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Author Topic: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B  (Read 13528 times)

EffigyForgotten

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Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« on: October 09, 2013, 12:05:16 PM »
I'm curious to what the differences are between these speakers in a 4x12 cab playing black/death metal. Currently using a PRS Custom 24 with an HD set and Bugera 6260.

My 2x12 doesn't spread the sound enough, like its way too directional, would a 4x12 help this and is getting an open back or "semi" open back cab going to help or should I just go with a closed back which is suppose to be tighter sounding?

Dave Sloven

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2013, 12:13:45 PM »
My Orange PPC412 is very directional.  Sounds very different depending on where you stand in relation to it.  I think it's the cab's fault, not the speakers, as V30s are used in a lot of cabs.
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EffigyForgotten

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2013, 01:10:37 PM »
Yeah it is 100% the cabs fault, but I figure 2 more speakers would result in the sound spreading out more. Plus having my face right in the middle of 2 speakers to hear the best sound is kind of annoying.

This thread is more about the speakers though as I will get another custom cab when I get the money.

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2013, 01:26:12 PM »
Straight cabs seem to be more directional than slant cabs.

Also I wonder how much the 'tweed' on the front causes this effect?  Orange cabs seem to have a quite heavy fabric there for the sound to push through.  Maybe try taking yours off and see if it sounds much different.  You might be able to replace it with a more open grill type thing like front-loaded cabs often use
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EffigyForgotten

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2013, 01:33:53 PM »
The grill on mine is about as open as possible, [img]http://i1107.photobucket.com/albums/h382/atirado5/WP_000182.jpg/img]

Looks like that.

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2013, 01:36:13 PM »
OK well that's one variable you won't need to investigate!
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EffigyForgotten

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2013, 01:43:02 PM »
I really doubt there's anyone here with experience with all these speakers, 95% of guitarists seem to use celestions.

AndyR

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2013, 01:51:16 PM »
Umm... before you consider the speakers themselves.

A 4x12, certainly a straight one, is more directional than a 2x12 - the sound-waves from the sound sources (each speaker) interract. With a 4x12 you end up with a kind of "cross-shaped" beam coming straight out of the box. The direction the cab is pointing is the direct that beam is going. Sure you can hear it either side, but it's a lot louder and focused for anyone stood or sat in the "beam".

From your original post, if you want less directional than a 2x12, with sound radiating in all directions, you need to go the other way - 1x12.
But that might add a whole different set of things that might be issues for you instead? :lol:

I used 1x12 when I was gigging because it was essential that I could subconsciously "focus" on the sound coming out of that corner of the stage, no matter where on the stage I was. When I could focus like that, I could "hear" my guitar on auto-pilot and then concentrate more on the @rsing-about and being the lead-vocalist at the same time.

When I used 4x12 it was a complete nightmare - the sound was huge, fabulous, but I couldn't hear my guitar well enough to feel secure that I was playing it correctly... unless I stood in front of the bloody cab!!

Obviously, I could have got used to the on-stage effect of a 4x12, but I didn't (and we had other reasons for keeping me 1x12).

But the key thing is this:
2x12 is more directional than 1x12
4x12 is even more directional than 2x12

Don't get a 4x12 for spreading the sound better, get it for a BIGGER sound or louder.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2013, 01:54:54 PM by AndyR »
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EffigyForgotten

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2013, 02:02:57 PM »
Well a bigger/louder sound is a good thing.

AndyR

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2013, 02:39:28 PM »
4x12 is probably what you want then! :D

Don't be surprised by it being more directional, though.

It really surprised me when I experienced it years ago. I'd wanted to get a 4x12 but couldn't afford it (or carry it!). Someone lent us one for a few gigs. It sounded fabulous on its own, but I hated it during the gigs. It was our sound-engineer (a physicist) who explained it to me when I told him what my problem was on stage - it's interference and diffraction when you use multiple wave sources.

If you google it, most of the examples will be about light as a waveform, but the same thing applies to sound-waves - multiple speakers in a cab set up diffraction patterns that result in "peaks" and "troughs" - louder and quieter places in the room - that we perceive as "the cab is a bit directional".

A 2x12's diffraction pattern is "spokes" (like a cartwheel) of loudness radiating out from the cab, stand in between these spokes and it's quieter. A 4x12 generates a diffraction pattern that ends up as cross-shaped beam coming out from the front of the cab.

It's more complicated than that, obviously, especially when you add in reflections off of walls, ceiling, etc. But the spokes and the cross thing are the effects caused by the speaker configuration.

A single speaker just radiates in all directions, no interractions with other primary sources of the same sound, so no peaks and troughs. So we don't perceive the cab as directional.

(Oh, and btw, the questions on speakers themselves, can't help you there, no experience on that side of things! :D)
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Toe-Knee

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2013, 04:28:57 PM »
Any closed cab back will be fairly directional.

Try removing the back panel and seeing how you like it. If its better to your ears then i would suggest cutting a panel in the back that can be removed seperately this will help to keep the sound spread out but the mostly closed nature will retain the tightness you will be used to.,

Another option is beam blockers. Whilst traditionally meant to stop the highs being so directional they do work very well with spreading the sound out too. However as a downside they make micing the cab a nightmare.

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dave_mc

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2013, 05:04:00 PM »
I haven't tried the wizard or governor- from what I hear, they're eminence's take on a g12h30 and v30 respectively (which I have tried).

R W+B is American-sounding, and (fairly) vintage-sounding. Unless you're sure that's what you want, I doubt it is, kind of thing.

v12 is kind of like a more mellow v30, with more lower mids/chunk.

Toe-Knee

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2013, 05:05:15 PM »
I haven't tried the wizard or governor- from what I hear, they're eminence's take on a g12h30 and v30 respectively (which I have tried).

R W+B is American-sounding, and (fairly) vintage-sounding. Unless you're sure that's what you want, I doubt it is, kind of thing.

v12 is kind of like a more mellow v30, with more lower mids/chunk.

It's interesting that you think that about the V12. I find it more aggressive but less fizzy with less low end. You are right about the low mids though I also found it a heck of a lot tighter. Most likely due to the fact it isn't as boomy.
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Alex

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2013, 07:49:41 PM »
I can only add that the Governor is a very good speaker and does not have to fear being compared to the V30 at all.
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Plenum n Heather

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Re: Governor vs V128 vs Wizard vs RW&B
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2013, 12:33:31 AM »
Quite frankly, comparing Eminence to Celestion is b*llsh*t.