Hilarity Ensues

[noodleplugerine]

So finally, the greedy bar-stewards making million dollar bonusses last month through banks effectively turned into upmarket gambling institutions have finally crumbled.

Finally the idea of "free market capitalism" will die.

I'm cheering for the end of thatcherism and reaganomics, but my friends call me I'm crazy - Anyone else out there who agrees with me?

[Antag]

:roll:  Perhaps you'd like to emigrate to North Korea?

[noodleplugerine]

For years now we've had this idea that "the market will look after itself, it knows best" but here we finally have a situation that shows how clueless these people actually are.

It goes beyond that though - The current american government... The most republican government there has EVER been have done THE most socialist thing since Marx and Engels. It's absolutely brilliantly ironic. And I'd imagine and hope that this spells the end of McCain's campaign.

[il˙ti]

Politics is so cute.

[MrBump]

So finally, the greedy bar-stewards making million dollar bonusses last month through banks effectively turned into upmarket gambling institutions have finally crumbled.

Finally the idea of "free market capitalism" will die.

I'm cheering for the end of thatcherism and reaganomics, but my friends call me I'm crazy - Anyone else out there who agrees with me?

I work in banking.

In Canary Wharf.

I saw people who were very upset, with families to feed and mortgages to pay.

People who don't understand are very quick to criticise.  I got so angry at a newspaper headline saying something along the lines of "we shouldn't be smug at all these city types losing their jobs..."

Smug?  And the devistation an economic crisis can cause?

The problems in the City at the moment don't hit the traders, they hit the support staff - IT, back office, caterers and cleaners.  Not all of these people earn megabucks. 

Capitalisism is a method.  It's not evil, neither is Communism.  It's people that are shitee.  Ignorant people, usually.

Mark.

[sambo]

And I'd imagine and hope that this spells the end of McCain's campaign.

Not sure I see the logic in that.

Also think you'll be disappointed if you think this is the end of a free market economy.

[noodleplugerine]

I also know somebody who is being sacked, but I feel that's offset by the fact that the fatcats are finally going to develop some responsibility over the money they handle.

[Sailor Charon]

I also know somebody who is being sacked, but I feel that's offset by the fact that the fatcats are finally going to develop some responsibility over the money they handle.

If that were the case, I'd be cheering from the rooftops. If I really thought that the people who'd been making money by looking only at the short term, and letting tomorrow go hang had learnt anything, I'd be the happiest Sailor Charon you've ever seen.
But we know who'll get it in the neck, and it won't be the fatcats and the bosses... :(

[PhilKing]

I also know somebody who is being sacked, but I feel that's offset by the fact that the fatcats are finally going to develop some responsibility over the money they handle.

I work in the finance industry and used to work at Lehmans, so I know a lot of people who are affected by this, and I have to say you show a total lack of understanding.  The guys who were getting the big bonuses are the brokers and directors, who will still get big bonuses as they are cherry picked by other companies.  The normal people will now be looking for a job in a market with less openings (especially if more companies close), and so while they are out of work they will need money.  Where do you think that money comes from? Taxpayers.  The bail outs in the US will be funded by taxpayers too.  If the financial markets had collapsed last week, you would be much worse off because of the trickle down factor.  As it is, it will be harder to get a mortgage or car loan, and the interest rates will probably go up because there will be less competition.  Once house sales slow down and mortgage rates go up, the price of houses will come down (as is already happening).  You will then get the negative equity situation (which is already part of this crisis), where people paid more for their home than its current value.  At that point they either have to keep paying and hope that the value comes back, or they walk away from it and leave the bank to foreclose and try to recover some money from their loan.  Also people end up spending less and then the economy grinds to a halt.  Once that happens, shops start to close and more people are out of work, it is a vicious circle. 

Is that what you really think should happen so you are able to put your finger up at someone who has a lot of money and won't be affected by this like the other 10,000 Lehman employess who aren't guaranteed a job from the Barclays takeover?   Hank Paulson also wanted to stick his finger up at his old rival Dick Fould, and didn't know enough to see the consequences.  If he had given Barclays the $30bn sweetner that they wanted to take over Lehman, then the market might not have gone into a tailspin on Monday, and the big bail out wouldn't have been needed.

And in terms of McCain not getting in, actually in bad economic situations in the States people are more likely to vote for a Republican than a Democrat (especially one without much experience and currently no concrete ideas of how he can 'change' Washington).

[MrBump]

I also know somebody who is being sacked, but I feel that's offset by the fact that the fatcats are finally going to develop some responsibility over the money they handle.

Well, I'm sure that they will be comforted by your views.

[hamfist]

I do get where Noodle is coming from. If one looks at it idealistically, then it sort of seems that the greed, and those who caused it, are getting what they deserve.
  However, in reality, it seems that the fatcats, directors, chief executives etc always seem to come up smelling of roses with a big pay off. It's not only in an alternative universe that these people effectively get paid loads of money for failing and being cr@p at their jobs. If they fail, then they just get paid a huge sum as a severance payment, to get rid of them, and then move into some other highly paid position.

  As has been stated by others, the losers are usually the folks that actually make the "machine" work, rather than those who tell it what to do.

[Roobubba]

I'm just enjoying not being the one with outspoken views for a change.

:)

[dave_mc]

i'm loving the fact that house prices etc. are tumbling, but as everyone's been saying, the dudes getting hardest hit are rarely the dudes who caused the crisis in the first place...

[PhilKing]

Just read this article, you will see that I was right when I said the top guys won't get hurt - they are still guaranteed their bonus even though the company went bankrupt:

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09212008/news/regionalnews/execs_crash__earn_130099.htm

Still happy Noodle?

[Philly Q]

It's not the death of free market capitalism or the end of anything.  The repercussions for many individuals will be terrible, but not for the "fatcats".  As for the financial markets themselves, in a couple of years it'll be like nothing ever happened.