz
i'll also try a little story: "dad, there comes a time when a guitarist discovers great tone, and also that they don't have it. these Bare knuckle pickups are great tone, i have heard enough sound clips and read countless 11/10 reviews to know that... i sometimes cannot play some guitars because of their pickups, and i just stop. this purchase isn't just going to be a 9 day wonder: i will never get rid of it, EVER!"
i got a bit excited near the end, as you can tell. i need to pick the right moment now.... any suggestions when? my dad usually spends his time fixing up old VWs or on his computer...... and also doing other Dad stuff.. but when should i approach him again?
thanks all :)
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I would add if you get married you get the same problem - even if you work from 7 until 11 to get the dough :D
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thanks a lot Feline!
my dad usually spends his time fixing up old VWs or on his computer...... and also doing other Dad stuff.. but when should i approach him again?
thanks all :)
Show him this picture of the custom work my mate Nick has done to his Beetle and then get into a conversation about customising
(http://www.btinternet.com/~mattdavies/nicksmith/vehicleimage1.jpg)
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I would add if you get married you get the same problem - even if you work from 7 until 11 to get the dough :D
Ha! :lol: +1 from me on that! ;)
The days when I can spend whatever I want on toys are loooong gone! :roll:
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Actually, guitar is a relative cheap instrument. a grand for a guitar or amp is nothing, a hundred for a pickup is peanuts. (I know it's still alot of money)
But what if you were a pianist? And you want the best piano there is?
Dad, can you spot me 45 grand for a Bosendorfer?
The same goes for violins, saxophones etc.
When your parents aren't musicians it's hard for them to understand why you need certain stuff. Maybe it will help if you show them that playing guitar is alot cheaper than most classical instruments.
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That's true, i play a Euphonium (brass instrument) and if i wanted to get a new one it would cost me 1000's BUT they would buy it guranteed.
However, i do not see why they are unwilling to help out in my guitar purchases.
If i asked them to help me out with a guitar or any piece of gear they will not do it! But i have never paid a penny for any of the music, instruments or anything to do with my Euphonium.
Maybe it's because it is the 2nd instrument that i am learning and not the 1st?
Maybe they think i suck at it? :lol:
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Dad, can you spot me 45 grand for a Bosendorfer?
oops I dropped it -can I have another?
(http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/07/uk_piano_fall/img/3.jpg)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/6546267.stm
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hey feline, you have a point:
i can say that he buys a shedload of customisations for his 2 VWs, and he knows what's good and what's not about them. just like i know what's good and what's not about pickups and tone!!!
haha great pic Feline :lol:
Ratrod, my dad is a guitar player. he plays blues and rockabilly really badly, and he thinks that a pickup is a pickup.
yeah, Joe, exactly. except for me, this is the only serious instrument i have ever played, and they both think i am REALLY good at it... so i don't think he is being like this because of my playing...
EDIT: jesus, that BBC story looks really bad! shizzle...
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thanks a lot Feline!
i will try to use some of those arguments..... but i'll try not to get him mad :wink:
Hate_growth, it's a Dimebucker, which is extremely hard to replicate in terms of looks.
cheers 808 and muzzz
i'll also try a little story: "dad, there comes a time when a guitarist discovers great tone, and also that they don't have it. these Bare knuckle pickups are great tone, i have heard enough sound clips and read countless 11/10 reviews to know that... i sometimes cannot play some guitars because of their pickups, and i just stop. this purchase isn't just going to be a 9 day wonder: i will never get rid of it, EVER!"
i got a bit excited near the end, as you can tell. i need to pick the right moment now.... any suggestions when? my dad usually spends his time fixing up old VWs or on his computer...... and also doing other Dad stuff.. but when should i approach him again?
thanks all :)
If you ask tim i'm sure he could do it :D
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In all honesty, I felt physically ill when I saw that photo :(
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In all honesty, I felt physically ill when I saw that photo :(
i know, i didn't know it was an actual story, i thought it was a photoshop.
very bad indeed.
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Dad, can you spot me 45 grand for a Bosendorfer?
oops I dropped it -can I have another?
(http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/07/uk_piano_fall/img/3.jpg)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/6546267.stm
haha, i heard about that!
I guess it's a baby grand now...
:roll:
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Actually, guitar is a relative cheap instrument. a grand for a guitar or amp is nothing, a hundred for a pickup is peanuts. (I know it's still alot of money)
But what if you were a pianist? And you want the best piano there is?
Dad, can you spot me 45 grand for a Bosendorfer?
The same goes for violins, saxophones etc.
When your parents aren't musicians it's hard for them to understand why you need certain stuff. Maybe it will help if you show them that playing guitar is alot cheaper than most classical instruments.
What about paying 1 million for a Stradivarius Violin?
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BM - remind me what guitar it is that you have.....
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You can tell your dad that I swapped the pups out of an LP that I bought new for $1700.
At the time that I bought it, I loved the sound of the git; but, as my ears developed, the stock pups didn't have what I was hearing in my head.
Thus, a purchase of Mules was necesary!
I'm married so I can't spend like I want. If that wasn't the case, I'd have another set of BKPs in my Standard. I'll get another set sooner or later.
Keep talking to your dad about it. He'll see how serious you are about the pups and he'll come around sooner or later
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If it helps you, you can tell your dad that I have BK's in over 20 guitars, including a 1953 and 1986 Les Pauls, 1957 Strat, 1957 Tele, 1967 335, all my Paul Reed Smiths and lots of other vintage or expensive guitars. The reason that I have made the pickup changes is that BK's consistently sound better than the other pickups I have used. My latest set was a PG set in the 1986 limited edition goldtop LP. They sound fantastic, and get that original PG tone when both pickups are on. I have several pickups to collect at LGS (some are vintage rewinds), and will continue to put them in my guitars because I haven't found another pickup that compares.
The workmanship is also amazing. BK are the only replacement pickup maker that I have found who have the correct slug sizes in the humbuckers. When I put a new BK against my real PAF, the only difference is the age of the PAF (and the wax potting on the BK's). They use very high quality parts, and Tim has gone out of his way to source the original components that were used by Gibson. Also, each pickup is hand made, there are no shortcuts taken, which is why they produce such a great product.
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My own father could be problematic, when it came to spending money on things that I was interested in.
However with 2 kids now I have been determined to learn from his mistakes (as I see them) without being excessive. If they want to learn to do something then we get them something that will not hamper their progress. If they stick at it (and hopefully show some talent) then they get upgraded.
so heres a couple of points tht may help a little.
1: Negotiate, ask what conditions you need to fufill to be allowed to buy the pickups. It may be something like continue playing for a certain length of time, or learning a set of particular songs (to show a wider range of music)
2: If you get a set list that appeals to your dad, make sure you dial in a pretty horrible tone on your existing rig. Then makew sure you have a friends friends amp or guitar and play with an improved tone. That may well work wonders ;) (I know it's not entirely honest, but if you end up pleasing your dad, it will make everything easier in the future)
3: Ask what you would be allowed to spend the money on. Then show (in a logical fashion) why the pickup would give more benefit to you.
4: Hive a little money off each week and buy the thing anyway, sell the dimebucker and show you got the warpig at a discounted rate.
5: Ask the guys here for a few warpig clips which are calculated to appeal to your Dads preferences (don't forget the warpig Jazz clip) so it shows the pickup isn't just work for your current musical taste (which will be viewed as a passing fad)
Rob...
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My Dad was always the same with me when I was younger:
'What do you need another guitar for?' 'You can only play 1 at once can't ya?' 'They all sound the same' etc etc etc (same with amps, pedals etc).
Anways, I've had jobs since I was 14 and have always earnt my own money. I s'ppose when my dad saw that it wasn't just a 'flash in the pan' hobby, and that I actually saved up for stuff I wanted instead of going out spending it on beers and loose women etc, he slacked off a little.
He still rolls his eyes when I mention modifying my guitars etc, but he knows I know my stuff and that it's my life, so he just lets me get on with it :)
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BM - remind me what guitar it is that you have.....
Dean Razorback two tone I think.
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BM - remind me what guitar it is that you have.....
Dean Razorback two tone I think.
yeah. why, Feline?
trouble is, my dad is OBSESSED with budget gear...... usually old unknown/unbranded guitars and pickups, but sometimes new stuff that noone has heard of.
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When your Dad works on his VWs he uses the best possible products to do so-same as you want to with your guitar.After all, you are emulating his high standards and attention to detail.
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trouble is, my dad is OBSESSED with budget gear...... usually old unknown/unbranded guitars and pickups, but sometimes new stuff that noone has heard of.
Your dad already knows about guitars?
Hmmm, I think that makes your dilemma twice as bad. Rules out the "change it anyway and hope he doesn't notice" option, anyway.
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The solution is simple: Move out. PDT_008
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BM - remind me what guitar it is that you have.....
Dean Razorback two tone I think.
yeah. why, Feline?
I kinda guessed it had to be a Dean as you had a Dimebucker as standard
Just curious really .........
Ok try this
Tell him that you desperately NEED one of my guitars but if that is so out of the quetion you'd settle for a "measley" BKP :D
He might go for the much cheaper option
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The solution is simple: Move out.
haha!
Feline, i doubt that would work, any glance of huge prices would make him run.....
i am taking the route of buying Crazy_joe's Warpig.... it's cheaper and my dad has let me loose i think..........
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Ok try this
Tell him that you desperately NEED one of my guitars but if that is so out of the quetion you'd settle for a "measley" BKP :D
He might go for the much cheaper option
ah, the ol' "dad, i killed someone and am wanted in 6 states, nah, not really, just bought a new pickup, doesn't sound so bad now, eh?" routine?
:lol:
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Ok try this
Tell him that you desperately NEED one of my guitars but if that is so out of the quetion you'd settle for a "measley" BKP :D
He might go for the much cheaper option
ah, the ol' "dad, i killed someone and am wanted in 6 states, nah, not really, just bought a new pickup, doesn't sound so bad now, eh?" routine?
:lol:
killer! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Actually, I vote for TO's "move out" plan. Not necessarily now :) but when the time comes.
When I were a lad (hack! cough! and it's longer and longer ago!) I bided my time until I could get out and move to a new place (university and thereafter) and do as I wanted with no one to tell me nay. It worked very well, and I bought a couple of guitars and a bass which serve me too this day -- and a good job too, since (as was pointed out) once you're a married man (or the equivalent in new money) you're not allowed to throw it all away on toys any more! My BKPs a year ago were my major music-oriented purchase of the last 5 years! ;) Money well spent! but it'll be a few more sunsets before I can justify such extravagances again ....
So wait patiently, and then blow as much of your income as you can while it's solely yours to blow! 8)
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GREAT advice!!!!!!!!
8)
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I think the thing is that you have to be aware that there are always two sides to each story.
Your dad is probably motivated not by a desire to stop your fun, but because he wants to protect your money and therefore your future.
So why resent him for that?
To further what was said earlier, you've gotta show some serious maturity to win your father over. It definitely is a bitch trying to relate this kind of thing to people who don't understand it - so you mentioned cars, find some common ground and recreate your situation/dilemma in terms he can understand and empathise with.
Just because you've spent a lot of time on this forum, and a lot of time thinking over what you want, does not simply entitle you to the pickup. That's life. So don't beg or argue with your dad, just calmly and maturely state your case.
PS. Did you earn this money yourself? If so, bring that angle in. Say that you appreciate he is looking out for you but ultimately it is your money and it is yours to spend therefore. If you make mistakes, you are young and we all learn from mistakes. It is better that you learn about handling £100 correctly when you are a kid, than never have that experience and screw up with £1000's when your older.
If he trusts you, if he respects you, and if he wants to develop your own sense of personal responsibility, then he should let you invest this time.
Good luck.
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Go alone the lines of 38th suggeston and draw an analogy between custom VW parts and guitar parts. Also point out it's your money! The thing is it won't stop at one pickup as you'll get GAS like never before and need loads of guitars ad new BKP's! For that get a job then you can spend it on what you like!
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Go alone the lines of 38th suggeston and draw an analogy between custom VW parts and guitar parts. Also point out it's your money! The thing is it won't stop at one pickup as you'll get GAS like never before and need loads of guitars ad new BKP's! For that get a job then you can spend it on what you like!
yeah, they were great suggestions.
erm, yeah, i will get terrible GAS for more BKPs, i have my eye on the A5 pig and the painkiller next :twisted:
but i have loads of GAS for this at the moment :lol:
http://www.musicstreet.co.uk/deandimebagdarrelldimefromhellbabymlwgigbag-p-1480.html i'm actually serious!
but yeah, i'm not working atm because i have exams coming up, but after that, i will work for more BKPs :twisted:
oh yeah and i have gas for a Laney AOR protube 50w as well....
i need to control it seriously!!!!!
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WTF, why do you want the little shitety Dean thing, save your money!!
And you just got a new amp! Why do you want another one? :lol:
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http://www.musicstreet.co.uk/deandimebagdarrelldimefromhellbabymlwgigbag-p-1480.html
God those suck. Really =/
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Now you can go anywhere where space is limited
Great if you regularly play in lifts!
don't diss :lol:
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Explain to your dad that your have come to the conclusion that he is right.
You should not have to spend that much money on a set of BK's, then go on to state: that is why I'm going to let you (dad) kick in. This way you won't be spending all your money, and your dad can be investing in your future. You can tell your dad that by playing and understanding music you develop a greater understanding for solving complex problems and that will alway be an advantage in life.
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It's always the same. People are told off things that could actually help them gather experience.
If you spend your own money, of which you don't have plenty, on something that is not worth while, you will realise yourself and be more careful in the future.
You will never have this learning by not going through this experience yourself, with your own money and your own investments, it's as easy as that.
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Yeah, I agree with that -- if you're gonna make a gross financial miscalculation and spend a bunch of money on something that you later realize should have been spent on something else, then better you learn it now when it's a relatively small amount of money and your parents are there to keep you from starving. (Plus, at worst, you've still got new pickups! :)).
My wife's parents and aunts and uncles came out families totally dominated by her all-powerful grandfathers who took care of every aspect of everyone's life -- while they were alive. As soon as these patriarchs died .... well, it is incredible the financial (and other) difficulties people can create for themselves when they're suddenly thrust into situations of adult responsibility with absolutely no experience at being responsible for anything!
Best that people learn what is and isn't a good idea when they're a) young and b) not positions where they can do too much damage to themselves or others!
And meanwhile, you'd best get stuff while you're young that you're gonna be happy with for a looong time. I got my guitars and my bass just after university, and the BKPs for my LP was the first big musical purchase I'd made in almost 15 years!