Still pondering!

[Slartibartfarst42]

Previously, this was an academic question for the future but now my wife is talking about buying me a pickup for Xmas (isn’t she wonderful!). In fairness, I have made some progress since last time I mentioned this but let’s first recap the current situation.

What I Have:

Two PRS SE Custom 24 guitars. One has a Holydiver bridge and Emerald neck and is used as my ‘80s Metal - modern day’ guitar. For this application, the Holydiver is fantastic and the Emerald neck is simply the perfect neck pickup. My other PRS SE CU24 uses a Crawler/Holydiver set and is to cover Blues/Blues Rock/Heavy Rock. The Crawler is simply sensational and the Holydiver works in the neck as it’s surprisingly vintage sounding.

What I want:

I now have a Vintage V100 (all mahogany Les Paul copy) that I’d like to slot between my PRS guitars by being Classic Rock – 80s Metal but that’s what’s giving me a headache. I want a classic Les Paul tone with a thick, rich and highly articulate bottom end. I’d like it to have more bite to it that the Holydiver or Crawler as they’re smooth. Les Paul players I like would be people like Gary Moore, Slash, John Sykes etc. Players very much from my era I guess. The trouble is that to ‘slot between my PRS guitars’ means either something contemporary in terms of power or something vintage/vintage hot in terms of application. I also have to consider which neck pup will eventually go in there and the Emerald is the most likely candidate as it’s easily my favourite. At the moment I can only think of two or maybe three and one of those, many people may find surprising coming from me!

If I think ‘Vintage Hot’, the Black Dog stands out as the most likely candidate. I have no direct experience but it seems to me that it’s got a prominent bottom end, it’s articulate enough without being excessively tight and it has a classic Les Paul feel about it, albeit in a more modern interpretation. The downsides may be that it’s not hot enough to live with an Emerald neck, in which case what the hell do I put in the neck and given that traditionally I prefer contemporary bridge pickups, will it not have enough compression and saturation? The Bruce Dickinson clips always sound fantastic to me and are the main reason why I’m thinking of the Black Dogs.

If I think ‘Contemporary’, surprisingly it’s the A-Bomb that I keep coming back to! The reason I think of it is because I’ve always felt it would sit well in a Les Paul. It does sound more open than many hot humbuckers but it does have some compression, it certainly has bite and will fit in with my other guitars in terms of power. Based on my experience it’s all about upper mids but Eric argues that it does have a prominent bottom end and recent clips I heard of the Rebel Yell were surprisingly deep and warm and that’s supposed to be brighter than the A-Bomb! All of this bodes well but my concerns are also numerous. I want this guitar to be Classic Rock to 80s Metal and my previous experience of the A-Bomb led me to believe it’s entirely 90s Metal and Thrash. I want it to have ‘bite’ and not be too tight but when I tried the A-Bomb it seemed to be the most aggressive thing I’d ever heard and tight beyond belief. I want none of that but much as I keep looking, I can’t think of anything better in the contemporary section except possibly the Rebel Yell, though people usually refer to that as ‘bright’ which seems at odds with what I want.

At the moment the Black Dog seems the safer bet as it seems to have fewer potential issues than the A-Bomb, though I may need some ideas for the neck. The Rebel Yell may be OK too but either way, I thought I’d better run it past the forum first in case my wife wants to order it soon.

[Dave Sloven]

Go for the Rebel Yells with ray gun etch  8)

[ericsabbath]

you gotta figure out first if you're willing to go lower or higher output
and what sort of midrange response you're looking for

the black dog doesn't have a prominent bass, but it has a very fat midrange just like the holy diver
and the thing is not about the amount of mids, but the midrange density
it's a pretty dense tone, unlike the riff raff or the vhII
definitely NOT a vintage tone
it has a bit of a dimarzio flavoured thing, with that crybaby-like vocal lead tones
VERY different from the traditional gibson tones of the mule and riff raff
coming from the diver, I think you'll love it, unless you're really trying to fill up another ballpark

the VHII is the one with a very prominent bass, although it sounds overall drier and very focused

for some reason, I think I'd actually prefer the nailbomb in the PRS SE than in the les paul

[Telerocker]

Just watch a Steve Stevens-vid. Les Paul with Mule-bridge into his new Friedman Signature. Woooohaaa!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfbSyG05fHw

[Slartibartfarst42]

I must confess, that does sound good!

Actually, one of the reasons I think the Black Dog is a safe bet is because it has those similarities with the Holydiver and even the Crawler. Clearly I like mids as I love both of those pickups. I am, however, surprised that you say the VHII has a more prominent bass than the Black Dog because it certainly doesn't look that way from the EQ chart. Ben has also thrown a spanner in the works because I'd asked him a question about pots etc. for the Vintage and in passing he said he'd recently borrowed a friend's Vintage V100 with Crawlers in and he didn't want to give it back. Again, not a classic Gibson tone but one I do love. I need to get this right because I'm not planning any more after this. I have three guitars and that really is all I need so some Bare Knuckle pickups are going to have to miss out. Let's take it as read that the Holydiver/Emerald set are staying put so we're only talking about the other two guitars and here, I find a number of options:

Option 1

Leave the Crawler/Holydiver set in the other PRS and put a Black Dog bridge with something else for the neck in the Vintage. I like the Bruce Dickinson clips of the Black Dog and love the lead tone he has. I'm pretty sure I'd like all three guitars though I think all three will be grouped a bit close together as the Crawler is so hot. At the time of purchase I hadn't anticipated a third guitar but I couldn't bear to be parted from the Crawler now I have one.

Option 2

Leave the PRS as it is again but put a Rebel Yell in the Vintage and something else in the neck. I suspect the A-Bomb is just too hairy and aggressive for this application so my logic is that if the RY is a slightly toned down A-Bomb, it might work well. That video review posted by littleredguitars2 recently was very impressive, as are many other Rebel Yell clips

Option 3

Move the Crawler into the Vintage and put an Abraxas into the PRS instead.

[Dave Sloven]

I get the feeling you don't trust the calibrated sets!

You don't like the Rebel Yell neck?

[Slartibartfarst42]

lol, no, it's not that, though now you mention it, the Cold Sweats are the only calibrated set I've ever owned. In this case I may well go for the set if I go for a Rebel Yell but I've had the Cold Sweat neck before and I currently own a Holydiver neck, both of which have similarities to the Rebel Yell neck and while I like them both, I just find the Emerald to be better. That being the case, I figured I'd be better off either sticking to the Emerald or maybe trying something new. VHII possibly? The problem with the neck pickups is that when I had the Crawler neck it just didn't have the cut I like, even though I like that PAF tone. That's kinda put me off neck pickups with 42AWG wire, especially with AIV magnets. I'm only considering the VHII because so many people say it's superb that I'm curious and of course, it's AV. The Emerald has that cut I like but retains a very PAF flavour to it with the AIV magnet. It really is perfection.

[Slartibartfarst42]

Forget that, I just had another idea  :twisted:

[Kiichi]

Forget that, I just had another idea  :twisted:

Do tell good sir! Dare I hope for another strike of P90 fancy?

[Slartibartfarst42]

Well, to be honest it's reworking an old idea. It all started when I decided that there are certain things that I always seem to like in a pickup, regardless of the genre I'm playing: fat, smooth, fluid, warm, not excessively tight but very articulate etc. It's also true that regardless of the genre I'm playing, I invariably like things hotter than was common at that time and more saturated. Hell, my Blues/Blues Rock tone is a Crawler for Christ's sake! It seems clear to me that I'm trying to force certain pickups into characteristics I like and those pickups just don't have naturally, such as the A-Bomb or Rebel Yell simply because I don't have them. I started asking myself, 'Which pickups are darkish, fat, smooth, fluid and have an element of aggression?' The answers seemed to be A-Pig, Miracle Man, Holydiver and Crawler in the contemporary section. I know I want my 3 guitars divided as broadly Blues, Rock and Metal and out of those ones, the Blues one is obvious; it has to be the Crawler so the Crawler/Holydiver set should stay in the 25th Anniversary CU24. If I had to pick one of those for Classic Rock through to 80s Metal, it would have to be the Holydiver so that would suggest the Holydiver/Emerald set would have to go into the Vintage and in a Les Paul style guitar it should be even fatter, darker and warmer, just as I like it. That leaves either the Miracle Man or Warpig to go into my newest CU24 and as the Warpig is a bit extreme, the Miracle Man is the only logical choice. I've had one before so I know I'll like it and it will happily run from 80s Metal to modern styles. It would then give me an ideal opportunity to try a Miracle Man neck to go with it as I keep reading very positive comments you make about it and it sounds right up my street - fat, smooth, fluid etc.

[Alex]

I think the Miracle Man will be perfect!

[Dave Sloven]

Yeah go the Miracle Man set if you think it suits the guitar and your playing.