New Cornford Range

[noodleplugerine]

These PCB amps aren't like cheap chinese amps.

They seem to be still rather expensive amps, although with PCB boards instead of PTP.

[dave_mc]

I hear what you're saying Dave, but so long as the same components are used, there is no reason why a PCB amp can't sound every bit as good as a PTP-wired amp.

I never said PCB sounded worse. I was complaining that cornford was changing its philosophy to make more money. :)

[indysmith]

I hear what you're saying Dave, but so long as the same components are used, there is no reason why a PCB amp can't sound every bit as good as a PTP-wired amp.

I never said PCB sounded worse. I was complaining that cornford was changing its philosophy to make more money. :)

Doesn't really matter - it was a stupid philosophy anyway - they've probably just figured that PCBs don't sound worse, and PTP costs more...so why not!?

[dave_mc]

it's the principle of the thing. i don't like so-called experts to be changing their minds... they're supposed to already know this stuff.

it's a bit like that peter hain dude... either they've been lying or they're incompetent... neither exactly fills you with confidence... :)

[jpfamps]

It is indeed a strange philosophy.

I think what earlier posters really objected to was that Cornford trumpetted their "No PCBs" philosophy as a way of demonstrating that their amps were superior to mass-produced PCB-based amps.

There are very good and very bad examples of both hand-wired and PCB-based amps. I think PCB-based amps have got a bad rap for several reasons:

1) The first PCB-based amps were often very unreliable, as the first devices using new technology often are. Hand wiring had been around for years and so was proven technology.

2) Many "boutique" manufacturers (mainly in the US) have emphasized the "no PCBs" philosophy. This view is often re-inforced by the technical editors of guitar magazines who often don't know very much about electronics.

3) If you are going to build a cheap amp you will use a PCB. A cheap amp is a cheap amp using cheap parts however you make it.  

4) Many tech don't like working with PCBs. The main problem with PCBs is that in most amps you need to get to both sides of the board to change a component. If you can do this easily, then PCBs can be great to work on. With the component number silk-screened on the PCB and a good schematic it is really easy to trace signals and fault find. However, releasing the PCB from the chassis can be a total pain in some amps, new Peavey amps being absolutely the worst I have come across.

Regarding hand-wired amps built on eyelet board (a la Fender) or turret board (a la old Marshall or Hiwatt) are generally very easy to service. In contrast amps built on Tag strip, like Matchless and Cornford can be a bit of a pain as the components should be crimped on the tags.

Regarding part quality, as virtually all consumer electronics use PCBs there is a far greater range of high quality parts available for PCB-based amps, not that every manufacturer goes for the highest quality parts.....

Essentially manufacturers have learnt from the mistakes of the past and there is no reason why a modern PCB-based amp should not sound as good and be as reliable (if not more so) as a hand-wired amp.

[dave_mc]

It is indeed a strange philosophy.

I think what earlier posters really objected to was that Cornford trumpetted their "No PCBs" philosophy as a way of demonstrating that their amps were superior to mass-produced PCB-based amps.

that's what i was talking about. pretty much agreed with the rest of your post too (apart from the bits which are over my head, lol). :)

[Stevepage]

£699? Isn't the Harlequin cheaper? and PTP wired?

[HTH AMPS]

I hear what you're saying Dave, but so long as the same components are used, there is no reason why a PCB amp can't sound every bit as good as a PTP-wired amp.

I never said PCB sounded worse. I was complaining that cornford was changing its philosophy to make more money. :)

How dare they! - a business that wants to make more money, who'd have thought  :roll:  

It's not like they've stopped making PTP wired amps altogether - they've just added to their line so more people can afford their amps.

[dave_mc]

£699? Isn't the Harlequin cheaper? and PTP wired?

yeah, but lower wattage presumably. the 30 watt ptp ones are pushing the 2-grand mark (at least the combos are).

How dare they! - a business that wants to make more money, who'd have thought  :roll:  

It's not like they've stopped making PTP wired amps altogether - they've just added to their line so more people can afford their amps.

i didn't know having principles was a bad thing...

[kevincurtis]

Principles are absolutely fine and dandy...but in business you also have to be pragmatic. If selling PCB based amps allows Cornford to stay in business (the boutique market seems to be getting more and more congested) and also get people who cannot afford £2k access to their amps (me for instance - I couldn't possibly justify that sort of money at the moment) then as far as I am concerned that's great.

I haven't read anything that suggests they are now saying their PCB amps are as good as the handwired.

Also as a British manufacturer, I think it is great to see them expanding and developing, even if that is a tad nationalistsic  :oops: