Wah Issue?

[Slartibartfarst42]

I'm still absolutely loving my Orange TH30 but I have noticed the odd minor issue with some of my effects. Sometimes when I use some effects the volume on the amp just dies. You can hear it ok but a lot quieter than it normally is. Last time it happened I disconnected all of my leads, connected it all back up again and I was back to full volume. I've just been playing now and the amp was as loud as ever and then as soon as I stepped on the Wah pedal the volume dropped noticeably and the whole thing is now playing a lot quieter than it was before. My signal chain looks like this:

Guitar
Splitter
Boss NS2
Korg Pitchblack
Mark Tremonti Wah
Carl Martin Quattro for Compressor and Overdrive
Amp
Boss NS2
Boss GE7 (for EQ settings)
Boss GE7 (for a solo boost)
Carl Martin Quattro for Chorus and Delay
Amp

Has anyone encountered this issue before or is it something to do with the sequence or could it be simply that the TH30 doesn't like a Mark Tremonti Wah?

[richard]

Have you tried it with nothing but the Wah ? You may have to try a thorough process of elimination. Connect each pedal by itself and if that shows nothing start with one effect and add the others one at a time.

[Telerocker]

Check in- and outputjacks of the wah, check the battery. If not, there migth be an internal malfunction. It doesn't have anything to do with the amp. I've played several wah's thru the RV50 with no problems. If it's not in the wah, then maybe some flaw in the effects-chain.

[Dave Sloven]

Are you using batteries?

If not, are you daisy-chaining effects pedals?  Perhaps the wah combined with other effects creates too much of a current draw?

That's the only thing I can think of that might cause this issue besides the input/output jacks on the wah or some circuitry issue inside of the wah.

If the current draw is too great for the source of current (e.g., flat battery or too many pedals on one power supply) then you will get an effect very similar to this.  I had this problem when I was using batteries in my ISP Decimator G-String.

[Slartibartfarst42]

The effects on the Carl Martin Quattro all run directly from the mains. The other 6 pedals are all powered from a SoundLab Pedal Power 450, which conveniently has 6 connections for pedals. I would have assumed that this would mean that power isn't an issue but it does sound awfully like your description. Cabling may well be an option I suppose as this has happened before both when using the Wah and when just playing through the rig but it's by no means consistent. The reason I wondered if it was to do with the amp is that all of my pedals are constantly connected on a board so never really move and this issue only started once I started using the Orange TH30. It just seemed like a bit of a coincidence.

[Dave Sloven]

If you know the (milli)amps available from the port  on your supply (this might depend on whether they are isolated or not) you can then work out whether your combined amp draw is below or above that amount.  Most times the manual or specs for each pedal will state the current draw in mA.  If you can't find the manual around the house you should be able to find a PDF of it online.  Simply add the current draw of each pedal together to get the total.

SoundLab Pedal Power 450 from what I can tell does not have isolated outputs.  I also read somewhere that it is 450mA, but if that's not six isolated outputs that would be 450mA across all of those outputs, which is less than a 1 Spot.  Also I noticed  when searching for the unit that it is no longer available and there were a lot of complaints about it being noisy.

You might want to consider upgrading your power supply.  I have two T-Rex Fuel Tanks. One is a Chameleon and the other is a Junior.  If you are the kind of guy who runs a lot of pedals - or a lot of weird pedals - then the Chameleon is excellent, but sounds to me that if you have been getting by with this other unit that the Junior might be all you need.  I am running three 18V pedals off of two 9V isolated ports coupled with a current doubler, and then I have another three isolated 9V outputs.  Each port gives 120mA (EACH).  On the Chameleon each port gives 300mA, but this reduces to 225mA at 12V and 150mA at 18V if you switch them over to those voltages.  The Chameleon can do 9VDC, 12VDC, 18VDC, and 12VAC.  Both can be run on either 115V or 230V mains and they have standard detachable leads so you can easily take them on tour to other countries

http://www.t-rex-effects.com/fueltank-junior/

http://www.t-rex-effects.com/fueltank-chameleon

[Slartibartfarst42]

You clearly know a lot more about this than me!!! Actually, the power supply does make sense because when I bought the TH30, I also bought a second GE7 and that was the 6th pedal to be run from my power supply. I guess that operating the Wah just pushes it over the edge. So it seems I need a new power supply but that gives me two issues. Firstly, I know absolutely nothing at all about it and secondly, I am desperately short of funds right now. Trying to find a cheap alternative I've come up with these possibilities so are any of these a good idea or should any of them be avoided. This will become more of an issue as I'm selling the Carl Martin Quattro and that will be replaced by individual stompboxes for Overdrive, Delay and Reverb so in total I'll need to power 9 effects pedals of one sort or another. These are the options I've come up with:

http://www.effectpowersupplies.com/1spot-9v-combo-pack-power-supply-with-adapters-4609-p.asp

http://www.effectpowersupplies.com/mooer-micro-power-multi-power-supply-4244-p.asp

http://www.effectpowersupplies.com/gigrig-distributor-122-p.asp

[Telerocker]

If you want hum, go with the One Spot. I suggest to invest in a proper, silent unit like the range of Voodoo Lab.

[Slartibartfarst42]

well, I don't want hum so I take it the One Spot is out but I equally can't afford to spend £100+ on something that will only power half of my pedals. I didn't select those options because they're the best but because they're in the price range I can afford and power the number of pedals I have. There has to be something between the two extremes.

[Telerocker]

At least check it has isolated outputs.

[Dave Sloven]

On ebay.co.uk I see at least two T-Rex Fuel Tank Juniors for under 80 pounds including postage from the USA.  I don't know if you would get hit with an import charge on that (we don't in Australia).

The first UK based one says  £110.00 with free UK delivery but stock is listed as only the one left.

"The new power house from T-Rex, the Fueltank Junior is now in stock. Fueltank Junior has 5 isolated 9 volt outputs, each delivering 120 mA. Fuel Tank Junior comes with 10 standard pedal cables and a link cable that lets you power 5 separate units (max. 24 mA) off a single output. A special serial cable ' also included ' lets you combine 2 outputs into 1, so you can even power your classic 18-Volt pedal alongside your 9-Volt units."

That gives you a total of 600mA to power your pedals (divided between five isolated outputs.  Is that enough?  Some, including the One Spot I think, offer 1000mA of non-isolated power.

I also see the Chameleon for under £110 including postage from the USA.

If you get a unit from the USA it will come with the US type cord.  You can easily change it for a local cord.  I wanted a longer one anyway.  I guess that would cost around £5 extra for the long version, maybe £3 for one the same length as what is supplied with the power supply.  You just flick the switch over to 230V

These are the only power supplies I have used, so I can't recommend any others.  I have heard some that were very noisy, but these are as quiet as a really quiet mouse.

There is also size to consider I guess.  The Junior is compact in comparison to the Chameleon.  For me it doesn't matter much as both fit under my Pedaltrain boards and do not take up room on top of the pedalboard.

[BigB]

I equally can't afford to spend £100+ on something that will only power half of my pedals. I didn't select those options because they're the best but because they're in the price range I can afford and power the number of pedals I have.

You don't need a power supply with 8 outputs to power 8 pedals, you can have more than one pedal per output. The keys here are (assuming an isolated outputs PSU):

1. the total current draw on one single output must not exceed the output's rating
2. you don't want to daisy chain together one pedal plugged on your amp's fron with one in the fx loop
3. a few pedals actually induce noise in the power supply (mostly trems - clock noie - and digital pedal AFAICT), you want to keep those on separated outputs.

FWIW gain pedals usually have a very low current draw (in the 5 to 10 Ma) and so if you have a couple gain pedals you can already plan on daisy chaining them on a single outlet - these pedals usually don't cause much (if any) pollution to the power supply current.

You'll find quite a few useful articles on power supply as well as a listing of a lot of pedals current draw here :    http://stinkfoot.se/

[Slartibartfarst42]

OK, I'd be grateful if you could bear with me on this as I really have NO idea what I'm talking about but I've tried doing some research and I'm hoping somebody here can help me to make sense of the numbers I've come up with.

Existing power supply

SoundLab Pedal Power 450 that has 6 x 9V DC outputs @ 75 mA. There seems to be lots of complaints about noise from this unit but it's been fine with me.

Existing pedals being powered

One output powers one pedal, largely because I had no idea I could do it any other way!

EHX Switchblade Nano = ??? It's supposed to be passive but mine has an LED fitted so it does need a power supply but I've no idea what it's drawing.

Boss NS2 = 20mA

Korg Pitchblack = 35mA

Mark Tremonti Wah = 12mA

Boss GE7 = 7mA

Boss GE7 = 7mA

I don't immediately see why this is causing a problem for my power source but perhaps I'm missing something. Would anything here suggest my power source isn't up to the job?

[Alex]

I think you need to find out first where the problem is coming from exactly. It could be the wah and not the amp. I had a Dunlop Wah where I had to replace the switch once.

About the power supply:
http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_powerplant_junior.htm

[Slartibartfarst42]

That's a LOT of power supply for the money! It looks like the Fuel Tank Jr but for a fraction of the price and the reviews are excellent.

If my understanding of the electronics is right, I can see no reason why my existing power supply can't power these pedals and I've played through my rig tonight, including the Wah, and there was no drop in volume at all. Perhaps it is just a dud cable after all.