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Author Topic: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***  (Read 3525 times)

WezV

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Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« on: June 09, 2012, 09:16:39 AM »
OK, we have a discussion on the film already, but everyone is trying really hard not to give away bits of the plot.   

I agree with assessments of the film so far: visually stunning, 3D was awesome, character and plot were weak.

but i did enjoy it and I think the whole point of a film like Prometheus is to discuss what it all means.   So this is a place to do that.  If you dont want to know what happens please dont read any further!

Opening Scene
Firstly i should point out that  was the only person in our group that though this was Earth.  But of course it was Earth and whatever the Engineer did there led to the development of the human species, possibly all life on Earth.

Its the first time we see black goo, but i think its obviously a different version of the same technology later in the film.  It does establish that this technology is capable of breaking down DNA and reforming it into new life. 

Why was he there?  He is being left behind by a ship (different to the ones later in the film) and he looks very solemn.  IS it some kind of exile/punishment for creating WOMD or is he simply there to create new life because he can (the reason stated for David's creation)

Why does he disintegrate? it is stated later in the film that you sometimes need to destroy to create.  Not quite a satisfactory answer but there you go.

Cave paintings
These establish that engineers have visited earth throughout humanities history  and have passed on a message - going back 35000 years, but none in the last 2000 years.   It is assumed the message was an invitation, but why would they send an invitation to a military installation/WOMD warehouse?   So more likely a warning then, just like a big DO NOT PUSH sticker above a red button.  that always ends well ;)

Inside the pyramid
Why are all the space jocky holograms running? where are they going?   If we assume there has been an outbreak then why does one of them run straight for a chamber full of black goo vases?  How does a thick stone door manage to cut off his head so cleanly.  What cases there heads to explode

Inside the chamber we are pointed towards some murals - i didnt get much from this.  they changed and we didnt really see what they were supposed to be very clearly.  But did David?   did it give him some knowledge about the contents of the room the others missed?

Obviously there is the Alien carving  that takes centre stage, much like a stained glass window in a church.   the only real thing to take from this is that the xenomorph form already exists.  The development of the aliens is not as random as it sometimes seems in this film(s) - but given time all mutations would end up with a familiar form of xenomorph (similar to how the  black goo at the start of the film led to a familiar humanoid form that pre-existed the human race).   Its also possible that there are other chambers with vases of different species, we see loads of space jockies crowded around a second door later in the film

Big humanoid head - well it makes for a nice poster.  its one of the only elements of decoration in the pyramid other than the xenomorph carvings and the chamber does almost have a chapel like feel.  dont really know what to make of this

Green glowing rock - this is focused on for a good few seconds then completely forgot through the whole film.  The only similar thing we see is the green energy used on the space jockey ship.  So possible some kind of control device

Black goo & alien (re)production
Clearly some bad shite, not really sure we need to know more than that ;)   What we do know is that it makes lifeforms stronger, more aggressive  and creates major physical changes.  We see small worms turn into massive aggressive snakes.  the speed and intensity of the change depends on amount of black goo subjected to.

what we dont see is how much change the black goo will create - when will the mutations end.  My initial feeling was that it ended with a standalone xenomorph incapable of reproduction, pure weapon.  but the first aliens we see, the worms, already have the oral rape instinct that seems to be a major part of the aliens reproduction cycle.  They even look like legless face huggers!

Then we have the accidental impregnation of Shaw which seems to change things with squid/body hugger baby.  Is this the first combination of human and alien DNA which allows the alien reproduction cycle to begin with the first Queen? (was David purposely starting this - because he can?)    I dont really want to mention Alien 4 but the mutation and reproduction cycle is obviously a big theme in that.


Robot
David is a robot.  We know there were problems with the early robots its established in the first film with Ash, and Bishop references these known issues in the second film.  So we know he is a robot and we know he will act in an ethically questionable way.

Does he have any emotion?  The first thing we see about him is his efforts to be more human and hints of vanity.  Then we see his creator point out he cant feel emotion and he looks uncomfortable.

anyway, he is on a mission to save his creators life.  His creator tells him to try harder.  He infects 1 crew member with something that may provide the answer.  Is it an evil act  or is it scientific and pragmatic?

What does he say to the space jockey and does it matter

Is Theron a robot?  She clearly looks like one, the question is even asked in the film.  and finally it is revelaed she is Weylands daughter - just like David is referred to as his son.

Engineers, space jockeys and humans - and a touch of religion

I seem to be the only person that thinks the Engineer at the start of the film is significantly different to the Space jockey race.   I dont think they are supposed to be the same 'species'

The Engineer is perfectly humanoid.  The space jockey has gill like texture on his neck and lumpy texture on his arms.   

But the space jockey is only 2000+ years old and the Engineer is more like 3.8 billion years old (if he started life on earth, 600 million years of he only started animal life, or 2.5 million years if it was the emergence of the humanoid species on earth).   so i am willing to accept any differences between the species can be due to the time difference and differences in technology, but i think its also possible the space jockies are a different race started by the engineers.   If they did it on Earth why would they not have done it somewhere else?

The film makes a point of showing us that space jockies and humans have the same DNA yet there are obvious differences.  I suppose size and colour differences could be purely due to the environment.   Maybe the humans are not quite done yet and will become more like the Engineer as we evolve

clearly the film has father/son themes as well as god/creation running all through it - right down to the title which lets us know something about equality between gods and men.   So it establishes that you have to destroy to create - but we seem to have humans created to be destroyed.  Why do the space jockies want to destroy us and is it important that they seem to have decided on this course of action 2000 ish years ago?  i am not going to go into a jesus was an alien discussion ;)

where we created purely as a weapons testing ground







....


think i will leave it there for now - but to get your monies worth from this film you really need to discuss it

Dmoney

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Re: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2012, 01:09:58 PM »
http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2012/jun/08/prometheus-ten-key-questions


This sort of sums up my questions about it.
I feel like it's only really worth relating it to the first Alien film, after which the concept for the Xenomorph HR Giger originally came up with was doctored. For example, there was never meant to be a Queen. Since he was part of Promotheus I' find it surprising if he'd want to relate his creation to the ideas of other people that he didn't exactly appreciate.

That said, even though the various worms and face huggery type creatures did look vaginal or phallic, I was a bit disappointed by the Alien at the end of the movie, especially considering how what I imagine is meant to be a similar creature is visible in the mural over the chamber of jars.

WezV

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Re: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2012, 01:32:19 PM »
I know there is no queen seen in the first film - but there are a hell of a lot of eggs which have to be laid by something ???   So a queen made a natural addition to the second film and the idea has been a large part of the story-lines since

the alien at the end was clearly unfamiliar - but we know the xenomorphs features are dictated by the host.  its also the first time we see a young queen straight from the host so i am fine with the idea that it could develop into  the type of queen we are more familiar with - probably within a few hours if the rest of the films are anything to go by :)   it certainly has a queen like mouth, if not headshape



 the mural aliens head isnt exactly like anything we have seen before

« Last Edit: June 09, 2012, 01:35:54 PM by WezV »

Dmoney

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Re: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2012, 03:20:54 PM »
The queen in the second movie wasn't designed by Giger. In an interview I've seen with him he said he hated it and thought it was ugly, or words to that effect. He had a little rant about it's termite like abdomen. The idea of the Queen and the Aliens living like ants in the second film is indeed a natural progression but maybe a bit obvious. The Aliens in the second film are also physically different to the first. Which I don't think Giger liked either. Scott and Giger had nothing to do with the rest of the Alien films so the development of the creature was left to other people. So in coming back to the subject, does Scott work within the lines of his original vision from the first film, or would he have to take into account all the films that have been produced since. It's an interesting thought.

This is Giger's lifecycle doodle.


Maybe its the birth of the creature over the top of that painting. I can't remember if the Alien at the end was similar to the Alien in the mural at all. There were also no eggs in this movie, although in Alien the dead space jockey has an open chest, suggesting he might have given birth to whatever laid the eggs in the first film?

juansolo

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Re: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2012, 05:49:33 PM »
I found it a stunning looking film, but it had a lot of it (highlighted by Wez) that just doesn't make sense. Also after finding out the who and the how (at least the begining of it), the why is never even covered. It worryingly reminds me of the sort of Lost like ambiguity that they used to string it on for ever, without actually telling you anything. I feel sequels are on the cards...

I'm not sure I'll bother if they do.
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WezV

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Re: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2012, 09:03:56 PM »
on the religion theme - i found this rather interesting, especially some of the comments from Scott

http://cavalorn.livejournal.com/584135.html#comments

basically Scott confirms the opening scene doesn't have to be Earth, it can be any planet.  it is there to establish that life is created through sacrifice - which the engineer is willing to do

he also confirms that we apparently pissed off the Engineers by crucifying Jesus.

Loomer

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Re: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2012, 03:24:53 PM »
That blog post just more or less increased my enjoyment of that film ten-fold  :o

I need to see it again, and connect a few more dots.

bucketshred

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Re: Prometheus - Plot Discussion ****SPOILERS INSIDE***
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2012, 04:18:51 PM »
Space Jesus...
Scott has lost it. Everything I've read that tries to explain events in the film just makes it worse.

However, a lot of people are asking why David chose Holloway as the one to 'infect' with the God Juice. Did no-one else notice Holloway's taunting of David earlier on in the film?

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