Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: Crazy_Joe on October 13, 2007, 02:48:08 PM
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I still don't get what it does :?
I just bought a BBE treble boost and was thinking about getting a Sonic Maximizer to go with it. From the clips i have heard it just makes stuff sound better (?) haha.
Can someone tell me in simple terms what it does.
Cheers, Joe.
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What a BBE Sonic Maximizer does:
The human ear perceives different frequencies as being louder than one another due to how many times it repeats. Higher frequencies are smaller and repeat more often in the same amount of time than a midrange or bass frequency, and seem to cut more at lower volumes. Just turn your hi fi down really low and see what frequencies you hear the most of.
The BBE introduces a slight delay to high frequencies so that your ear perceives all of the frequencies coming out of it 'at the same time', essentially. It also adjusts the phase of the high frequencies in relation to the midrange and low freqs.
The way you would normally perceive a guitar's signal is kinda like this --
TREBLE ------------------------------>
MIDRANGE -------------------->
BASS --------------->
After the BBE, you hear it like this --
TREBLE ---------->
MIDRANGE ------>
BASS ------------>
It results in what the ear perceives as a richer, fuller tone.
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What a BBE Sonic Maximizer does:
The human ear perceives different frequencies as being louder than one another due to how many times it repeats. Higher frequencies are smaller and cut more at lower volumes. Just turn your hi fi down really low and see what frequencies you hear the most of.
The BBE introduces a slight delay to high frequencies so that your ear perceives all of the frequencies coming out of it 'at the same time', essentially. It also adjusts the phase of the high frequencies in relation to the midrange and low freqs.
The way you would normally perceive a guitar's signal is kinda like this --
TREBLE ------------------------------>
MIDRANGE -------------------->
BASS --------------->
After the BBE, you hear it like this --
TREBLE ---------->
MIDRANGE ------>
BASS ------------>
It results in what the ear perceives as a richer, fuller tone.
Good answer, I actually understood that.
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Funnily enough, I have just got one myself. My brother has been in the USA and he picked one up for me ( and one for himself too-he is always copying me-he now has BKP's !) I can't improve on Ben's explanation. Got a gig tonight and I am going to give it a go.
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I won't attempt to better TO's technical explanation either :)
But I will say that the effect is startling. As Feline said when I demo'd his, "it's like lifting a blanket off your amp". It makes the sound tighter & clearer - you'll wonder how you ever coped without one. FWIW I bought a 482 rackmount unit from XL2XL (http://www.doubleball.co.uk) soon after hearing Feline's with his JCM800.
One other thing: to get the most out of it with high gain sounds you need to use it in the FX loop, but for cleans it works better in front of the amp.
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Thats a good explanation Ben
I find that it helps a lot with clarity too
I put one in my Hi-fi separates and it works really well for me
In the loop of an amp it can have a great effect
Made my JCM 800 sound somewhat more like a Mesa Rectifier or like Zakk Wylde had been let loose on it.
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I personally find it makes the sound more ''Hi-Fi'' and kind of makes the sound more modern. I find that pinch harmonics are really easier to get and that the sound is clearer. I also think that it smooths out the sound, as opposed to a more ''raw'' sound.
the only thing I dislike about it is the fact that it doesn't work as well at high volumes, but that might have to do with the perceived loudness from each type of frequency at high volumes(the human ear is more sensible to mids at lower volumes and more sensible to highs and lows at higher volumes)
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They are amazing what they can do for your sound, for high gain it's hard to see how you liked your tone without it.
Good explanation Ben!
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That helped a lot Ben cheers :D I might have to pick one up if my BBE treble boost impresses me.
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That helped a lot Ben cheers :D I might have to pick one up if my BBE treble boost impresses me.
Get one anyway Joe, it'll blow you away!
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Haha, the way things are looking so far then i'll be picking one up very soon, and maybe a few other BBE pedals as they sound really good!
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Joe, I used mine ( which is a Sonic Stomp btw) last night at a gig and put it in the line between guitar and amp.I messed around during the 1st set to find the settings I liked best.I would say that it opens up the tone a bit-definately preferred it on to off so a thumbs up from me. You need to find the sweet spot but as there are just 2 knobs, it doesn't take that long. I suppose I could have done it at a rehearsal but a gig situation is where I play most so it made sense to me.It sounded a "richer" once I found the sweet spot. I have a rehearsal with my other band on Wednesday where I play bass and I will give it a go there. Mine cost £45.00 as an import from USA-well worth the money. What do you think of the treble boost-I am very fond of them-good ones do more than boost treble but I'd be interested in your thoughts.
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Joe, I used mine ( which is a Sonic Stomp btw) last night at a gig and put it in the line between guitar and amp.I messed around during the 1st set to find the settings I liked best.I would say that it opens up the tone a bit-definately preferred it on to off so a thumbs up from me. You need to find the sweet spot but as there are just 2 knobs, it doesn't take that long. I suppose I could have done it at a rehearsal but a gig situation is where I play most so it made sense to me.It sounded a "richer" once I found the sweet spot. I have a rehearsal with my other band on Wednesday where I play bass and I will give it a go there. Mine cost £45.00 as an import from USA-well worth the money. What do you think of the treble boost-I am very fond of them-good ones do more than boost treble but I'd be interested in your thoughts.
I'm still awaiting my Treble Boost, but from the clips/videos/reviews i saw it is a good piece of kit, it said in a review that it boosts the upper mids more than treble. I'm buying myn mainly for a solo boost to help it cut through more as i found in college that with the Fender Deluxe 900 amps that we use to perform with that when they go higher gain that it gets a bit bass heavy and solos turn into a bit of a mushy especially on the lower strings.
Edit: here is a review of quite a few BBE pedals: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=umNPbwCzOB8
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Like Beatle, I've got the stomp box version. Also available as rack studio effects or as VST/DX plugins for Cubase,Cakewalk Sonar etc.
Its worth trying the stomp box both 'in line' (as recommended) and in the effect loop. I found that in line there was more noticable effect on clean sounds and in the amp effects loop it affected distortion sounds more.
This was discussed here: http://www.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8945&highlight=bbe
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It sounds like it boosts it a bit though (extra harmonics etc.), which i don't want really, is this true?
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On some settings it did appear to add top and I just kept twiddling until I got what I liked out of it.Certainly once I got it how I liked it, I kept it on.
A very well made unit and mine, brand new from the USA, had a battery and a mains plug( US version obviously) and I am going to get a voltage converter so that I can use it here.
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On some settings it did appear to add top and I just kept twiddling until I got what I liked out of it.Certainly once I got it how I liked it, I kept it on.
A very well made unit and mine, brand new from the USA, had a battery and a mains plug( US version obviously) and I am going to get a voltage converter so that I can use it here.
Did you get it online?
Cheapest here is from a guy on ebay for 53 quid brand new though he charges 9.95 or something crazy for postage.
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No, my brother was in the USA and I asked him to get me one.He bought one for himself after trying one out in the store.
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oh yeah you said, haha sorry!
I think i'm going to get one of these if i can find one fairly cheap seems like it could improve my tone.
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What a BBE Sonic Maximizer does:
The human ear perceives different frequencies as being louder than one another due to how many times it repeats. Higher frequencies are smaller and repeat more often in the same amount of time than a midrange or bass frequency, and seem to cut more at lower volumes. Just turn your hi fi down really low and see what frequencies you hear the most of.
The BBE introduces a slight delay to high frequencies so that your ear perceives all of the frequencies coming out of it 'at the same time', essentially. It also adjusts the phase of the high frequencies in relation to the midrange and low freqs.
The way you would normally perceive a guitar's signal is kinda like this --
TREBLE ------------------------------>
MIDRANGE -------------------->
BASS --------------->
After the BBE, you hear it like this --
TREBLE ---------->
MIDRANGE ------>
BASS ------------>
It results in what the ear perceives as a richer, fuller tone.
I've always wondered, in lame person terms, what they do... cheers for that!
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Finally got it!!
2 weeks that took, the ebay seller did not mention that it was coming from the USA so that sucked, but it's here now and it rules! I love it for boosted solos when its just above the half way mark :D
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Great bit of kit there Joe. I love mine-I have even found that it brings out great tones on my bass set up.
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Awesome Mr 38th, it's just a wonderful piece of kit!
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Best piece of kit for the money!!!
:oops: Sorry to be a smart ass on my first post, put i had to chime in on Twilight's first post.
You obviously read the blurb on the BBE site, but youv'e got it all a bit arse about tip!
Normally a speaker kicks out, and the ear perceives, bass frequencies first so as to muddy up the mids and highs which follow slightly later. A maximiser slows down and phase corrects the lower frequencies first, then mids, etc., to alow mids and highs to catch up - hence making the overall sound more sparkly and true to the way the sound was created.
or - speaker sound :-
treble ..........
mid ...............
bass ....................
becomes, with BBE:-
treble .................
mid ................
bass ...............
A good point to remember is that at low volumes, the ear picks up mid frequencies most, and that at high volumes, the bass and highs are processed by the human ear most, giving a naturally scooped sound.
This means that at gig volumes, you need to turn down the BBE low contour and high process a bit, otherwise the audience will only hear a boomy fizz - defeating the purpose somewhat :wink:
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Is the Sonic Stomp as good?
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It's the stomp which I have. Haven't tried the rackmount, but according to BBE, tis the same circuitry as their best rack units.
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And does yours work nicely?
If so I might just buy it to save some space.
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Yes indeedy. Highly recommended. Just remember to turn it all down a bit for gig volumes (see my above post)
You will not be dissapointed.
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:D Are there any outlets here in the UK for these pedals ?
:D 8)
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I found one here:
http://www.guitarandampshop.co.uk/acatalog/BBE_Pedals.html
and I'm seriously considering getting one after all that I've heard and read. Damn, more stuff to buy.
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That's rip off prices, i paid about 62 or something for my frequency/trble booster off this ebay man brand new, he has all those pedals for about 20-30 quid less including postage, though it took about 2 weeks for it too arrive.
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The pedals truly are worth having.Since I have had mine, I have used it constantly. As has been said, you set it differently at gig volumes to what you might do for rehearsals. Superb on bass too. If you know of someone visiting the USA get them to bring you one back as it'll cost you the equivalent of around £46.00.
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That's rip off prices, i paid about 62 or something for my frequency/trble booster off this ebay man brand new, he has all those pedals for about 20-30 quid less including postage, though it took about 2 weeks for it too arrive.
Joe - a UK dealer would actually pay about £60 for each pedal (excluding any shipping from distributor to dealer).
The price listed is the realistic price including what is known as a profit , and if you run a shop or a business you need profit to pay the rent on the shop, the business rates, pay staff their wages, pay for the electric , and maybe some advertising and the cost of running and maintaining a website if you have one. Phone bills need to be paid too!
Oh and the profit should also cover enough to allow it not to be a total disaster when every now and then a pedal does not work and you have you pay out to post new ones out and ship the faulty ones back.
Looks like your ebay seller is making only a few quid per pedal......might be that he doesnt have a shop premises to think about, but the price is cut so close to the bone that he will not really make anything out of it if he is a UK seller buying from the UK distributor.
Also he has ensured that nobody else can make a profit either as nobody will buy from any other dealer who sells for the correct/suggested amount.
Some dealers will be asked to match his price and none will do it as it simply isn't worth it.
So then no dealers will bother to stock BBE pedals which will be a shame because they are good pedals.
Take that a few steps further and music shops will find that there is no point stocking anything as some blokes on ebay or the web are selling at cut-throat prices, so all the music shops will close down which i think will be a shame.
Then nobody will play guitar - or hardly anyone (and they will buy them at Tescos)
Actually - try telling Tescos that their milk is too expensive , that they are making way too much profit on it and that the farmer only gets 20p a pint so they should sell it at 21p..... you wont get far with that one!
Not a good way to run a business!!
OK - a bit of a rant and no offence meant towards anyone in particular
Just some ideas worth kicking around
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I agree there with Feline, oh its a shame that dairy farmers can't afford to drink white tea :P
I had been looking for the BBE UK retailer, its a shame there is only one.
I would want to go and try it with a similar amp to mine, as some say it does nothing for their amp, and all depends on the amp.
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I think he is a UK based seller but he has a warehouse in America so that's why he can sell them so cheap. (and that's why it took so long to get here)
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Sounds like parallel or grey importing from what you say .
A lot of it going on with many products
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Ordered (within U.K.) and on its way. Let's see what this thing can do. Hopefully be here in a couple of days.
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lol ok what is parrallel and grey importing?!
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lol ok what is parrallel and grey importing?!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_economy
Remember young Jedi - Google is your friend!
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Right i get it now. Well it's a smart thing to do imo.
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Seems like i might be getting one of these!
You can get them brand new from american sellers on ebay including postage for about £50 :)
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Seems like i might be getting one of these!
You can get them brand new from american sellers on ebay including postage for about £50 :)
Linky!
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Right i get it now. Well it's a smart thing to do imo.
The grey market kills legitimate retail.
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Right i get it now. Well it's a smart thing to do imo.
The grey market kills legitimate retail.
+1
Why not find a legitimate UK based dealer (even one that price cuts) who will sell you a unit WITH a UK based warranty - so you dont have any headaches in the unlikely event of anything going wrong with it.
Info worth knowing
All distributors in the UK keep an eye on serial numbers of units officially imported and wont touch any warranty issues of units that have come to the UK otherwise . So you would have to go back through the foreign retailer that you purchased from.
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ANY LINKS POSTED to illegal or grey market sales will be removed from this forum. If you continue to post, you will get a one way ticket outta here.
Let's keep this thread ON TOPIC and within the REALMS OF THE LAW, people!!
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If it was illegal I'm sure he would have been shut down by Ebay already...
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Something to do with 'grey market', i wasn't trying to do anything dodgy, just show people the cheapest choice
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If it was illegal I'm sure he would have been shut down by Ebay already...
There is no way to confirm that.
End of discussion, please.
Edit: Can we please try to keep this tread about the subject at hand, the Sonic Maximizer, and not about grey marketing?
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Has anyone got the plug in version for logic etc?
Or is there a good equivalent?
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I do have the latest software version of the BBE sonic maximizer, I find it's only usefull if your guitar sounds muddy or cloudy in the first instance! esp in the low-mid frequency range, it adds 2nd and 3rd generation harmonics that improve the sound, and make it sound kind of phatter, and clearer in the bass and treble range, making the mids more balanced all round.
I use it more often on bass guitar and metal guitar parts than I do on anything else, from my experiments I've found that you have to be carefull how much excitation you add into the sound, as it can almost sound cheezy, and plastic if one isn't in a sensible mental state when mixing.
hope that helps you. :twisted:
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I echo what JJRetro says only I use the stomp box version. With guitars, it seems to be better on the cleanish tones and on chorus type tones but can sound a bit fizzy if using lots of distortion (not that I do that much of course) and with bass it is a brilliant piece of equipment so long as you get the settings right for your sound. I have just about got it how I like it for both now.
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TOP CLASS EXPLANATION
where do i start my classes?
AHAHAHAHAH
What a BBE Sonic Maximizer does:
The human ear perceives different frequencies as being louder than one another due to how many times it repeats. Higher frequencies are smaller and repeat more often in the same amount of time than a midrange or bass frequency, and seem to cut more at lower volumes. Just turn your hi fi down really low and see what frequencies you hear the most of.
The BBE introduces a slight delay to high frequencies so that your ear perceives all of the frequencies coming out of it 'at the same time', essentially. It also adjusts the phase of the high frequencies in relation to the midrange and low freqs.
The way you would normally perceive a guitar's signal is kinda like this --
TREBLE ------------------------------>
MIDRANGE -------------------->
BASS --------------->
After the BBE, you hear it like this --
TREBLE ---------->
MIDRANGE ------>
BASS ------------>
It results in what the ear perceives as a richer, fuller tone.
:twisted:
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What settings are you guys using on your Sonic Stomps? I'm using both controls on 5 which seems a good base setting? Is it worth spending much time tweaking it from there????
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About the same as me Dave-trial and error has arrived at that. I have reduced the levels of each with the volume-at rehearsals where we are not loud, I have had it set at higher levels-somehow seems more satisfying. I am loving it more on bass than guitar but feel it an essential part of both set ups now. I leave it on all the time for bass but on and off for guitar according to the tone being used.
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Cheers Steve. I leave it on all the time as I like the extra clarity it gives. Seems to remove a bit of fizz that my ears tend to pick up.
I find if you raise the settings it can get a bit "digital" and it loses some warmth. 5 and 5 just seems to balance right at home, but I would imagine at gig volumes dropping them both a touch would work better.
What a great pedal!
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I use mine at 5 and 6 (lo contour and process respectively). I agree with twinfan, gets a little too fizzy when the process is raised much above that and lo contour just gets way too low and bassy for my taste when turned up higher.