KT88 Comprable To EL34?

[March]

Ive been researching some realy cool amps made by Electric Amp Innovations. The thing thats so cool 'bout them is that they use oldschool parts and components. So basicly they build their amps how amps were made in the late 60's-70's which gives them a very vintage saturated kind of tone thats seems very reminiscent of early Sab Records. (which of course peaks my intrest :D). Any who, they offer three different tube types on all their amps; EL34, 6550 and KT88, each of which will yield a different output wattage. So EL34 - 120 watts, 6550 - 160 watts and KT88 - 180 to 200. I have been in contact with the owner of the company for the past week trying to get some information regarding which amp would get me the best 'Master Of Reality' era Sab tone and it seems the EL34's would prob be the best choice considering they are pretty much THE choice power tubes in vintage style amps. However, the guy also said that the KT88's would basicly get me EL34 esque tone but at "mondo-volume" levels. Now im not much of a tube guy. I cant realy tell the diffrenece between different power tubes so well and I honestly dont have a whole lot of experience with tube amps period. So what do you more experienced people here think? Would KT88's be to modern sounding maybe? Would EL34's be more apropriet for the tone I'm trying to achieve?

If I were you I would look at the genuine article instead of Electric Amp Innovations. I've heard several reports about this company and as many people have already pointed out, essentially this company builds Matamp copies, essentially trading off the name.

I would strongly recommend speaking to the guys at Matamp. They are a fountain of knowledge when it comes to tube amps, plus they can tailor your chosen amps to your specific needs ie, voice it to your tastes or customise it's appearance.

http://www.matamp.co.uk

I own a King Street and Minimat. The King Street is great for hitting the 70's Marshall era tone and has enough gain on tap to get into 80's Marshall territory. However, reading what you want tonally, I would hazzard a guess that one of the Root series amps will deliver the tones you are after. However, the guys at Matamp will be able to advise you far better than I can.

[HJM]

^ are they out yet?

Not yet - Celestion UK are being really cr@p at delivering of late.

ok, cool. Thanks hayden. And they'd be good for 80's rock/metal, yeah? I'm assuming the price'll be around £80-£90 (at least, that's roughly what the other heritage ones are), and they're UK made?

:drink:

Yes, UK made, they're 65watt and were fitted in the early 80s to Marshall cabs before they went onto G12T drivers. According to the blurb they're the ultimate early JCM800 speaker. I think they'll be in the £80 range. They launched them at NAMM in January....along with the 40w alnico but still no production runs of either!

[Bainzy]

Bear in mind that it's unlikely that you'll ever be running the amp at it's full wattage totally through the speakers. I don't think you'd need to run the amp flat out unless you were playing the Royal Albert Hall, and by the time you play venues that big you'll be using their PA systems so will need to turn down a bit. Although running heads putting out more wattage than cabs can handle is unsafe normally, if the head is attenuated it doesn't really matter.

I use G12M25's in a 4x12 with my Marshall 1959slp and I've never EVER blown a speaker. I've had it on full tilt a few times, but that's just those days when you know everyone in the street is at work and your curious to see how loud the amp actually goes  

The G12M25's can realistically probably handle up to 30 watts before they start to discombobulate, and most 100w amps tend not to go higher than 120 watts. The ones that do go higher are the ones with really high plate voltage and/or ones that are overbiased.

Thats all true but I want to be able to get speaker distortion in addition to power amp dist when running the amp un-attenuated at full volume. I know I would prob never be able to do this in a live situation, but Im gonna record with it on weekends. I'm trying to get the most distortion out of a vintage style amp as I can. So tha basicly means im gonna turn the power amp all the way up, crank the 'Fuzz' / Drive control all the way and then run the amp itself straight into 2 4x12's. And I might use a treble booster or something in front of the amp for that extra bite.

If you're using two 4x12's then there's no problem whatsoever with what you use, a 100w amp would not put out enough power to blow any of them (G12M's, G12H30's etc). Having both cabs connected is like having an 8x12 cab in terms of what the amp "sees" connected to it, so your wattage required to blow a speaker doubles. That's how bands in the 60's and 70's got away with using 100w Marshalls with these speakers - they had a stack in their setup and not just one cab.

If you're using different speakers in the other cab, remember; the rated wattage of the cabs becomes the lowest speaker value times how many speakers you have. So if you have G12M25's in one and G12H30's in the other, the overall rating is still only 200 watts (8x25), not 220 (4x25 + 4x30). That's because all the speakers will be the same impedance and thus draw the same amount of power from the amplifier.

[deg0ey]

And although a 100 watt amp will often deliver more than 100 watts of power at full blast, it's unlikely to be more than 200 watts - and therefore not damaging your speakers :drink:

[dave_mc]

Yes, UK made, they're 65watt and were fitted in the early 80s to Marshall cabs before they went onto G12T drivers. According to the blurb they're the ultimate early JCM800 speaker. I think they'll be in the £80 range. They launched them at NAMM in January....along with the 40w alnico but still no production runs of either!

cool, thanks hayden. I guess I'd better keep an eye out...

:drink:

[HTH AMPS]

I've used to play through a single 100w 4x12 with a cranked 100w plexi as my main gig rig a few years back, the speakers held up for a good while but I did have a spate of 'em blowing  (I'm on about eight speakers here) so they DO eventually give it up.

The best way to prolong speaker life when using low wattage speakers is to warm them up - let some hiss come through them, strum light clean chords for a few minutes.  This will warm up the voice coil and lessen the chance of it burning out.  The easiest way to blow speakers is to switch on and proceed to pummel the speakers with a loud overdriven tone.

This tip was passed on to me by a very knowledgeable gent who was product manager at Celestion for many years - he knew a thing or two about speakers.

 :twisted:

[deg0ey]

I've used to play through a single 100w 4x12 with a cranked 100w plexi as my main gig rig a few years back, the speakers held up for a good while but I did have a spate of 'em blowing  (I'm on about eight speakers here) so they DO eventually give it up.

But what Bainzy was saying was that those speakers wouldn't have blown if you had been using 2 4x12s...The amp only puts 100 watts clean - when overdriven it puts out more than 100 watts, which is why it blew the speakers

2 cabs loaded with those speakers would be rated 200 watts and therefore would not blow

Maybe that's wrong, but it's my understanding of what was said :P

[Tricalibur]

Ive been researching some realy cool amps made by Electric Amp Innovations. The thing thats so cool 'bout them is that they use oldschool parts and components. So basicly they build their amps how amps were made in the late 60's-70's which gives them a very vintage saturated kind of tone thats seems very reminiscent of early Sab Records. (which of course peaks my intrest :D). Any who, they offer three different tube types on all their amps; EL34, 6550 and KT88, each of which will yield a different output wattage. So EL34 - 120 watts, 6550 - 160 watts and KT88 - 180 to 200. I have been in contact with the owner of the company for the past week trying to get some information regarding which amp would get me the best 'Master Of Reality' era Sab tone and it seems the EL34's would prob be the best choice considering they are pretty much THE choice power tubes in vintage style amps. However, the guy also said that the KT88's would basicly get me EL34 esque tone but at "mondo-volume" levels. Now im not much of a tube guy. I cant realy tell the diffrenece between different power tubes so well and I honestly dont have a whole lot of experience with tube amps period. So what do you more experienced people here think? Would KT88's be to modern sounding maybe? Would EL34's be more apropriet for the tone I'm trying to achieve?

If I were you I would look at the genuine article instead of Electric Amp Innovations. I've heard several reports about this company and as many people have already pointed out, essentially this company builds Matamp copies, essentially trading off the name.

I would strongly recommend speaking to the guys at Matamp. They are a fountain of knowledge when it comes to tube amps, plus they can tailor your chosen amps to your specific needs ie, voice it to your tastes or customise it's appearance.

http://www.matamp.co.uk

I own a King Street and Minimat. The King Street is great for hitting the 70's Marshall era tone and has enough gain on tap to get into 80's Marshall territory. However, reading what you want tonally, I would hazzard a guess that one of the Root series amps will deliver the tones you are after. However, the guys at Matamp will be able to advise you far better than I can.

I was in contact with the owner of Electric Amps via email for a little while and he basicly led me to believe matamps pretty much sounded like triple rectifiers or 5150's. He said that all the matamps they ever imported were either modded or heavily serviced. Reading back on it now it all sorta sounds a little fishy though there amps do look realy nice and all. What sorto of 'reports' have you heard?

[PhilKing]

I was in contact with the owner of Electric Amps via email for a little while and he basicly led me to believe matamps pretty much sounded like triple rectifiers or 5150's. He said that all the matamps they ever imported were either modded or heavily serviced. Reading back on it now it all sorta sounds a little fishy though there amps do look realy nice and all. What sorto of 'reports' have you heard?

I have heard quite a lot of Matamps in my time (including the originals and many early Orange amps [once being an Orange dealer]).  I also had the pleasure of being at the matamp Factory earlier this year, and I can tell you that their amps sound great.  You could probably get a 5150 or Triple Rectifier sound if you wanted to, but you can get any of the classic rock sounds and many other clean sounds too.  The most amazing is the 1224 mk 11, but I bought a Mini-Mat and I will be getting a bigger brother for it as soon as I have sorted my house out here.

I have heard a few rumours about how the guy at Electric Amps tried to 'hijack' the Matamp name.  If you are in the US, I know it is easier to go with a manufacturer here, but if you want a Matamp, then go to matamp.

[March]

I was in contact with the owner of Electric Amps via email for a little while and he basicly led me to believe matamps pretty much sounded like triple rectifiers or 5150's. He said that all the matamps they ever imported were either modded or heavily serviced. Reading back on it now it all sorta sounds a little fishy though there amps do look realy nice and all. What sorto of 'reports' have you heard?

I have heard quite a lot of Matamps in my time (including the originals and many early Orange amps [once being an Orange dealer]).  I also had the pleasure of being at the matamp Factory earlier this year, and I can tell you that their amps sound great.  You could probably get a 5150 or Triple Rectifier sound if you wanted to, but you can get any of the classic rock sounds and many other clean sounds too.  The most amazing is the 1224 mk 11, but I bought a Mini-Mat and I will be getting a bigger brother for it as soon as I have sorted my house out here.

I have heard a few rumours about how the guy at Electric Amps tried to 'hijack' the Matamp name.  If you are in the US, I know it is easier to go with a manufacturer here, but if you want a Matamp, then go to matamp.

Phil nails it. Matamp have expanded their product range to cater for the diverse musical tastes, however what you have been told is not correct. Matamp still produce amps that pay homage to their roots.

Plus I would also bet that the quality of the product is beyond that of the ex US distributor that is trading off their name. In fact, there are few manufacturers out there that can boast the build quality of Matamp's. It far outweighs the price you pay for their products.

[HTH AMPS]

I've used to play through a single 100w 4x12 with a cranked 100w plexi as my main gig rig a few years back, the speakers held up for a good while but I did have a spate of 'em blowing  (I'm on about eight speakers here) so they DO eventually give it up.

But what Bainzy was saying was that those speakers wouldn't have blown if you had been using 2 4x12s...The amp only puts 100 watts clean - when overdriven it puts out more than 100 watts, which is why it blew the speakers

2 cabs loaded with those speakers would be rated 200 watts and therefore would not blow

Maybe that's wrong, but it's my understanding of what was said :P

I was referring to Bainzy's earlier post about running a single 4x12 with a 100w head - just a note for people to be cautious really.

While speakers blow easiest when blasting more through them than they are rated for, it's actually repeated blasting from cold that kills most of them eventually - I kiled a 150w Celestion sidewinder with a Selmer 50w T&B head.

 :twisted:

[fps_dean]

KT88s can be abused to get up to 200, but in a 100 watt amp they will put out 100 watts.

They stay fairly clean and compress a little more than 6550s despite being the military grade tubes and able to handle more abuse....  I have a '69 Marshall Major with a quad of SED KT88s in it and they're quite full and compressed sounding.