Pickup suggestions - Tradition S20 LP

[nomadx]

Hello, all.

This is my first post.  Yippee!!

I picked up a Tradition S20 goldtop LP and it's all mahogany.  It plays really well, but the stock pickups aren't doing if for me.  They sound like they're meant for blues/bluesey rock (way too warm and tame).  I write/record prog metal; heavy and clean.  Far from anything blues!

I'm looking at upgrading the pots to CTS 500k and putting in a balanced pair of ceramic nailbombs.  Is this a good choice?

Thanks much.

[Kiichi]

Hi and welcome!

The Cbomb is certainly a good choice, should work great for prog metal. When I asked what to pick for the modern Petrucci tone Cbomb with Cold Sweat neck was usually the answer. The bridge gives you tighness, relative versatility, agression and while it is modern and has somewhat of a 90s metal feel to it, there is still some of the PAF woodyness in there, making it a great choice for prog metal.
The CS neck would be a good paring, as it does deliver very fluent leads and a warm clean tone, while being very defined.

As an alternative you could consider going Holydiver set or HD bridge with an emerald neck.
The HD would be a less agressive alternative to the NB, going for a bit more smooth musicallity, with thicker mids and a more organic feel. Many would say it is also more versatile then the NB, though less tight. The neck is also a great singing smooth afair.
As for the emerald neck, that one seems to be a perfect pair with the HD bridge. It is sweet as honey, open, smooth, fluent,...I heard it often described as a sweeter, more organic CS neck.

Depending on how modern or organic you want it Iīd say pick your poison with the NB CS or the HD EM, canīt go wrong with either.


Cheers!

[Mr. Air]

Ceramic Nailbomb and Cold Sweat neck would get my vote.

[nomadx]

Hi and welcome!

The Cbomb is certainly a good choice, should work great for prog metal. When I asked what to pick for the modern Petrucci tone Cbomb with Cold Sweat neck was usually the answer. The bridge gives you tighness, relative versatility, agression and while it is modern and has somewhat of a 90s metal feel to it, there is still some of the PAF woodyness in there, making it a great choice for prog metal.
The CS neck would be a good paring, as it does deliver very fluent leads and a warm clean tone, while being very defined.

As an alternative you could consider going Holydiver set or HD bridge with an emerald neck.
The HD would be a less agressive alternative to the NB, going for a bit more smooth musicallity, with thicker mids and a more organic feel. Many would say it is also more versatile then the NB, though less tight. The neck is also a great singing smooth afair.
As for the emerald neck, that one seems to be a perfect pair with the HD bridge. It is sweet as honey, open, smooth, fluent,...I heard it often described as a sweeter, more organic CS neck.

Depending on how modern or organic you want it Iīd say pick your poison with the NB CS or the HD EM, canīt go wrong with either.


Cheers!

Thanks for your thoughts, Kiichi.  The clean sample given for the CS neck seems to have a bit more clairity that the NB. Is that the general feeling?  I just want to make sure it sounds good for that LP chunk of mahogany I have.  I do love what I'm hearing in the sample for the ceramic NB bridge.  I just hope it will keep its personality in the LP.

Are there particular pots that are recommended?

[nomadx]

Ceramic Nailbomb and Cold Sweat neck would get my vote.

Thanks, Mr. Air.  So far, I think I'm falling in line with that.  I figured at first a calibrated set would work better together.  I guess that's not necessarily true?

[Slartibartfarst42]

I think the Nailbomb would be a good choice for your guitar and style of music, though I wouldn't immediately discount the alnico version as it remains the tightest and most aggressive pickup I've ever tried. Either the Cold Sweat or Emerald neck will work well but I've also heard good things about Painkiller and Miracle Man neck pickups, either of which might suit you.

[Kiichi]

As per usual I agree with Slartibartfarst42. You might even add the Aftermath neck to that list, as I feel it produces a great fluid, full and modern tone, reminding me a lot of early Petrucci tones.

On the NB neck: Of course it is a good neck PU also, BKPs donīt really make sh*t after all, but it is the only BKP that actually is scooped. That term is sometimes used to describe the MM bridge too, but there it is not that the mids are lacking, but that the low mids are much more pronounced. With the NB neck it actually is scooped. If that fits your bill and you like that sound it might be for you, I have heard good things about it after all, but always the mids issue as a thing to concider.

[Slartibartfarst42]

As per usual I agree with Slartibartfarst42.

We're going to start making a very good double act soon  :D

[nomadx]

I think the Nailbomb would be a good choice for your guitar and style of music, though I wouldn't immediately discount the alnico version as it remains the tightest and most aggressive pickup I've ever tried. Either the Cold Sweat or Emerald neck will work well but I've also heard good things about Painkiller and Miracle Man neck pickups, either of which might suit you.

I went back and took a closer listen to the samples.  The alnico NB does have a bet better presence in the low mids.  I suppose the graphs would tell me that. :)

I've been talked out of the NB for the neck.  I just have to determine which one for the neck?

As I've stated, I'm afraid that I have choose a pickup that is too warm in the lows and mids that it will be multiplied by the natural sound of LP style guitar, cancelling any crispness of the highs.  Any Tradition, Epi or Agile owners with a similar setup?

[Slartibartfarst42]

Having used both Cold Sweat and Emerald neck pickups I would seriously doubt they'd be swamped by the mahogany in your guitar as they're both pickups that are primarily made for Les Pauls even though they will work well in other guitars too. I've not tried either the Painkiller or Miracle Man necks myself so someone else may need to chime in but from what I've heard, I doubt either would struggle, especially not the Painkiller.

[nomadx]

Having used both Cold Sweat and Emerald neck pickups I would seriously doubt they'd be swamped by the mahogany in your guitar as they're both pickups that are primarily made for Les Pauls even though they will work well in other guitars too. I've not tried either the Painkiller or Miracle Man necks myself so someone else may need to chime in but from what I've heard, I doubt either would struggle, especially not the Painkiller.

Thanks, Slartibartfarst42. I think I've decided on the Painkiller for the neck.  It does sound sweet.  I'll still have to pull the trigger on Cbomb vs the Abomb for the bridge.

Any suggestions on pots?  I have no idea what the stock ones are for the Tradition.

[Slartibartfarst42]

The 550k pots from BKP are very good indeed.

[nomadx]

Okay.  So I've done a lot of listening to soundclips from various sources and the nailbombs don't seem to be as tight as I thought for it's bottom end.  Would the painkiller for a bridge be fizzy in the highs?  I like the bottom end it provides.  However, I heard the painkiller has an issue with lower tuning.  I suppose I may be looking for perfection that simply is not there.  It's my OCD!!  :?

[Slartibartfarst42]

That may well be so but I think we all get a little OCD about pickups. Firstly, I'd have to say that there is simply no way that I can see anyone finding even the alnico Nailbomb in any way even vaguely loose in the bottom end and I imagine the ceramic version is even tighter. It's not just that it's 'tight', you need to remember that the articulation you get with BKP is so phenomenal that pretty much every BKP has an element of tightness compared to other pickups. The BKP I've tried that is probably the most loose in the bass is the Holydiver and even that's tighter than something like a ceramic JB and a HELL of a lot more articulate, staying well defined long after my old JB turned to mush. The Nailbomb's on a whole new level beyond that to the point that when I tried it, I had the amp and overdrives all maxed out for gain and it was still as tight as a duck's arse! Both Nailbombs will be VERY tight, VERY articulate and VERY aggressive. I've not tried a Painkiller myself so I can't really comment on that one. Many people seem to like it though I have read from time to time about it being a bit ice-picky, but that may be due to the guitar it's in. The Nailbomb, certainly in the alnico form I tried, is quite a big, thick sound with plenty bottom end and couldn't be described as 'loose' in any shape or form.

[Gary_Goo]

In an all mahogany guitar I wouldn't go with anything too mid biased as its already quite a mid focused wood. If anything I would say that something slightly mid scooped (or possibly more high mid focused) would be a better bet as you wont lose the high end and you'll get away from being too warm. It'll also mean that your clean sounds wont sound mushy or muffled.
I don't have any experience of high gain pickups, so I'm not even going to start recommending anything, but I'd probably drop an email to the BKP boys and ask them what they think will work in that guitar for the sounds you're after, as all mahogany construction guitars can be a bit more sensitive to pickup choice sometimes.