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Author Topic: Alnico II, III, IV, V  (Read 16277 times)

blueskiwi

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« on: February 01, 2006, 10:10:22 PM »
Hi,

I would like it if someone could characterise the different grades of Alnico in terms of tone for me.  Do they go in sequence (i.e. II being softest, to V brightest and most punchy) ?  Or does each have it's own character?

Seymour Duncan use II and V exclusively. Fralin use III and V.  Bareknuckle seem to use just about all of them in various models which got me wondering (but so far no half and half...?)

cheers!

Tim

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2006, 08:01:40 AM »
Historically they're graded by no as they were introduced starting with a generic low grade Alnico.As the 50's progressed the other grades II,III,IV and V were introduced. AV was developed by the military and was the last to be introduced into the 'public' domain.
Yes they do all add to the character of a pickup although it must be understood that a magnet doesn't have a sound on it's own, it contributes by the way it powers certain frequencies. Alnico II is the softest and generally has a smooth bass and treble although this is more pronounced the hotter the windings get.Alnico III is very transparent, low output and clean,sounds great for rounded fat jazz applications, Alnico IV is probably the best vintage tone IMHO and along with II and III was used in the earliest PAFs-this is a fact  and not myth as we've had them analysed and a collegue of mine has also seen original Gibson purchase orders that clearly state AIV bar stock being purchased.The tone of AIV is balanced and extremely organic, it produces the most authentic vintage tone and sits better in slightly hotter vintage winds than AII which tends to get very mushy if used incorrectly. Finally AV is the hottest producing more highs and lows, great for rock applications or where power and cut are important.
Different companies use different grades for personal reasons, we use all of the applicable Alnico grades to suit the correct design, both to be historically correct but more importantly to have the best sound.
Changing magnets in a humbucker can give dramatic results, you soon find the ones that really don't sit right and others that are head and shoulders better.Obviously you can't swap out single coil magnets as they're integral to the coil form.
I've personally spent alot of time voicing all the BKP range with the correct magnets but I do tweak and swap sometimes on consultation with a customer with a specific requirement.
Tim
BKP - "Wound, made and played the traditional way --- by hand!" Amen.

MDV

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2006, 08:24:17 AM »
Very informative!!

I've seen A8 and A6 used in pickups: any comment on their characteristics, Tim?

P.S. blueskiwi: the alnicos go from 2 to 9, as far as I'm aware.

They are fairly boring and obsolete in industry as samarium cobalt and neodynium are better (read: more powerfull). But they make pickups sound cr@p!!!

Elliot

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2006, 08:49:06 AM »
What is this thing called strat-itis - its something I read on (I think) Bill Lawrence's site that Alnico V causes too much pull - Having Mother's Milks I have to say that I have never experienced this effect and wondered if it was only crude mass produced AV that does this.  Or is it just myth and marketing?
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MDV

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2006, 08:56:03 AM »
I have uber-trills, irish tours, a warpig and a swinshead warthog that are all A5, and no pull problems.

You're setting your pickups pretty high if you do, and I'd say mostly applies to the neck and middle.

blueskiwi

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2006, 10:07:30 AM »
yeah I heard that lipstick pickups use Alnico 6

that was very informative, thanks Tim.  I'm mainly interested in single coils and it was the use of Alnico IV in the Yardbird set that piqued my curiosity as I hadn't seen that before.

Ratrod

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2006, 05:11:13 PM »
EMG makes alot of statements concerning string pull. I don't believe that a pickup's magnet is powerfull enough to actually pull the string towards it. But it might have some effect on the string's movement. However, I can't hear or see the difference.
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Hell Hound

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2006, 05:20:34 PM »
It has an audible influence on strings. In my custom guitar the neck pickup was too close to the strings and it caused some really anoying oscillations. I just set it lower and tadaaa no more problem :)
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Gochaz

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2006, 05:51:58 PM »
Apperantly, on some of the old Gretsches with single coils, when the strings were slackened they stuck to the pickups. This also sapped sustain, too strong a magnet.
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Tellboy

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Alnico II, III, IV, V
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2006, 06:23:22 PM »
Quote from: Elliot
What is this thing called strat-itis - its something I read on (I think) Bill Lawrence's site that Alnico V causes too much pull - Having Mother's Milks I have to say that I have never experienced this effect and wondered if it was only crude mass produced AV that does this.  Or is it just myth and marketing?


I had this problem on my Tele before I fitted the Boss set. It had Rio Grande pickups with a Muy Grande bridge which has very large diameter A5 magnets. The magnetic field from the poles (on the low E in my case) affects the natural vibration of the string causing odd harmonics and making it virtually impossible to get the string in tune correctly. The only way I could stop it was to lower the bass side of the pickup down very low so that the magnets were not pulling so hard on the string. Since I've fitted the Boss set I've not had this problem and can set the pickup much nearer the strings - although the Muy Grande was slightly more powerfull than the Boss it looses its Tele sound when turned up high.
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