Looking for HSS setup and more

[sandmannn69]

Looking for an HSS setup to replace the muddy Jackson J50BC bridge pickup in my blue Charvel model 4. The neck pups are OK but active like bridge, will need replacements if I go passive bridge, I presume.

Since the guitar is a shred machine, looking for something that does 80s hard rock/metal rhythm and lead work in a basswood body/maple neck/RW board. Think Jake Lee, Matthias Jabs, Vivian Campbell, etc. I could just stick a JB in there, but thought it would be a good opportunity to try a Bare Knuckle.

While I got your attention, the Tone Zone bridge pup in the green Socal needs to go, too. Like to try something with a Zakk Wylde/John Sykes flavor, thinking about a Cold Sweat, or if too bright for Alder, maybe a Miracle Man w/CS neck???

[Matt77]

Not sure what to put in the Jackson, but I have a Miracle Man in a maple necked HSS guitar. The clean tones aren't great but put a bit of gain in it really delivers a great 80s hard rock tone.
It would probably suit the Socal pretty well.

You can't really lose with BareKnuckles as the strong demand in the 2nd hand market means if you move them on you can easily get 80% of their original value.

[Telerocker]

For the Socal the CS would be a little too bright, I think. I would take a look at the MM or the Nailbomb.

[sandmannn69]

Picked up a VHII for the M4 bridge and thinking about a Holy Diver for the Socal with a CS neck.

[Telerocker]

Congrats. Lots of people rave about the VHII. Holydiver could be the right pick, CS for the neck I'm not sure. I would go for a neck-VHII.

[sandmannn69]

Congrats. Lots of people rave about the VHII. Holydiver could be the right pick, CS for the neck I'm not sure. I would go for a neck-VHII.

Lots of good clips of the VHII helped me decide. Have to figure out something for the M4 middle/neck now.

VHII neck might work for the Socal, but the general consensus seems to say the CS is the best for hard rock neck leads....

After listening to the available holy diver bridge clips, having second thoughts about that one for the Socal-seems to be kind of bass heavy, doesn't sound at all like its namesake (just listened to the HD CD-what a classic piece of 80s metal!) Maybe a Nailbomb or Miracle Man in the Socal bridge, CS would probably be too bright. I don't tune any lower than D, don't need that chugga-chugga. Just need to ditch that Tone Zone POS.

[Telerocker]

I understood the HD can be a hit or miss, depending on the guitar. Maybe your right about the CS being suitable for the neckposition, considering your musicstyle. But I mentioned the VHII, cause so many people on this forum say this is one of the best pickups for the neckposition.

[sandmannn69]

I understood the HD can be a hit or miss, depending on the guitar. Maybe your right about the CS being suitable for the neckposition, considering your musicstyle. But I mentioned the VHII, cause so many people on this forum say this is one of the best pickups for the neckposition.

Yeah, I know what you mean, the clips of the neck VHII are pretty good. But right now, I'm using a Japanese LP custom with Duncan Distortions for heavy stuff like whitesnake, dio, etc., and the neck is a little muddy for fast leads, figured CS would be as hot but clearer/brighter being its scatter wound.

[Antag]

If it was me, I'd go with a Holy Diver set in the green SoCal.  Holy Diver slays in alder & the HD neck is massively under-rated - clean & lead clips

Having replaced a JB with the HD in the same guitar, I can tell you for a fact that the HD is streets ahead of the JB in terms of clarity, tightness, response, depth.   It's not excessively bassy, but it does have a much fatter midrange & perhaps a little more output.

For the M4, are you sure it's basswood?  IIRC Jackson used a lot of poplar around this era & were never big users of basswood.  Lovely condition for a 23yo guitar BTW :)  My model 5 has had so many things changed there's not much of the original left...

Also, I thought these ones were actually passive pickups with an Active mid-boost circuit (J1200 or something IIRC) - I'm fairly certain that the J80 on my model 5 weren't active, only the mid-boost?

Finally, the BKP single coils won't fit in the rout on the M4 - BKP singles need the Fender rout with the extra bit sticking out rather than the EMG-style rout on this one.

FWIW, I'd be equally tempted by the HD in the M4, or perhaps the CS if it sounds anything like as thick as my M5...

[Telerocker]

I understood the HD can be a hit or miss, depending on the guitar. Maybe your right about the CS being suitable for the neckposition, considering your musicstyle. But I mentioned the VHII, cause so many people on this forum say this is one of the best pickups for the neckposition.

Yeah, I know what you mean, the clips of the neck VHII are pretty good. But right now, I'm using a Japanese LP custom with Duncan Distortions for heavy stuff like whitesnake, dio, etc., and the neck is a little muddy for fast leads, figured CS would be as hot but clearer/brighter being its scatter wound.

If the Duncan is muddy, bear in mind that BKP's are much more balanced, clearer, punchier and have better note separation, whether it is a VHII, a HD or a CS.

[sandmannn69]

If it was me, I'd go with a Holy Diver set in the green SoCal.  Holy Diver slays in alder & the HD neck is massively under-rated - clean & lead clips

Having replaced a JB with the HD in the same guitar, I can tell you for a fact that the HD is streets ahead of the JB in terms of clarity, tightness, response, depth.   It's not excessively bassy, but it does have a much fatter midrange & perhaps a little more output.

For the M4, are you sure it's basswood?  IIRC Jackson used a lot of poplar around this era & were never big users of basswood.  Lovely condition for a 23yo guitar BTW :)  My model 5 has had so many things changed there's not much of the original left...

Also, I thought these ones were actually passive pickups with an Active mid-boost circuit (J1200 or something IIRC) - I'm fairly certain that the J80 on my model 5 weren't active, only the mid-boost?

Finally, the BKP single coils won't fit in the rout on the M4 - BKP singles need the Fender rout with the extra bit sticking out rather than the EMG-style rout on this one.

FWIW, I'd be equally tempted by the HD in the M4, or perhaps the CS if it sounds anything like as thick as my M5...

Antag,

Thanks very much for the input. From what I've read on the forums, you seem to be the resident oracle on the HD, which is what I was looking for (someone with HD experience). I'm going by the '87 catalog scan on the M4 regarding it being Basswood, so can't say for sure. It has a battery hooked to the pickups, so pretty sure it is the active J50, but irrelevant cause its history. For the singles, I'm not really picky-main use as a shredder for fast leads, and hard to throw 2 switches when moving up the neck in the middle of a lead (Gibson got that part right).

I ordered a VHII to try in the M4, but if not hot enuff for Dio/Scorpions/Jake Lee stuff, the HD is a good possibility.
Wanna make the So Cal a replacement for my Edwards LP Custom. It does Sykes/Zakk good with Duncan distortions,
but prefer the Charvel necks. Not sure if the HD would be better than a Miracleman or Nailbomb for that?? Heard
lots of good things about Cold Sweat necks, too. THanks for comps on the M4 and the heads-up on the rout.

I guess it all boils down to how the VHII compares to the JB in my other Charvel (San Dimas), should be installing it this week. My guitar tech, Billy O'Reilly at B&D repair in Phoenix, originally recommended Barenuckle to me couple of years ago, but now he no longer carries them. He said they aren't the same pickup since Tim stopped winding and hired/trained others to do it. Billy is a very sought-after tech, is a straight shooter on his info, and always amazes me with his setups on my guitars, but have to find out for myself since a lot of folks still seem to be able to tell the difference between BKP and SD/Dimarzio. If the VHII amazes me, then I see a bright future with BKP for all my guitars.

If you're up to it, be nice to hear a clip of the HD on some Dio or Jake Lee rhythm or lead work......Just not enough
clips on the forum of 80s shredders, but plenty of glowing reviews on the HC website about the BKPs shred-ability.

[sandmannn69]

Just got a reply from the man (Tim), he recommends Miracle Man for the So Cal, and Holy Diver for the Model 4. From listening to his clip on the MM, I would definitely have to say he's got a good point. Matt77 and Telerocker called that one right. For the M4, the Holy Diver seems a very logical choice with the basswood/rosewood body/neck setup. Plus Antag recommends-Great minds think alike.... :lol: Dropping a VHII in the So Cal this weekend to test against the JB in my San Dimas, if it kicks the JB's butt, I'm putting in an order for more!

BTW, anybody use a Miracle Man neck pickup and how does it sound???

[sandmannn69]

Congrats. Lots of people rave about the VHII. Holydiver could be the right pick, CS for the neck I'm not sure. I would go for a neck-VHII.

Lots of good clips of the VHII helped me decide. Have to figure out something for the M4 middle/neck now.

VHII neck might work for the Socal, but the general consensus seems to say the CS is the best for hard rock neck leads....

After listening to the available holy diver bridge clips, having second thoughts about that one for the Socal-seems to be kind of bass heavy, doesn't sound at all like its namesake (just listened to the HD CD-what a classic piece of 80s metal!) Maybe a Nailbomb or Miracle Man in the Socal bridge, CS would probably be too bright. I don't tune any lower than D, don't need that chugga-chugga. Just need to ditch that Tone Zone POS.

Got the VHII yesterday and dropped it into my Charvel Socal for a test run (planned to put it in San Dimas, but its in the shop). In a word, wow! The clarity and note definition on the VHII is remarkable, goes from punchy cleans to Metallica roar without mushing out at all. Pick sensitivity is much better, even for a normal output pickup. Going to A/B it this weekend against the JB in the San dimas. Really enjoyed yanking that miserable Tone zone POS.

Probably be ordering a Miracle Man set for the Socal and a Holy Diver bridge for the Model 4 tormorrow. I realized the pickups in the Model 4 aren't active, they're passive-the battery just runs the mid-boost circuit board. Just wondering what the mid-boost will do with the Holy Diver.....should be interesting.

[tinribs]

Hello,

I know this is like 2 years old, but it might help someone else who stubles across it. Did you ever try the holydiver in your model 4?

I fitted a holy diver to my model 4 a few years ago and it sounded great. But the other day after not playing with it for ages (fell in love with my Les paul once I had Nailbombs in it) i only really descovered that the mid boost wasnt working. I fixed it by replacing the pots (all the same correct values) and some old rotton wires and with the mid boost on, dare I say, the holydiver to me now sounds like it has far too much mid which seems to cut the bass right back. I think the holy diver is an awesome pickup if you dont use the JE1200 mid boost, unless you not only want to cut right through not only the rest of the band, but also the fabric of space and time :)

You could of course back off the mid boost, but that does seem to thin the sound out a little.