Pedal problem

[Doadman]

I've designed and built my own pedal board and am now stocking it with individual pedals to go with my Ibanez RGT42 and Marshall DSL401. In front of the amp I'm using a Weeping Demon, MXR Super Compressor and Digitech Bad Monkey in that order. All of these pedals work perfectly. In the effects loop I have an EHX Small Clone chorus pedal and this is where my problem lies. As soon as I engage the chorus pedal I lose all my volume and tone. It's like I'm suddenly playing with a wall of cushions in front of the speaker. Any idea what's wrong?

[viking]

EHX's battery is near the end...?(The pedal is directly in the amp's effect loop?)

[Doadman]

Yes, the pedal is in the effects loop and it's running on mains power, daisy chained to all the other pedals. Everything else seems to work fine, though the chorus is the only one in the loop. The mix control on the amp for effects is all the way up.

[hamfist]

If the problem only happens when the chorus pedal is in the loop, and not when it is in front of the amp then it will probably be because the EHX isn't liking the signal levels in the loop (which are far higher than in front of the amp).

[Zaned]

If the problem only happens when the chorus pedal is in the loop, and not when it is in front of the amp then it will probably be because the EHX isn't liking the signal levels in the loop (which are far higher than in front of the amp).

My guess too. Many stompboxes expect an instrument level signal, not line level.

Line 6 DL4 was one too. I thought it was a major design flaw not to add a line level input option for it. EPIC fail.

-Zaned

[Doadman]

You're perfectly correct in that the pedal works fine in front of the amp. At first I thought it was sucking tone but not volume but I found that if I used a patch cable to connect the 'Send' straight to the 'Return' socket then it was fine. Does this just mean that I can't use the chorus pedal in the effects loop because the Small Clone doesn't like the Line Out power or will I have this problem with all of the pedals in the loop, in which case, why have one? If things like chorus and delay are supposed to go in the loop, wouldn't it hinder the effect by placing it in front of the amp?

[hamfist]

You're right in thinking that a lot of pedals won't work well in your loop. Ideally, you would need something which has an option of using a line level signal, something like a DD-20 for example, as the signal level in the loop is much higher than before the amp.
  To be honest though, the only way of really knowing whether a pedal will work well in your loop will be to try it. FX loops can be odd and rather frustrating things sometimes.

[Doadman]

It looks like it's a power issue as the loop in a DSL401 is more designed for rack effects. Are there any time based effects pedals that can be bought to suit this application (+4db), particularly Delay, Chorus, Phaser and Flanger? Alternatively, would I be just as well running all my effects up front and bypass the effects loop all together?

[viking]

I always use Chorus/Phasing pedals in front of the amp.It works ok for me.In the loop,i use the racks (Lexicon).I did use a Boss DSD2 in the loop once and it was ok too ;my loop is a parallel one,not a serial.

[hamfist]

It looks like it's a power issue as the loop in a DSL401 is more designed for rack effects. Are there any time based effects pedals that can be bought to suit this application (+4db), particularly Delay, Chorus, Phaser and Flanger? Alternatively, would I be just as well running all my effects up front and bypass the effects loop all together?

The Boss DD-20 can be switched between line and instrument level.  The TC Electronic Nova pedals (Delay and Modulation) can also be calibrated for various input levels.  There's probably many others too.

[Doadman]

This is all getting to be a bit of a pain. If I use the effects loop I have to use rack effects or I compromise the location and put all effects up front. I went with individual pedals instead of multi effects as so many people told me it was far better but I'd have to say that right now a far better option seems to be selling all the individual pedals I've bought and getting an RP1000 instead. Any thoughts?

[hamfist]

This is all getting to be a bit of a pain. If I use the effects loop I have to use rack effects or I compromise the location and put all effects up front. I went with individual pedals instead of multi effects as so many people told me it was far better but I'd have to say that right now a far better option seems to be selling all the individual pedals I've bought and getting an RP1000 instead. Any thoughts?

Well  .................  Just got a GSP1101 myself, yesterday (only a tiny bit more powerful than an RP1000) and I just think it might be going to replace all my pedals !   It sounds great, and is just so damned convenient !

Can't harm to buy an RP1000, mail order, then you'll have a few days to try it out before it would need to go back if you didn't want to keep it (distance selling regulations and all that). All you've got to lose is a few quid postage then.

[Doadman]

I may well try that before I invest in any more pedals, though interestingly, I posed the same question to Digitech - RP1000 or all the pedals up front. Within minutes they sent a reply that simply said 'Stick to individual pedals'.

It's all so confusing

[Bradock PI]

Individual pedals gives you far more control over what you have, what is the issue with using them up front ? Maybe just change your chorus pedal and then buy ones appropriate to loop or front as you want them.

[Doadman]

Isn't there an issue with putting time based effects in front of the amp, especially if I'm using preamp gain? Other than that, what on earth do I use for Delay, Chorus, Phaser and Flanger that will work in a loop like mine. All I know of is rack effects or a DD-20. Alternatively, which such effects would certainly work up front? I certainly use the gain channels on my amp if that's relevant.