Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: hunter on July 26, 2011, 09:46:19 AM
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Impressive!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPIXVyeR-Zg
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bloomin hell that is strong
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Can't see the video, but I'm assuming it's not an SG.....
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Stereotype: "Mahogany" (generic term which does not mean anything) necks are not strong...
Well here you have a Perfectly quatersawn Sapelli Mahogany one piece finished neck.
i agree mahogany is a generic term, and sapele is a good alternative mahogany. but i dont think the myth is busted in the slightest
Take a gibson neck and do the same, even a gibson style neck made from sapele and you will find why people refer to mahogany necks as weak. you just have to remember that most of the mahogany necks people will talk about are gibson style!
also, as much as wood does vary, my experiences of sapele and honduras or south american mahoganies (admittedly less than patrick's) have always led me to think of sapele very differently to the more traditional mahogany species used in guitar manufacture. i have found it to be stiffer for one thing ;)
in other words = un fair test
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in other words = un fair test
I agree. He didn't jump high enough to give much extra force beyond his weight. Another thing is he only put his weight in the center of it once. The other times he had both feet much closer to the bricks. I'd like to see him continuously stacking or hanging weights from the exact center until it broke. I don't know how much that would be considering string tension is greater than most men weigh and his legs don't look like they belong to a heavy man.
He still makes some absolutely stunning high quality guitars and I'd love to have one or one like them.
String tension calculator:
http://www.mcdonaldstrings.com/stringxxiii.html
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I knew it wasn't going to break, but it still made me wince to watch it!
Doesn't the fact it's quartersawn make a difference? Presumably quartersawn timber is very stiff in the direction he's standing on it, whereas flatsawn would flex more (and be more likely to break).
Having said that, I believe mahogany necks generally are quartersawn, but most maple necks are flatsawn?
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quartersawn does make a differerence, this neck would have snapped at the headstock transition if it was flat sawn
the reason is that the mahoganies traditionally used in guitar construction are less stiff than the maple and its worth thinking about grain direction carefully. i would still say sapele is less stiff than maple too - you could do the same test with any maple neck
quartersawn maple necks are good, a little stiffer but not a major difference. flatsawn is just more commonly used as it was easily available in the sizes leo needed and there are a lot of fender necks in the world that are somewhere in between and dont suffer for it.
patrick does have a nice stock of perfectly quartersawn sapele which he uses regularly for bodies and necks. iirc he was showing off the stack a few months ago at PG
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My backwards rationalisation of how to make a good guitar is totally confused.
Any idea how sapele compares to mahogany tonally?
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i dare you to email him and ask him ;)
i know what the huff would say from his posts on the subject over at PG - he would tell you its a silly question because:
1) all wood varies from piece to piece
2) mahogany is a generic term that means little more than brown wood
3) 'mahogany' can be bright and snappy as well as dark and warm - so your usual assumptions about mahogany tone do not apply
i largely agree with the first 2 points, they are the same for any wood generalisations - but i still distinguish between mahogany and sapele because i find it a useful distinction.
guitars were traditionally built with south american mahoganies, this is woods from the Swietenia genus of the Meliaceae (mahogany) family. of course they vary between pieces, but these are the mahoganies people tend to refer to as warm sounding and tehse are the ones that created the classic tones we lust after.. they are also almost all CITIES protected. IF you want a traditional gibson tone the easiest way to get it is with these woods. ... but, mahogany used by modern factories is not the same, can come from all over the world and can vary a hell of a lot - so it is more of a generic term
Sapele is still part the Meliaceae family so is a type of mahogany, and will have some crossover with those other mahoganies we are used to. But in general terms its stiffer and has a more interlocked grain. this can make is slightly harder to work than the Swietenia's as tear out is more of a potential problem. tonally i would argue that its a little brighter than most would expect of a mahogany due to its extra stiffness. it does look different too.
So i know patrick doesnt like tonal generalisations about wood at all, but i still think they are a useful starting point for a builder. if a customer asked me for a mahogany like tone with a bit more bite i may start considering sapele over honduras, but it still comes down to individual pieces of wood.
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decided to give it a go - with a really cheap squier neck ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7t2TsEI6dE
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decided to give it a go - with a really cheap squier neck ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7t2TsEI6dE
Please don't use that technique for relicing my Strat neck! :o :P
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too late :P
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AAAAARRRRGGGGHHHHHH!!! :x
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he he, you know i am not starting on the actual relicing till the lacquer has had more time to cure ;)
and no, i would never stand on a guitar neck i intended to use for anything.
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I knew you were kidding, of course..... but it was such a horrible thought! :wink:
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Do it Wez, do it!! :lol:
It's how SRV and Rory got some of their relicing done. I watched Rory do some "awful" things to his strat live. I saw SRV do it at Reading as well, though I was far enough away that I didn't realise what he was doing until I saw DVDs of various performances years later.
And of course, you could get some platform boots and black satin trousers, and a WIG!! (I've recently learnt :o), and practice strumming a few chords with your feet ala Ritchie Blackmore...
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And of course, you could get some platform boots and black satin trousers, and a WIG!! (I've recently learnt :o), and practice strumming a few chords with your feet ala Ritchie Blackmore...
Only recently? Take a look at pictures of RB circa 1975 - he had a weird frizzy combover thing going on. Then a couple of years later.... full head of hair! And it's got more luxuriant as the years have gone by. :lol:
I even think that moustache he sports nowadays looks a bit glued-on....
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I even think that moustache he sports nowadays looks a bit glued-on....
:lol:
I only found out a year or two ago from Gerry McAvoy's autobiography (Rory bassist). They supported Deep Purple in the USA. Not sure when, probably circa 1973/4. There was shenninigins at a Hotel pool-side involving the road-crew putting people in the pool. Gerry and keyboard-player Lou had just bought new cowboy boots and so were not keen (one of them managed to take theirs off before going in). But Mr McAvoy witnessed Mr Blackmore's missus saying "don't worry Ritchie they wouldn't throw you in".
Unfortunately, they did. And when he came out he had short hair and was carrying a bedraggled wig, much to Mr McAvoy's surprise.
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Blimey, if that was a wig as early as 1973/74 he should've asked for his money back! :?
Then again, maybe he was wearing them all along.... in the late '60s photos his hair looks really thick and a bit wiggy (as does Paicey's...), so perhaps the mid-'70s frizzy period was a last-ditch attempt to do something with his own hair?
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I was like "OH MY GOD, STOP, PLEASE! OH $%&#... NOOOOOOOO!" during the whole video :cry: