frets? Frets!

[WezV]

i dont know about tonal improvements but i do tend to glue on the refret, just for extra insurance and to reinforce the slot. 

the only reason i have heard not to glue is that it might make future refrets more difficult. tbh i have not found that to be enougth to put me off.  i always heat frets to help release them anyway - and that takes care of any glue thats commonly used

[FELINEGUITARS]

I always glue - it ensures a good grip and that the fret is completely solid with the fretboard.

Doing 20 years of repair has taught me that a loose fret that you can really tell is loose can cause all sorts of buzzing that wont go away (learnt this on some recent-ish USA strats)

I too always heat frets to brak glue joints that may exist - or simply the expension and then subsequent contraction makes them easier to pop out.

NOTE : Fender frets from 196(?)-1983 were slid in sideways and must be knocked out sideway to prevent chipping up fingerboards

[Prawnik]

well if we want to worry about it - surely the effect of the fret will have a lot to do with the material it is joined to? 

to me fretboard choice is more important to the overall tone than fret choice

Doesn't make sense to me: the pickup picks up the vibration of the string. Objects which directly influence the vibrating part of the string (bridge, pick and frets) should have more influence than those things which are indirect contact (fretboard wood and others).

Of course, I may be full of it. That's why I asked if anyone had done an experiment.

but isn't that like saying that the body of the guitar also doesn't make a difference what it's made out of? since the strings only come in direct contact with the bridge? the wood is the big part, anything metal should just transfer the vibration into whatever it's touching.

but i don't really know much. listen to the luthiers in here.

I build guitars myself, so I suppose I could undertake an actual experiment. Still, If someone else has done this before, I'd rather not reinvent the wheel.

In my (limited) experience, body wood is of secondary importance.  Scale length, electronics and bridge/saddle material make a bigger difference. YMMV.

[WezV]

In my (limited) experience, body wood is of secondary importance.  Scale length, electronics and bridge/saddle material make a bigger difference. YMMV.

i dont disagree with that, but i do personally put wood choice higher than elctronics.  Its the foundation that the rest is built on and needs to be good.  I build my guitars for good acoustic tone first in the belief that this will allow greater choice  with the electronics and pickups... if it sounds good acoustically then most pickups will sound good in it too.  with guitars that dont sound good acoustically you can get yourself into the pickup search trying to find something that works with it

i completely agree about scale length being very important which is why i am using fanned frets on some of my builds.

also wood and scale length are fixed from the start of a build, so you need them to be right. the rest can be tweaked afterwards if need be.  so, from a building point of view, i think it makes more sense to focus on things you cant change later

[Prawnik]

In my (limited) experience, body wood is of secondary importance.  Scale length, electronics and bridge/saddle material make a bigger difference. YMMV.

i dont disagree with that, but i do personally put wood choice higher than elctronics.  Its the foundation that the rest is built on and needs to be good.  I build my guitars for good acoustic tone first in the belief that this will allow greater choice  with the electronics and pickups... if it sounds good acoustically then most pickups will sound good in it too.  with guitars that dont sound good acoustically you can get yourself into the pickup search trying to find something that works with it

i completely agree about scale length being very important which is why i am using fanned frets on some of my builds.

also wood and scale length are fixed from the start of a build, so you need them to be right. the rest can be tweaked afterwards if need be.  so, from a building point of view, i think it makes more sense to focus on things you cant change later

If acoustic tone is so critical, why don't we all play amplified archtops or flattops? Even an mediocre archtop will sound better acoustically than any solidbody.

Then again, while I have had solidbodies that did not sound impressive acoustically but were The Bomb when plugged in, I have never had a guitar sound good acoustically but bad plugged in.

Yer right in that it is kind of difficult to change body wood or scale length (unless you are building Fender-type bodies and have an extra body or short-scale neck lying around).

[PhilKing]

[If acoustic tone is so critical, why don't we all play amplified archtops or flattops?

Feedback

[WezV]

what phil said :)

[gwEm]

[If acoustic tone is so critical, why don't we all play amplified archtops or flattops?

Flying V acoustics don't sound great

[Prawnik]

[If acoustic tone is so critical, why don't we all play amplified archtops or flattops?

Feedback

I dunno, a clean Strat can sound pretty sweet. And we all know about clean Teles.

[Afghan Dave]

The plot is officially lost... :?

[Prawnik]

Well, my last comment about clean sounds was to say that, in spite of the fact that an acoustic guitar sounds better played acoustically than any electric, there are still situations where an amplified solidbody electric guitar gets you the sound you want, and feedback isn't as much of an issue.

So I don't think feedback is the only reason we don't amplify acoustics.

[PhilKing]

Well, my last comment about clean sounds was to say that, in spite of the fact that an acoustic guitar sounds better played acoustically than any electric, there are still situations where an amplified solidbody electric guitar gets you the sound you want, and feedback isn't as much of an issue.

So I don't think feedback is the only reason we don't amplify acoustics.

What about The Alarm - could that stop you  PDT_029

[Prawnik]

Well, my last comment about clean sounds was to say that, in spite of the fact that an acoustic guitar sounds better played acoustically than any electric, there are still situations where an amplified solidbody electric guitar gets you the sound you want, and feedback isn't as much of an issue.

So I don't think feedback is the only reason we don't amplify acoustics.

What about The Alarm - could that stop you  PDT_029

Well, eleventeen million jazz guitarists have played on amplified archtops and sounded great and clean in the process.

But that isn't the only good clean electric guitar sound, even though a good Gibson archtop will sound better acoustically (and certainly more resonant) than any solidbody.

[PhilKing]

Well, eleventeen million jazz guitarists have played on amplified archtops and sounded great and clean in the process.

But that isn't the only good clean electric guitar sound, even though a good Gibson archtop will sound better acoustically (and certainly more resonant) than any solidbody.

An Archtop is different to an acoustic with a pickup - that's the sound I was meaning.  I have a very nice Ibanez GB10 and it is a great sound, but an acoustic with a pickup never seems to get the tone that the guitar gets through a good mic.

[Prawnik]

Well, eleventeen million jazz guitarists have played on amplified archtops and sounded great and clean in the process.

But that isn't the only good clean electric guitar sound, even though a good Gibson archtop will sound better acoustically (and certainly more resonant) than any solidbody.

An Archtop is different to an acoustic with a pickup - that's the sound I was meaning.  I have a very nice Ibanez GB10 and it is a great sound, but an acoustic with a pickup never seems to get the tone that the guitar gets through a good mic.

They don't make archtop acoustics?

Anyway, to reiterate my point: if "the better the acoustic tone, the better the electric tone" were true, then why not just use amplified acoustics?

I am really not trying to be a pain here, for years I believed the formula.