Pickup Hand-me-downs. Rebel Yell set in a Godin LG?

[Yellowjacket]

Hi everyone, so I think I've effectively chewed Ben's ear off on this topic so I'm going to pester some other people (all of you) about it. 

Here's the deal.  Since I find the RY neck a bit boomy and the RY bridge a bit thin in my Gibson Les Paul, I'm going to put a Nailbomb in the bridge and probably a Black Dog in the neck.  This should give me a more balanced and interchangeable EQ for my specific needs.

The Godin LG is a solid lump of mahogany with a 24 fret 24 3/4 inch thin profile bolt on neck and a rosewood fingerboard.  It has a SD Alnico II Pro in the neck and a Custom Custom in the bridge, a combination that works well and sounds good in the guitar.

BUT, I will be tragically left with a set of BKPs without a piece of wood.  This cannot be!

So I've been pestering Ben to try and determine if the pickups will take to the guitar or not.  See, it is a wood mounting guitar so I'd have to drill out the pickup holes to mount them in the guitar.  This probably would create resale problems if I did not like them, hence the hesitation. 

So...

As I described things in my email:

Tonight I played both guitars unplugged.  Acoustically, the Les Paul sounds brighter with the maple cap, weight relieved mahogany body.  The Les Paul Standard has open, clear, controlled, and focused lows, a very present and singing midrange / upper mids, as well as singing but also tapered highs.

The Godin LG has a rounder, phatter, and thicker bottom with a more scooped / low mid focused midrange and present but darker and tapered highs.  The bottom and top are more present than the mids giving it a wider and meatier tone than the Les Paul.  The Les Paul has this singing quality while the LG is more muffled. 

So, as I understand it, both the Custom Custom and the Rebel Yell are mid focused pickups but the Rebel Yell really focuses on upper mids, similar to a JB, while the Custom Custom is centre mid focused like a Crawler Bridge PUP.  Is this correct?

Turns out I mixed the samples up and the Custom Custom had the brighter crunch tone and the JB had the darker and more mid focused crunch tone.

JB
http://cdn.seymourduncan.com/sounds/9fb3a435796a54d8cc6dccdfad86a0d2403394f7.mp3

Custom Custom
http://cdn.seymourduncan.com/sounds/e0ec3929a8c432fa708fbadef3d8cfadcdaee265.mp3

I believe these were samples with a Les Paul / JCM800.  Not sure on the mic.

Rebel Yell
https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/pickups.php?cat=humbuckers&sub=contemporary&pickup=rebel_yell

The Rebel Yell has an EQ of
 B/M/T 5 7 7 and the Custom Custom has an EQ of B/M/T 3 7 7 according to SD's website.  Yet, a Rebel Yell is recommended for dark guitars (Which the LG most definitely is) and the Custom Custom is recommended for bright guitars (Which the LG is most definitely not).

Ben confirmed that the EQ of both pickups are similar  (Although the tone is different), regardless of their recommended applications.

I believe the LG had a Custom 5 bridge with a Jazz II stock and the Jazz II sounded thin / scooped while the Custom 5 was muddy with marshalls but worked better with Mesas.  I originally swapped them out for a set of Alnico II pros (Sounded good) and then swapped the bridge for a HFS (A disaster) and then for a Custom Custom which didn't take to the Dual Rectifier well but loves the Mesa Boogie Electra Dyne and most marshalls.

Phew, that's a LOT of text.

On paper, it sounds like the Rebel Yells should take fine.  BUT, I had a bad experience with this guitar.
I put a PRS HFS in the bridge to get the wide, hairy, and massive sound of a Singlecut in that guitar and it did not take.  It sounded far too scooped with a surprisingly low amount of output and a weird spike in the treble that the PRS Singlecut did not have.  Playing both guitars back to back, I think the Singlecut was darker but as I recall, it was solid mahogany with a set neck on it. 
I don't want to end up with a similar experience with the Rebel Yells but the HFS has a ceramic magnet  (Which has a sharper treble and a tighter bottom than an alnico V, right?) and the Rebel Yells are mid boost pickups which seem to work best in that Godin LG.

Ben confirmed that a ceramic magnet yields a more scooped and treble / bass heavy tone which was the problem with the HFS.

It sounds like a Rebel Yell would sound clearer than a Custom Custom with a more open and complex tone and a faster tracking bass.  All of these things are not problems.  It also would most likely not sound thin.  A Jazz II sounded thin in the neck of the Godin LG so I am not worried with how the Rebel Yell neck would work in this guitar.

[Slartibartfarst42]

There's probably a number of Bare Knuckle pickups that will work for you and they'll all sound clearer than the ones you currently use. The Rebel Yells work well in Les Paul style guitars with lots of mahogany so I see no particular issues with them. The idea of them being 'thin' probably comes from the fact that they're quite open sounding and have plenty upper mids but in a darker sounding guitar it should come across as nicely balanced. Whatever happens, they'll be an improvement on what's in there already and as you already have them, you have nothing to lose in trying them.

[miguelbatalha]

What about Crawlers? They've a bit less treble and more bass... Would they work?

[darkbluemurder]

Here's the deal.  Since I find the RY neck a bit boomy and the RY bridge a bit thin in my Gibson Les Paul, I'm going to put a Nailbomb in the bridge and probably a Black Dog in the neck.  This should give me a more balanced and interchangeable EQ for my specific needs.

I have the same set and don't find the neck too boomy and the bridge too thin. To me they sound like the most balanced BKP set I have. Alnico Nailbomb is a good move if you want more oomph in the bridge. For a very short time I used the Black Dog neck together with the A-Bomb in my Single Cut. They sounded good individually but the BD neck was quite a bit brighter than the A-Bomb so this does not seem ideal to the interchangeable EQ requirement.

The Godin LG is a solid lump of mahogany with a 24 fret 24 3/4 inch thin profile bolt on neck and a rosewood fingerboard.  It has a SD Alnico II Pro in the neck and a Custom Custom in the bridge, a combination that works well and sounds good in the guitar.

BUT, I will be tragically left with a set of BKPs without a piece of wood.  This cannot be!

So I've been pestering Ben to try and determine if the pickups will take to the guitar or not.  See, it is a wood mounting guitar so I'd have to drill out the pickup holes to mount them in the guitar.  This probably would create resale problems if I did not like them, hence the hesitation. 

It sounds like a Rebel Yell would sound clearer than a Custom Custom with a more open and complex tone and a faster tracking bass.  All of these things are not problems.  It also would most likely not sound thin.  A Jazz II sounded thin in the neck of the Godin LG so I am not worried with how the Rebel Yell neck would work in this guitar.

First of all, you can try the pickups in the guitar without enlarging the mounting holes - provided the screws hold in the wood. You may need different screws for this purpose. It will be difficult to adjust the pickup height with this set up but you will be able to detect whether the change will go in the right direction.

Cheers Stephan

[darkbluemurder]

What about Crawlers? They've a bit less treble and more bass... Would they work?

Not recommended for a dark sounding guitar.

Cheers Stephan

[miguelbatalha]

Thanks for explaining.

[Yellowjacket]

Here's the deal.  Since I find the RY neck a bit boomy and the RY bridge a bit thin in my Gibson Les Paul, I'm going to put a Nailbomb in the bridge and probably a Black Dog in the neck.  This should give me a more balanced and interchangeable EQ for my specific needs.

I have the same set and don't find the neck too boomy and the bridge too thin. To me they sound like the most balanced BKP set I have. Alnico Nailbomb is a good move if you want more oomph in the bridge. For a very short time I used the Black Dog neck together with the A-Bomb in my Single Cut. They sounded good individually but the BD neck was quite a bit brighter than the A-Bomb so this does not seem ideal to the interchangeable EQ requirement.

The Godin LG is a solid lump of mahogany with a 24 fret 24 3/4 inch thin profile bolt on neck and a rosewood fingerboard.  It has a SD Alnico II Pro in the neck and a Custom Custom in the bridge, a combination that works well and sounds good in the guitar.

BUT, I will be tragically left with a set of BKPs without a piece of wood.  This cannot be!

So I've been pestering Ben to try and determine if the pickups will take to the guitar or not.  See, it is a wood mounting guitar so I'd have to drill out the pickup holes to mount them in the guitar.  This probably would create resale problems if I did not like them, hence the hesitation. 

It sounds like a Rebel Yell would sound clearer than a Custom Custom with a more open and complex tone and a faster tracking bass.  All of these things are not problems.  It also would most likely not sound thin.  A Jazz II sounded thin in the neck of the Godin LG so I am not worried with how the Rebel Yell neck would work in this guitar.

First of all, you can try the pickups in the guitar without enlarging the mounting holes - provided the screws hold in the wood. You may need different screws for this purpose. It will be difficult to adjust the pickup height with this set up but you will be able to detect whether the change will go in the right direction.

Cheers Stephan

The pickups are awesome, I think it is more of a guitar / amp problem.  Mesa amps tend to really amplify low and sub low frequencies so it just greatly inflates what is most likely a really minor issue, something that would not be detected through any other amp.   The real issue is not having quite enough thickness and output from the bridge pickup.  I have my bridge pickup cranked right up and the neck cranked way down, particularly on the 'bass' side.  I think it's going to even out nicely though with the Nailbomb.

Awesome suggestion on how to test drive the 'knuckles.  I may have to try this anyhow.

There's probably a number of Bare Knuckle pickups that will work for you and they'll all sound clearer than the ones you currently use. The Rebel Yells work well in Les Paul style guitars with lots of mahogany so I see no particular issues with them. The idea of them being 'thin' probably comes from the fact that they're quite open sounding and have plenty upper mids but in a darker sounding guitar it should come across as nicely balanced. Whatever happens, they'll be an improvement on what's in there already and as you already have them, you have nothing to lose in trying them.

Well, it depends what one means by 'improvement'.  Clarity is best for high gain situations in my experience, and from what I've seen, most BKP players are high gain players.  The thickness inherent in Seymour Duncans makes them excel at different tones.  The issue is that I don't want to lose the tones I have, but I want other ones.  I'm thinking I need a new piece of wood here since that will truly solve the problem. 

I'm thinking 25.5 scale bolt on neck for heavier tones.  Just wondering about maple neck / rosewood fingerboard / basswood body / Juggernauts; or if I should go for 25.5 scale bolt on with mahogany neck, rosewood fingerboard, mahogany body, Rebel Yells. 

The second option would be less $$$s but the first would give another very unique tone to my arsenal.  I'm sure both would work though. 

[Yellowjacket]

HA, I was loving the Rebel Yell bridge pickup today.  =-/  It's going to be interesting to see how the Nailbomb stacks up to this since the Rebel Yell just screams rock 'n roll!!

Another idea for a guitar project is a maple neck, rosewood fingerboard, alder body with a front rout / pickguard / hardtail bridge.  Basically a fender strat H S S or, more preferably H S H or H H.

I'm trying to think what to do but I can tell that the real issue for me right now is that I want a different sound in addition to what I have right now.  This is the real issue. 

So, I may try the Rebel Yell bridge in the Godin LG.  We'll see what I think of the Nailbomb when it arrives.  It might give that extra edge but I was really liking my current setup.  Perhaps my mistake was taking a couple of weeks off practicing and then starting to think about gear BEFORE playtesting everything again.  oops =-/    On the other hand, a bit more output and phatness never hurt anyone. 

So we'll see.  I'm going to need a good reason for another six string, luckily finishing a university degree might just count  (Provided I can get it done on time!). 

[Yellowjacket]

So, I tried the Rebel Yell bridge in the Godin LG.

It was AMAAAZING.  It sounds as big as a house!  It really perfectly matches the overwhelming lows and the very high highs by filling everything else in.  It sounds open and really really huge.  The Gibson Les Paul sounds small by comparison.  It's very focused and mid rangey.  Not sure what I'm going to do with it at this point. 

But if you can, find a Godin LG and put some Rebel Yells in it.  You won't be disappointed.