Kemper vs Real amp head with two notes torpedo live

[dgaroz]

Hi,

Once I have loaded all my axes with BKPs is the time to change my rig.

I am using an ENGL powerball right now. Nice metal sound but it doesn't cut through the mix (it disappears behind the bass and the other guitar) and it is not exactly the sound I will really need in the near future (hard rock, southern rock and stoner... no more metal). On the other hand I want something handy for home recording with medium-high quality without noise (night recording).

My two options are:

1) Get a Mesa-Boogie Dual Rectifier head together with a Two notes Torpedo live cab-mic emulator. A pretty versatile amp used in the best way for silent recording I have found out.

2) Get a Kemper. For me the coolest emulator I have ever heard... Full of options and realistic tones.

Has anyone experience with any of those? Any input will be more than welcome.

PD: Just to focus the debate... I would not like to start a discussion about Axe Fx Vs Kemper, POD HD or Eleven Rack... neither Dual Rectifier vs Bogner Ecstacy vs Diezel VH4 or whatever. There are tons of posts around there talking about many different options. For me Kemper and the dual rectifier are the number one options, but I would like to know the pros and cons of an high-end emulator versus a real amp with the torpedo.

Thanks in advance guys!

[Plenum n Heather]

You yourself compare the Kemper to a 'real' head. Sounds like the debate is already over. :)

[dgaroz]

Yeah... It might be over if we were talking about a real head with a real cab and a real mic vs Kemper... But I have no room for a real cab and mic. So I MUST emulate something, whether cab+mic (torpedo) or everything (kemper).

The question here is: is it Worthy to use a real amp with torpedo vs everything emulated (kemper)?

Kemper:
Pros: Cheaper, no maintenance (no valves), many amps.
Cons: You lose amp dynamic (touch), you have to deal with rig profiled by others (maybe not exactly your tone).

Dual rectifier + Torpedo:
Pros: Nice tone, quite versatile. Able to crank the amp at any desired level.
Cons: Price, maintenance, space (kemper is quite smaller)... just one amp (not many).

So... not such an easy decision, at least for me.

[tekbow]

if your sound is disappearing in the mix have you tried turning up the mids?

If not cutting though the mix is an issue, a dual rec is not going to rememdy that.

Also, from what i'm reading about the torpedo, its not a load box, its meant to go after pedals and into a mixer (if the C.A.B is the one you're talking about?

[dgaroz]

if your sound is disappearing in the mix have you tried turning up the mids?

If not cutting though the mix is an issue, a dual rec is not going to rememdy that.

Also, from what i'm reading about the torpedo, its not a load box, its meant to go after pedals and into a mixer (if the C.A.B is the one you're talking about?

The point is that ENGL brights with a 'V' eq... I have heard several Rectifiers with different eq and they sound better IMO than the ENGL... It's just a matter of taste. ENGL is huge for metal, but Mesa can do other things better.

The two notes torpedo live (http://www.two-notes.com/en/hardware/torpedo-live/) is a loadbox and a processor to emulate different cabs and mics (being able ot change a lot of parameters).

[tekbow]

ah gotcha on the torpedo, was looking at the wrong one

So the engl has an even bigger scoop than a dual rec?

[dgaroz]

ah gotcha on the torpedo, was looking at the wrong one

So the engl has an even bigger scoop than a dual rec?

I bought the ENGL Powerball just because it was the one with the biggest 'V' I found... really scooped mids. I have heard many dual rectifiers, but never have one... so didn't have one enough to evaluate if it is "more scooped"... I find hardly to get more 'V' (less mids) than the ENGL anyway.

By the way, I also use a BBE sonic maximizer (to make highs and lows clearer). I guess I'll stop using it...

[Brow]

A friend of mine has just bought a Kemper so I'm going round there in a few weeks time so that he can profile my SLO Clone and Splawn Quick Rod.

This will be my 1st experience of this sort of thing, I've pretty much always been a head/cab guy apart from a small foray into racks a while back, so I'm curious to see how it works out.

[dgaroz]

A friend of mine has just bought a Kemper so I'm going roudn there in a few weeks time so that he can profile my SLO Clone and Splawn Quick Rod.

This will be my 1st experience of this sort of thing, I've pretty much always been a head/cab guy apart from a small foray into racks a while back, so I'm curious to see how it works out.

Looking forward to hear your feedback...   :D

[dgaroz]

Hi guys,

After some time I have had the chance of testing myself both options. Joyful time, by the way...

Short review: Both options are awesome for silent recording. If you have already found "your tone" using a very specific tube amp, then go for the torpedo without any kind of doubt, but if you are in the "chase" of it or you need many different tones, then buy the Kemper (you will save A LOT of money).

Long review:

Two notes torpedo (live in my case) is a very accurate way of recording your tone in silent mode (headphones only if needed). It really allows you to find the sweet spot of your amp and record it without the big noise. For some amps, like ENGL Powerball, was pretty easy... Just setting the master to one o'clock (60% or so) and you get that, bluesy sound for the channel 2 and metal fury on channels 3 and 4. Unfortunately my experience with the Mesa Boogie Dual rectifier was not so good. This amp is a really powerful monster, so when you set the master volume higher than the 20-25% the Torpedo starts to sound pretty bad (it was not my unit, because I tested two and both had the very same problem). Two notes torpedo live is designed for 100W RMS and I confirmed with a technical guy that this amp delivers more than 160W RMS... that's a lot... Just to much for the Torpedo. However, I was still able of getting the kind of tone from the dual rectifier, with short options of tweaking around.

Kemper is a very different option. I have spent some time looking for the right rigs, but now I have at least 3-4 sounds that are pretty impressive. I can't imagine how they could sound better (Bogner Shiva, Marshall JCM 800 and Mesa Boogie Dual rectifier). Unlike other digital solutions (Axe FX, Eleven Rack, POD HD, etc), Kemper does not require a lot of tweaking... Indeed, you find the right sound or you don't... Once you've got it you just tweak the reverb or some basic eq and you are there... Axe FX lovers won't probably like Kemper, I guess.
In my case, Kemper is a better, more affordable and easy to maintain/improve solution. I get what I need and much more, additionally I do not care about changing tubes or carry heavy stuff (kemper is far more lighter than any tube head plus the torpedo plus the effects...).

Both options sound pretty real, pretty accurate, organic and natural. I can't imagine anyone able to distinguish between the real amp recorded and the Kemper or the Torpedo (just listening, not playing). After trying both I find that Torpedo is really suitable for those that really love just one amp and build their sound around it with pedals and so. In any other case Kemper is better IMHO.

I hope this helps for those having the same problems I had before investing quite a lot of time and money to try all the stuff on my own... However, if you have the chance, do it yourself! (no one will judge it better than you).

[Plenum n Heather]

Excellent review! So, which one are you going for?

[dgaroz]

I returned the Two notes torpedo to Thomann, sold the Mesa Boogie and now I only have the kemper. Still looking for the perfect sound... But this guys are helping me a lot http://www.theampfactory.com/... cheap and great sounding profiles.

[gordiji]

It sounds very interesting but i've a few questions. Many modelers sound reasonable, especially highish gain tones, but what about clean & crunch tones and then at a live sound level ?
If going this route you still need a power amp & cab or a pa & monitor so apart from endless variety what is gained ?

[dgaroz]

It sounds very interesting but i've a few questions. Many modelers sound reasonable, especially highish gain tones, but what about clean & crunch tones and then at a live sound level ?
If going this route you still need a power amp & cab or a pa & monitor so apart from endless variety what is gained ?

As you said high gain tones are easy to get in the Kemper, but you can also get awesome crunch and clean tones... I have profiles for Bogner Shiva and Marshall JCM800 that sound incredible realistic... and yes... with that "tube feeling".

I use the kemper connected to a Focusrite scarlett sound card and its output directly to my near field studio monitors. Pretty easy, pretty comfortable. I will always use the kemper directly to the mixer and then I can control my monitors and PA independently (you must trust in the sound engineer, of course).

IMHO the Kemper versions with the power amp (500€ more expensive) are not very useful (unless you already have a wonderful 4x12 cab that you can live without...). For the good and the bad, Kemper captures a specific rig very (VERY) accurately, so the final tone has a lot to do with the cab and the mic used when profiling. Using a standard cab (2x12, 4x12 or whatever) with a "power" Kemper you are only using 1 of the 3 things modelled by the kemper (head, cab, mic), which does not make a lot of sense to me.  I bought the JCM800 profiles and they sound absolutely amazing... can't imagine myself getting a better tone in a studio with the real amp (and no help for an expert in studio recording).

Finally... Kemper concept has nothing to do with Axe Fx, Eleven Rack or POD HD. If you love tube amps and don't want to spend hours tweaking Kemper is the solution. It's not better or worse than the other, just other thing.

I hope this helps...