Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Pickups => Topic started by: Lucas on January 22, 2018, 10:38:48 PM
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Bare Knuckles Boot Camp...
Has anyone noticed recent Facebook posts regarding NAMM 2018 and BKP preparing something called boot camp? Apparently it`s new pickup line... Any more info? They have new boxes design for sure as they were shown on last photo uploaded on Facebook, but new pickup line????
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Yeah! I was curious about this too.
I thought this was a marketing campaign where "boot camp" is training for people to get familiar with the variety of BKP products. Aka teaches you which pick ups fit for what genre of music.
But it looks to be a new line of pick ups?
https://www.facebook.com/bareknucklepickups/photos/a.252944701520782.1073741831.141809295967657/1008881785927066/?type=3&theater
Also from Tim:
"I’ve long wanted to design a stripped back, no-nonsense pickup range aimed at guitar players of all levels who just want to cut to the chase and have great tone.
3 output ranges - 4 types of pickup. It’s as easy as that, with all the core options taken care of. Handwound at the Bare Knuckle workshops and warrantied for life. No more excuses. Get your tone in shape. Welcome to the world of Bare Knuckle Boot Camp." Tim Mills, BKP Founder/MD.
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And a demo video is up. (hope this type of link works)
https://www.facebook.com/bareknucklepickups/videos/1009705165844728/?sk=h_chr (https://www.facebook.com/bareknucklepickups/videos/1009705165844728/?sk=h_chr)
I need more info on this! So I gather they are HB, p90, tele, and strat in 3 different output levels. Which ones in the current range are they most comparable to? How do they differ?
The idea can work to cut down on confusion for those new to this world or those who just don´t bother with it as much as we nerds, but heck. That is 12 new pickups if I am not mistaken! That´s mental!
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looks like they are some sort of the 'entry' level pickups. If that`s the case I have mixed feelings, first of all good, because more people who cannot afford standard BKPs can enjoy them but then BKP are not 'boutique' pickups anymore. Just quick thought,
I`m really curious that`s the difference (apart from price, open humbuckers will be £90... know it from Facebook) and what 'standard' models they`ll be referring to
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How do you make a pickup cheaper? I'm guessing they'll be machine wound?
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How do you make a pickup cheaper? I'm guessing they'll be machine wound?
They say on Facebook that those ones will be hand wound and quality checked same as 'standard ones'. If that's the entry level, just wondering how they compare to 'standard' pickups. And yes, they will be cheaper, £90 for open coil humbucker
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Well, they'll cost what all the others costed until a couple years ago, so I don't think it has anything to do with material quality or building technique
It's just a slightly more accessible limited series
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Yeah, probably a trick to get more people into BKP world.
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I've also read on Facebook replies from BKP that this line won't be available through their website, only retailers.
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Yeah, this is definitely just a plan to promote the brand.
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Official videos are on the website already. All of them.
What do you think? Humbuckers didn`t appeal to me that much but liked Strat medium output though
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Ah! I think I understand the concept now.
4 styles of pickups meaning Humbuckers, P90s, Strat Single Coils and Tele Single Coils.
3 variety of output consisting of
Old Guard sounds to be PAF - me thinks like Mules, Riff Raff
True Grit would probably be like a PAF+ or something slightly hotter like Emeralds/Abraxas
and Brute Force would probably be more modern and heavy - Warpig/NB/Aftermaths
I'd be interested in the True Grit HBs and P90s
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Can wait for someone to compare them to 'standard' models though. I`m not convinced that much but that Boot camp line to be honest (yet)...
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It doesn't help that Rabea Massad is doing the sound demos.
No offense to the guy, he's a brilliant player (and a super great guy btw!) but I find it hard (to nearly impossible) to judge tone from any of his demos about gear.
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So what i haven't worked out yet is what these pickups offer that the core range doesn't.
Are they cheaper versions of existing models? Or are they new additions to the range, in which case why the limited options?
I get the idea that they're meant to be simple orders, just choose how hot you want your pickup and buy, but do they offer something I can't get in the core range? And if they do, what if (being hypothetical) I decided I wanted aTrue Grit over an Emerald or an Abraxas, but I wanted a battleworn black cover, would that be viable?
I guess I understand the desire to have an easy access/easy order set of pickuos, but splitting the range has confused me a bit.
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My understanding is that these are aimed at guys that don't want to go into the details (Alnico grades, ceramics, resistance, potted, etc.) of pickups.
They just choose the output range for their music style - and get their BKP pickups and can see what those are about.
So for the less "nerdy" generation of players if you will :wink:
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Okay, that makes sense I guess. But then why not make them a part of the core range as well? They seem to be new pickup designs, after all. Maybe Tim will explain it at some point, or people will try to order and it'll become clear.
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Maybe the bootcamp series were design to make things simpler for the general population to get into BKPs........
But I think it'll act more like a gateway drug and they'll want the real deal and try them all.
Maybe that was the plan all along. Touche Tim. Touche.
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They'll only be available through dealers, so custom options could be limited. I think they are completely new designs.
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I think we can use an analogy to fast food here. Are they supposed to be fast food things for those who want to try BKPs?
I`m bit confused to be honest. Still waiting for more info and most importantly difference in comparison to 'standard' models and I`m not talking about limited options such as covers ect.
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Just to confirm, these are completely new designs - they are not in any way related to models in the rest of the range. I've just put a set of True Grit humbuckers in a guitar and have to say they are fantastic. I'm sure the BKP team will be putting a lot more info out there in the near future.
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Just to confirm, these are completely new designs - they are not in any way related to models in the rest of the range. I've just put a set of True Grit humbuckers in a guitar and have to say they are fantastic. I'm sure the BKP team will be putting a lot more info out there in the near future.
how they compare to rest of the models? What`s the main difference? And what`s more what`s the whole idea behind them?
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http://www.peachguitars.com/guitars/guitar-pickups/?brand_0=bare-knuckle-pickups
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how they compare to rest of the models? What`s the main difference? And what`s more what`s the whole idea behind them?
I don't really feel comfortable saying too much since I've literally only tried the TG humbucker set and not any of the 11 other sets, and I also think it's important BKP get to present the range on their own terms. I don't think I'd be overstepping to say that it's fairly evident the OG, TG and BF roughly map on to the vintage, vintage-hot and contemporary output range classification.
In my PRS CU24 the TG humbuckers have a wonderful fat mid, creamy top and surprisingly tight lows, and exhibit a very rich harmonic character that shines through chords and single notes beautifully. Suffice to say, they're staying in there!
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What about specs? Magnet, DC, frequency chart and possibly wire type?
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What about specs? Magnet, DC, frequency chart and possibly wire type?
Your guess is as good as mine! According to the BKP website the OGs are AII, TGs are AV and BF are ceramic in the humbuckers and P90s, AV in the strat and tele coils.
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I'm suprised they haven't rolled out any specs yet...
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Bizarre that these are not available on the website to buy. Dealers could bump the prices up a tad.
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What about specs? Magnet, DC, frequency chart and possibly wire type?
Your guess is as good as mine! According to the BKP website the OGs are AII, TGs are AV and BF are ceramic in the humbuckers and P90s, AV in the strat and tele coils.
Nice!
That was my guess about magnets, but still curious about more details
I loved the tones in all the videos specially the old guard humbucker and the true grit p-90, but didn't hear the audio clips yet
Thanks, Nolly (The Great)
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I think this marketing strategy makes a lot of sense from a business standpoint. I believe that Bare Knuckle will be able to competively price these pickups by removing the custom options in lieu of compromising quality. Custom orders will always encumber the production process and time is money. These pickups will be ready to wind and ship, wind and ship, wind and ship.
When you think how dramatic an effect these pickups would have on a good, entry level guitar, it is a great idea.
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i wish there was more info on where to actually buy these. especially in the US. i'd give the true grit and brute force humbuckers a shot.
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Axe Palace should have them soon.
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I don't think I'm the right target for the boot camp line. I'm way too guitar nerdy for this.
Plus they're only like 10 lbs less than the regular BKPs.
I'm certainly going to customize my pickup and get it exactly how I want it for few bucks more.
It's a firm pass for me.
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They are 90GBP I think. That's 29 less than a regular pickup...
I think the target audience for these pickups is people that don't know much about pickups, they need a pair, google it and discover BKP.
Pretty sure they aren't gonna sell as many as their core line will, even though they are cheaper.
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I don't think I'm the right target for the boot camp line. I'm way too guitar nerdy for this.
Plus they're only like 10 lbs less than the regular BKPs.
I'm certainly going to customize my pickup and get it exactly how I want it for few bucks more.
It's a firm pass for me.
The beauty of it is the main line is still there for people that want to go really specific and enjoy that process. The Boot Camp pickups offer a much easier selection system for those that don't want to have to obsess over and potentially regret their choice of more specialised pickup.
To stress again, the Boot Camp range are still full-fat BKPs, and are voiced in such a way to work in almost any guitar without problem. I am very enamoured with my TG humbuckers and will probably make them my default pickup choice moving forwards.
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I don't think I'm the right target for the boot camp line. I'm way too guitar nerdy for this.
Plus they're only like 10 lbs less than the regular BKPs.
I'm certainly going to customize my pickup and get it exactly how I want it for few bucks more.
It's a firm pass for me.
The beauty of it is the main line is still there for people that want to go really specific and enjoy that process. The Boot Camp pickups offer a much easier selection system for those that don't want to have to obsess over and potentially regret their choice of more specialised pickup.
To stress again, the Boot Camp range are still full-fat BKPs, and are voiced in such a way to work in almost any guitar without problem. I am very enamoured with my TG humbuckers and will probably make them my default pickup choice moving forwards.
Even after having experience with juggernauts?! I tried those and i was like "holy shite i need these!" Then like an idiot i bought a titan cause its cheaper and now i think im gonna return it for a juggernaut. Now im even more intrigued by the boot camp stuff.
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Even after having experience with juggernauts?! I tried those and i was like "holy shitee i need these!" Then like an idiot i bought a titan cause its cheaper and now i think im gonna return it for a juggernaut. Now im even more intrigued by the boot camp stuff.
Yeah, I played Juggernauts more or less exclusively for a few years and they're definitely one of my favourite sets in the range. They have a wide frequency response with fat low mids and low end - for me they work awesomely in superstrats and bright guitars. As you'd expect when dropping to a lower output pickup, the TGs have a much leaner low end response that makes mutes sound really tight, but also have a very musical midrange and smooth top (not twangy at all). I haven't tried the BFs yet but I know that their voicing is designed to tight with focussed mids, with a lot of drive behind them.
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Even after having experience with juggernauts?! I tried those and i was like "holy shiteeee i need these!" Then like an idiot i bought a titan cause its cheaper and now i think im gonna return it for a juggernaut. Now im even more intrigued by the boot camp stuff.
Yeah, I played Juggernauts more or less exclusively for a few years and they're definitely one of my favourite sets in the range. They have a wide frequency response with fat low mids and low end - for me they work awesomely in superstrats and bright guitars. As you'd expect when dropping to a lower output pickup, the TGs have a much leaner low end response that makes mutes sound really tight, but also have a very musical midrange and smooth top (not twangy at all). I haven't tried the BFs yet but I know that their voicing is designed to tight with focussed mids, with a lot of drive behind them.
Tighter than juggs? Output vs juggs? Loved your work in periphery btw, i was sad to see u go. Good luck with all your present and future endeavors, though i dont think you'll need it!
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Pretty sure juggs are actually tighter.
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Tighter than juggs? Output vs juggs? Loved your work in periphery btw, i was sad to see u go. Good luck with all your present and future endeavors, though i dont think you'll need it!
Pretty sure juggs are actually tighter.
Depends what you mean by tight. The TGs are extremely tight, since they generate less low end and therefore feel very controlled. The Juggernaut on the other side has plenty of bass, but feels tight in the sense that the attack is percussive and the low frequencies "track" very fast, but if you play them into an amp that saturates the low frequencies a lot, they'll sound flubbier than a low output pickup that naturally feeds the amp a leaner signal.
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Especially in 7 and 8 strings, people run boosts to shovel off all those low and low mid frequencies. My ReVv Generator 120 handles lows particularly well, especially on channel 3. It is surprising how tight and aggressive Juggs sound in this amp!
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I always run a boost with everything high gain related. While some amps can get pretty tight and aggressive, in my experience, a booster just makes it sound "right" for metal.
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I can't believe there is no info that we need on the pups!!!!!
What is the EQ of each one?????
What magnet is in each of them????
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OG and TG are alnico while BF are ceramic. Pretty much all we know ;). Someone will measure DCR on them eventually...
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I must admit I'm quite interested in these.
I'm probably gonna try out a bridge Old Guard P90 in my Feline DC, and a nickel covered set of Old Guard humbuckers in one of my Les Pauls (the Stormies in there will probs go to my Explorer).
I'm not too worried I don't have some of the info I can get on the standard range... what I do know is Old Guard is "vintage" with AII magnets... and they're full-fat BKPs... that's actually all the info I personally need for choosing p90s and humbuckers at the moment. I would prefer it if the humbuckers had a 2-conductor option, but that's OK, I understand why they haven't, and I can cope with the 4-conductor.
I probably won't be trying the strat sets and tele sets because I prefer vintage stagger on strats ... and I've got more BKP tele sets than teles I like at the moment!
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I must admit I'm quite interested in these.
I'm probably gonna try out a bridge Old Guard P90 in my Feline DC, and a nickel covered set of Old Guard humbuckers in one of my Les Pauls (the Stormies in there will probs go to my Explorer).
I'm not too worried I don't have some of the info I can get on the standard range... what I do know is Old Guard is "vintage" with AII magnets... and they're full-fat BKPs... that's actually all the info I personally need for choosing p90s and humbuckers at the moment. I would prefer it if the humbuckers had a 2-conductor option, but that's OK, I understand why they haven't, and I can cope with the 4-conductor.
I probably won't be trying the strat sets and tele sets because I prefer vintage stagger on strats ... and I've got more BKP tele sets than teles I like at the moment!
And that's exactly the kind of simplified choice that the Boot Camp range is designed to facilitate! You'll love them, I'm sure!
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I can't believe there is no info that we need on the pups!!!!!
What is the EQ of each one?????
What magnet is in each of them????
Perhaps not as much detail as you might want but as far as the humbuckers go:
OG - great classic tone, the openness and softness you expect from lower-wind pickups with AII mags, with a bit more midrange emphasis than you'd get from the Stormies. (To be clear, this is not first-hand experience, it is extrapolation from what I've heard about and would expect from the spec)
TG - Lovely overwound voicing that retains tightness in the lows, vocal midrange, and smooth top end. More clarity and bounce than you get with a high output pickup, but no unpleasant twanginess when gained up either (like some vintage pickups).
BF - Hot pickups with surprising clarity and liquidy feel (most people do not expect to be told they are ceramic after trying them). Solid mids and, again, tight low end. (Once more, this is second-hand information).
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I posted this in another thread, but thought it would make sense to post it here as well.
I measured the True Grits and got this:
Bridge: 13.0 kΩ
Neck: 9.2 kΩ
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OG - great classic tone, the openness and softness you expect from lower-wind pickups with AII mags, with a bit more midrange emphasis than you'd get from the Stormies. (To be clear, this is not first-hand experience, it is extrapolation from what I've heard about and would expect from the spec)
I now have first hand experience of these, and I would whole-heartedly concur sir! :smiley:
More waffle from me about them:
https://forum.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/index.php?topic=35201.0
Stunningly good pickups for what I want.
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I don't think I'm the right target for the boot camp line. I'm way too guitar nerdy for this.
Plus they're only like 10 lbs less than the regular BKPs.
I'm certainly going to customize my pickup and get it exactly how I want it for few bucks more.
It's a firm pass for me.
I'm the same. Full guitar nerd
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I can't believe there is no info that we need on the pups!!!!!
What is the EQ of each one?????
What magnet is in each of them????
Perhaps not as much detail as you might want but as far as the humbuckers go:
OG - great classic tone, the openness and softness you expect from lower-wind pickups with AII mags, with a bit more midrange emphasis than you'd get from the Stormies. (To be clear, this is not first-hand experience, it is extrapolation from what I've heard about and would expect from the spec)
TG - Lovely overwound voicing that retains tightness in the lows, vocal midrange, and smooth top end. More clarity and bounce than you get with a high output pickup, but no unpleasant twanginess when gained up either (like some vintage pickups).
BF - Hot pickups with surprising clarity and liquidy feel (most people do not expect to be told they are ceramic after trying them). Solid mids and, again, tight low end. (Once more, this is second-hand information).
Good post Nolly. I'm now kind of interested by all three of the humbuckers to be honest!
Probably not the other types though, I feel like the normal range will be more for me there.
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I posted this in another thread, but thought it would make sense to post it here as well.
I measured the True Grits and got this:
Bridge: 13.0 kΩ
Neck: 9.2 kΩ
Of course this is speculation but these measurements make me think that 43AWG plain enamel wire is used on them. There is no way to fit 13k of 42AWG wire on a standard sized humbucking coil, and a 9.2k 42AWG pickup in the neck would certainly overpower the bridge in this set. All in all, the bridge appears to be quite close to the Emerald specs, probably voiced to be a bit less bright.
Cheers Stephan
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I don't understand why they're cheaper.
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I don't understand why they're cheaper.
I believe it's because they don't have the over-heads of supporting so many options. I got a set last week, haven't got my "usual" choices over some stuff that is variable in the standard range (braided 2 core instead of 4 connector, long-leg instead of short, unpotted instead of potted).
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I don't understand why they're cheaper.
They're not really "cheaper"
They cost as much as the others costed not long ago
Difference is that have standardized specs and are sold only through retailers
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I posted this in another thread, but thought it would make sense to post it here as well.
I measured the True Grits and got this:
Bridge: 13.0 kΩ
Neck: 9.2 kΩ
Of course this is speculation but these measurements make me think that 43AWG plain enamel wire is used on them. There is no way to fit 13k of 42AWG wire on a standard sized humbucking coil, and a 9.2k 42AWG pickup in the neck would certainly overpower the bridge in this set. All in all, the bridge appears to be quite close to the Emerald specs, probably voiced to be a bit less bright.
Cheers Stephan
I just needed fuller sounding and less bright A5 pickups than the Emerald but with similar output. I was looking into Duncan brobucker, now I think I will go for this. So it is not just affordable new line they came up with. It seems these will have less eccentric characters than Emerald, Blackdog etc, so easier to pick and use. My Blackdogs are waiting for their right guitar to arrive at some point, I can only fantasize about it for now. I could get the whole Bare Knuckle line but I would then need to pick right guitars for each.
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Sorry I didn't mean to be rude not responding the Abraxas suggestion. I couldn't log on for a while for some reason. I recently began thinking I am not an A4 person, otherwise Abraxas fits the bill on paper, I have one bridge model.