Rebel yells

[richard]

Hi Folks,

New to the forum. My first BK was an Irish Tour for the bridge of my Strat which I'm very happy with. I've just had a set of Rebel Yells installed in my Gibson Firebird Studio. This guitar is a Firebird in shape only as it's all mahogany, set neck with a rosewood board. I won't be rehearsing with my band for a couple of weeks which I know will be the real test of these pickups. However, I have some time off work so I cranked up my Cornford Roadhouse to give them a try. I know that scatter winding is supposed to let more high frequencies through but I have some concerns. The top end is really piercing and ice picky. I've tried lowering the treble side of the bridge pick up a lot but it seems to make absolutely no difference.  Also, these pickups do not respond well to the EQ on my amp which usually can make  a drastic difference. I'm finding the neck pick up to be really piercing too. Others have described the RYs as having a smooth top end but I am not finding this to be the case.  I hope I haven't made a horrible (and expensive mistake). I don't consider this to be a bright guitar so I'm at a loss. Any thoughts ?

Cheers, Richie.

[PhilKing]

Check the pots in the guitar.  If they are 300K, then that's the problem.  Rebel Yell's need 500k minimum.  I have them in an all mahogany PRS Standard and they sound great.

[oilpit]

Check the pots in the guitar.  If they are 300K, then that's the problem.  Rebel Yell's need 500k minimum.  I have them in an all mahogany PRS Standard and they sound great.

Raising the pot value will make them sound even brighter...definitely not what he wants

[PhilKing]

Check the pots in the guitar.  If they are 300K, then that's the problem.  Rebel Yell's need 500k minimum.  I have them in an all mahogany PRS Standard and they sound great.

Raising the pot value will make them sound even brighter...definitely not what he wants

You;re right - I can only put it down to a long night last night! 

[dheim]

strange, i've got my RYs in an all mahogany guitar and the tonal balance is PERFECT.
anyway you can alway try to use 250k pots and see what happens... or try to put them very close to the strings...

[HTH AMPS]

BKP have a return policy right? - contact Tim and ask if you can return them for something more suitable.

Alternatively, use the tone control and EQ on your amp to tune in the tone - you should really be able to get the treble tamed on any guitar by doing this.

[gueorgues]

I would say: you are just so very used to dark sounding pickups and the top end is too much for your ear right now. RY don't have a strong low end, have that in mind, if by any chance you are used to more mid-scooped sounding. Unfortunately I am not familiar with your amp and I can't say for sure, but I will give you my personal example. I use my Fender Blues Junior amp and like almost all fenders it is terribly bright and punchy. So there are lots of circumstances to check on.
You did not say what kind of music you play and what kind of pickups you had before in that guitar.

[sjwebb90]

If you have a digital Voltmeter handy measure the actual value of the pots as the tolerance can be quite wide, anything from 450K which will make the guitar sound muddy, all the way to 550K which increases the resonant peak can make the guitar sound very bright and shrill. If the pots are reading high you could try a different value of capacitor to reduce the treble effect.

I have Rebel Yells in my PRS, and installed pots measuring 505K apiece, plus the usual 0.022uf cap, and they sound great!

Cheers
SJ

[richard]

Nearly there now. I lowered the treble side of the pickup nearly flush with the ring and I need to keep the treble control on my Cornford at about 3 on the dial. I left things for a day and when I tried again everything sounded much better. I really need to hear them at a rehearsal but some of the guys are away and it will be about 3 weeks before we get together again. Will report back. I love the responsiveness and articulation. I'm not a really high gain guy but I find I can pile on the gain and they still retain incredible clarity. They replaced the Gibson 490/498T which are not a good match for each other. The 498T loses definition at volume and sounded so smooth it had no bite at all and disappeared in a mix. I think the bite of the RY has taken me completely by surprise after the blandness of the 498T.

[hunter]

I find it weird if you have to lower the pickup down flush with the plastic ring, I really like my BKPs on the bridge quite close to the strings, but surely also depends on the guitar.

Several components could be "the issue" here. Different guitar cables (between guitar and amp) can make a big difference too. I was all into Vovox, but now find them too bright and clear, and switched to Mogami 2524 for a smoother, but still articulate tone. It's much cheaper too, so I ordered some bulk and some plugs to get things sorted for good on my board.

Wiring obviously, if it's wired vintage (tone cap wired to middle slug on volume pot), change to modern (tone cap wired to input, where the pickup is wired on vol pot) - this also smoothes it a bit even with the pots on full (in my experience).

I can relate to that kind of unpleasant treble you report with the Cornford voicing. Cornford bias their amps quite cold, which is Ok if you can really crank them as the tubes start to work harder at higher blasts and it gets thick and creamy, but at lower volumes (below 10 o'clock) I got better results biasing a bit hotter. At 65% I found the sweet spot with my Mk50 with SED =C= 6L6es, that is 41.5mA per tube on 465V plate voltage.

Could also be other things, new strings after pickup change, etc etc.

[Philly Q]

My first BKP was also a Rebel Yell (with an Abraxas neck), replacing a 498T/490R in an all-mahogany Gibson (The Paul SL).

I agree, it is a much brighter sound and very different from the 498T, not much bass and a lot of piercing upper mids.   So yes, it might take some getting used to.  I had a Firebird Studio for a while, to me it sounded SG-ish but with a bit more body due to the bigger, er...... body.  I never changed the pickups but my gut feeling was that some more vintage-style pickups (Mules maybe?) would suit it best.  The RY sounds very "modern" to me.   

Keep plugging away, but from your comments it sounds like the RYs may simply not be to your taste.  You could exchange them, but BKP's exchange/refund warranty is only for the first 14 days after purchase..... however, they are very accomodating, if you keep the pickups in perfect condition and speak to Tim they might be able to arrange something!

[asianaxeman]

Check the pots in the guitar.  If they are 300K, then that's the problem.  Rebel Yell's need 500k minimum.  I have them in an all mahogany PRS Standard and they sound great.

dude I want new alnico pickups to replace the PRS stock pickups in my standard 24, how versatile are the rebel yells in the PRS ? I was also considering crawlers and VHIIs, and need the pickups to cover mainy hard rock and be comfortable with 80s metal tones, advice appreciated. I don't want ceramics and I've already got holy divers so perhaps looking for sweet open tone which can be versatile. It's a silver std 24 (ie no ten top) with rosewood finger board. the current pickups are ok but quite bassy (the HFS) and the neck pickup is lacking output.

RY calibrated
Crawler calibrated
crawler bridge with nailbomb neck?
crawler with VHII neck?
VHIIs? can't decide!

[PhilKing]

Check the pots in the guitar.  If they are 300K, then that's the problem.  Rebel Yell's need 500k minimum.  I have them in an all mahogany PRS Standard and they sound great.

dude I want new alnico pickups to replace the PRS stock pickups in my standard 24, how versatile are the rebel yells in the PRS ? I was also considering crawlers and VHIIs, and need the pickups to cover mainy hard rock and be comfortable with 80s metal tones, advice appreciated. I don't want ceramics and I've already got holy divers so perhaps looking for sweet open tone which can be versatile. It's a silver std 24 (ie no ten top) with rosewood finger board. the current pickups are ok but quite bassy (the HFS) and the neck pickup is lacking output.

RY calibrated
Crawler calibrated
crawler bridge with nailbomb neck?
crawler with VHII neck?
VHIIs? can't decide!

If you've got Holydivers, then I'd be tempted to get VHII's.  I had them in my Artist II (22 fret), but changed them for Mules because of what I play.  I already had the RY's in the Standard (mines from 1990 when they were just standards!), so I put them in something else.  However they had a great sound in the PRS and split well.  Just remember to tell BK you are ordering for a PRS as they have to flip the magnet for the 5-way to work.

[hunter]

Check the pots in the guitar.  If they are 300K, then that's the problem.  Rebel Yell's need 500k minimum.  I have them in an all mahogany PRS Standard and they sound great.

dude I want new alnico pickups to replace the PRS stock pickups in my standard 24, how versatile are the rebel yells in the PRS ? I was also considering crawlers and VHIIs, and need the pickups to cover mainy hard rock and be comfortable with 80s metal tones, advice appreciated. I don't want ceramics and I've already got holy divers so perhaps looking for sweet open tone which can be versatile. It's a silver std 24 (ie no ten top) with rosewood finger board. the current pickups are ok but quite bassy (the HFS) and the neck pickup is lacking output.

RY calibrated
Crawler calibrated
crawler bridge with nailbomb neck?
crawler with VHII neck?
VHIIs? can't decide!

I got a RiffRaff now in the bridge of my McCarty and I would say it rules! Lower gain than the VHII though, it's a quite tight pickup that RiffRaff. Clip on the http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXhbd72FuFc