Bridge pickup for a 1977 LP

[ShaneMQ]

Hey guys,

I'm looking to upgrade my bridge pickup in my '77 Les Paul. I've done a ton of research on these forums, but I'm still having trouble pulling the trigger. I play through a Diezel Einstein, and want something that can run the gammut from Lizzy-esque LP tone to heavier thrashy stuff. I was looking hard at the HD's,  but also the RY's, Emerald and Cold Sweat. The big difference between most of the comparatives I've read on this board is that my LP has a rosewood fretboard, and isn't as bright as the late 70's LP's with the ebony boards. Any adivce?

Thanks!

[Kiichi]

Hi and welcome!
In a not so that bright LP I can see the Emerald working wonders. It is pretty bright, which should sit very nicely and it obviously can do Thin Lizzy, but it is also a favorite among metal players, cause it can go high gain as heck. With a Diesel (if I recall they do have quite a bit of gain on tap) you should be able to get nice thrash stuff outa there.
The others you mentioned would work too in their own way, with the HD probably least good in this axe, but I would say Emerald!

[dingleberry]

I've had a holydiver and currently have an emerald in the bridge of my PRS SC245, fairly warm sounding lp style guitar.  Holydiver was a bit tubby, still sounded really good but not quite tight enough for thrash or open enough for the classic stuff (to my tastes at least).  Emerald does a good job of both but I prefer it with a 300k volume pot, as it was a bit toppy before hand.  Never tried a rebel yell, might be a good halfway point between the two.

[ShaneMQ]

Thanks for the responses guys. It's interesting you say that the HD might not be tight enough; I was worried about it being too articulate and tight of a PU (which actually seems to be what a lot of people say about the Rebel Yell). The thing with my LP is that it's still pretty bright - it's got that maple neck but a rosewood board, so it's not as crazy bright as the late 70's LPs w the maple neck and ebony board. I was using the SD Custom Customs for awhile, and they sounded great, but I want something with a little more character. Emerald sounds like it might be the way to go.

[ericsabbath]

the black dog sounds really good in my '78 greco les paul standard (maple neck as yours, brazilian rosewood board)
I had the dog installed it in my '73 gibson les paul custom (mahogany neck, ebony board) and it wasn't as great as it is in the greco, but by the time, I played and recorded with the les paul custom through a 50w Einstein and it did sound great
the dog in the greco sounds brighter and clearer, with more articulation, and has a quite meaty and midrangy tone tone
didn't try the greco through a real diezel, though (but me and my bandmate have diezel based preamps, so we're not far off)

Diezels sound better with lower output pickups, in my opinion (and most experienced diezel users seem to agree with that, including Peter Diezel himself)
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BUT, my first picks would be the emerald or the riff raff IF you don't mind having bright sounding pickups

[Gibson 1964]

If you haven't upgraded the pots, I would start there. My '84 LPC sounded really muddy and dead till I replaced the pots (300k volume, 100k tone) with 500k all around.

[ShaneMQ]

Thanks guys. I have upgraded the pots, which definitely helped. My LP is a weird beast - I can never get the neck pickup to have enough clarity; it always sounds a bit muted/muddy (tried the original T-Tops, Burstbucker 1's, etc.), and the bridge PU always sounds significantly brighter and sometimes thin. I had a Duncan Custom Custom in the bridge which helped round out the tone a bit, but I've been wanting to put BK's in there awhile for more character.

How are the Emerald's in the neck? Would an Emerald and Black Dog combo, or even an Emerald and HD/RY be reasonable? Or, Eric, do you think that the HD is just way too high output (my Einstein is a 100w, so it is a little different than the 50w).

Thanks again guys - you've been extremely helpful.

[HTH AMPS]

You'd be swell advised the check the values of the pots in your Les Paul - Gibson used weird values over the years.

You want 500k pots all round in that Custom.

I'd say Emeralds too, but if you want fatter bridge and a clearer neck - Abraxas all the way.

[Slartibartfarst42]

To me, this is screaming out for a Cold Sweat bridge and Emerald neck. Both will give you great Thin Lizzy tones but the bridge will have a bit more balls to it than the Emerald so also gives you access to the heavier stuff while the Emerald neck is super sweet and very versatile. I think that's a combination you'd love.

[Gibson 1964]

I'd say emeralds as well. The Holy Diver I had, I found way too smooth and dark for my taste.  I know some guys will think I am crazy, but since you mentioned thin Lizzy and thrash, my thoughts would go to Emeralds or Rebel Yells.

[Alex]

Thanks guys. I have upgraded the pots, which definitely helped. My LP is a weird beast - I can never get the neck pickup to have enough clarity; it always sounds a bit muted/muddy (tried the original T-Tops, Burstbucker 1's, etc.), and the bridge PU always sounds significantly brighter and sometimes thin. I had a Duncan Custom Custom in the bridge which helped round out the tone a bit, but I've been wanting to put BK's in there awhile for more character.

How are the Emerald's in the neck? Would an Emerald and Black Dog combo, or even an Emerald and HD/RY be reasonable? Or, Eric, do you think that the HD is just way too high output (my Einstein is a 100w, so it is a little different than the 50w).

Thanks again guys - you've been extremely helpful.

Gibson makes an ceramic neck pickup (490?496?) that it matches with the 500T. From my experience I would say that is what you're basically you're looking for, as a BKP version with a bit less output (it clears up great though). I would have guessed that the Cold Sweat Neck is the closest to that.

[ericsabbath]

Thanks guys. I have upgraded the pots, which definitely helped. My LP is a weird beast - I can never get the neck pickup to have enough clarity; it always sounds a bit muted/muddy (tried the original T-Tops, Burstbucker 1's, etc.), and the bridge PU always sounds significantly brighter and sometimes thin. I had a Duncan Custom Custom in the bridge which helped round out the tone a bit, but I've been wanting to put BK's in there awhile for more character.

How are the Emerald's in the neck? Would an Emerald and Black Dog combo, or even an Emerald and HD/RY be reasonable? Or, Eric, do you think that the HD is just way too high output (my Einstein is a 100w, so it is a little different than the 50w).

Thanks again guys - you've been extremely helpful.

not sure about the neck emerald, but I believe it's hotter than the bridge black dog
no, the HD isn't too high output
should be about as hot as the sh-11 and might even feel a little less hot, since it won't compress your tone like a seymour
I had a diver in the same guitar right before the black dog and also played it through the einsten
voicing is quite similar and both sounded great, but the dog extra openness and articulation (due to lower output) makes it blend in more nicely with the diezel kind of saturation, in my opinion
but the holy diver won't sound bad at all
it's an amazing pickup
as a reference, the diver works amazingly well for Doug Aldrich's tones, and he was a custom custom user for years before he got his suhr signature pickup (which is considerably hotter and bassier than both, more like a neck miracle man)

here's a holy diver les paul clip with a diezel VH4: http://tonefinder.com/?section=id&value=895
sounds a little edgy on the clip, but it's a quite smooth pickup (maybe that was the old ceramic version that became the cold sweat?)

here's a rough clip I did 6 years ago
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1RafxMYU5w

[JTG]

Now Eric, would you say the HD can be a bit on the tubby side for standard tuning, or more for when you downtune? I've used the JB for as long as dirt has been on this planet, but have had an increasing interest in the BKP offerings. The HD was on my list of interest, as is the Alnico Nailbomb and BlackDog.

Oh, and you might remember me as Soulcrusher_X on the old HCAF forum. and NO! You still can't have my grey Les Paul. ;)

[Kiichi]

Welcome here JTG! Depending on what you want exactly I think the HD can be very much for you. One of the first descriptions I have heard of it said it caters to the same taste as the JB does, but with the traditional BKP flavour and generally added goodness. That of course is a simplification though, there is much more depth to its tone and qualitys than I could describe so shortly.

Most people start with one and follow with several others, so just pick your poison, chug it and be a happy drooling man like a lot of us. =)

[Slartibartfarst42]

Now Eric, would you say the HD can be a bit on the tubby side for standard tuning, or more for when you downtune? I've used the JB for as long as dirt has been on this planet, but have had an increasing interest in the BKP offerings. The HD was on my list of interest, as is the Alnico Nailbomb and BlackDog.

Oh, and you might remember me as Soulcrusher_X on the old HCAF forum. and NO! You still can't have my grey Les Paul. ;)

The Holydiver has SOME of the characteristics of the JB. It's thick, smooth and fluid but it's far more articulate than the JB with no mud at all, the tone is a lot sweeter and it's not quite as compressed so it retains some PAF DNA. The Holydiver is a lot more versatile than the JB. The A-Bomb is a VERY different beast. It's tighter and far more aggressive than even the Miracle Man. I found it to be completely brutal.