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Author Topic: Pickup question  (Read 8899 times)

kellar

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Pickup question
« on: January 23, 2008, 06:51:02 PM »
Hey guys, I was hoping some of you more experienced BKP users could help me out. I just got my Mules last week, alnico IV, and I am not sure they are exactly what I am looking for. Incredible pickups, the best I have ever heard. But not quite where I need my sound to be.
-The neck seems to have a touch to much low end for my liking. I need something real crystal clear and crisp in the neck. I play the majority of my blues clean and in the neck position. I love a super clean and dynamic neck. Almost jazz clean, but punchy on the low end and tight. Bluesy.
-The bridge has to be versatile. I love that glassy tone I get from the Mule through my tube amp, but I have had difficulty finding the spot where I am happy with it dirty and clean. Also, I wouldn't mind a bit more kick in the bridge for classic rock tunes. It is very important that I can play it clean though. I have always had a problem finding a bridge pickup that I like clean. Maybe I am just impossible to please. Once again, tight bottoms and crisp highs.
So, any suggestions? I was thinking something like Stormy Mondays, but maybe with something more dynamic in the bridge. I am open to suggestions. Right now I am playing through a Les Paul and Epiphone Valve Junior stack. The EVJ is generally a bit dark, I need something to brighten it a bit more. Thanks in advance for the help!
Calibrated IV Mules, Stormy Monday/Riff Raff

Peter Antal

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Pickup question
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2008, 07:20:28 PM »
The SM neck is a very similar wind to the Mule neck but has Alnico II instead of IV which should pull the bass back a little bit. If you want more sparkle, you could order it with Alnico III, too. However, there are several things you can do before ordering another pickup. Have you tried lowering the bass side of the pickup? Using 500K or 1 Meg pots instead of lower values also makes the sound more defined.  Upgrading to 500K or 1 Meg is a must, if you have 300K pots in your LP. Finally, getting a high-end cable is usually like taking a wet blanket off your sound and should clear up the bass. 8)

kellar

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Pickup question
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2008, 07:46:17 PM »
Thanks for the reply. Oddly enough, I just switched all my pots and caps out with an upgrade kit from rsguitarworks. It definitely improved my sound. My cables are all decent. I never buy cheap cables.
I have adjusted the pickups all over the place. The neck has a bit too much low end in overdrive. Actually, a bit too much low end period. Not quite sparkly enough. Like I said, I am looking for a neck pickup that really sparkles clean.
The bridge I was happier with. I felt like it could have been a bit hotter though for soloing. I got a real nice glassy tone with it though.
Like you suggested, I was thinking a Stormy Monday in the bridge. I think that is really going to open up my cleans. I am not an expert on magnets, what are alnico III's going to do for me?
Any bridge suggestions??
Calibrated IV Mules, Stormy Monday/Riff Raff

Twinfan

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« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2008, 08:20:40 PM »
The Mule neck is very full.  A good alternative I have in one of my LPs is an Alnico IV Stormy Monday.  Great for clean and blues tones, more Slash than Gary Moore if that makes sense?

The Mule I find great in the bridge, but I know what you're asking for.  What about a Riff Raff?

kellar

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« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2008, 08:55:32 PM »
Yes, the Mule neck is very full. Well rounded and very musical, but a bit too bottom heavy for my taste.I need something airey and extremely clean.
I read about the Riff Raff, sounds intriguing. I want something a bit hotter than the Mule but still able to hold cleans.
Basically, I need something that is ultimately blues but a bit hotter in the bridge.
What about the Vintage Hot series (VHII, Black Dog, Emerald, Abraxas) for the bridge? Or is that taking it too far for what I am looking for?
Calibrated IV Mules, Stormy Monday/Riff Raff

TwilightOdyssey

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Pickup question
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2008, 09:06:25 PM »
Quote from: Peter Antal
The SM neck is a very similar wind to the Mule neck but has Alnico II instead of IV

Not necessarily. Tim often winds the SM neck with A4, depending on what you're doing.

Scotty477

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Pickup question
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2008, 12:59:03 AM »
Quote from: kellar
Yes, the Mule neck is very full. Well rounded and very musical, but a bit too bottom heavy for my taste.I need something airey and extremely clean.
I read about the Riff Raff, sounds intriguing. I want something a bit hotter than the Mule but still able to hold cleans.
Basically, I need something that is ultimately blues but a bit hotter in the bridge.
What about the Vintage Hot series (VHII, Black Dog, Emerald, Abraxas) for the bridge? Or is that taking it too far for what I am looking for?


From experience the Emerald neck isn't going to give you an airy clean tone. It's more of a dark, slightly hot - smokey tone - with plenty of bottom end.

It does however clean up nicely when the volume is taken down on the guitar to below 8 but I don't think the Emerald neck is what you're after.

Scotty477

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« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2008, 12:59:59 AM »
Double post.

Ted

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« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2008, 08:01:43 AM »
I'm a bit surprised at this post. Listening to tom's clips of his Muled LP makes me think the mule is a do-it-all. Bridge anyway, no idea about the neck though.

Henk

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Pickup question
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2008, 09:50:17 AM »
OK, i have the Mule set too, its a very responsive set so its not that easy to setup, a first glance at what they can do isnt enough your really have to put some time in IMHO.

Secondly it sounds to me you are used to playing a neck pickup of which you adjusted the polepieces to get the proper dynamics. Just tilt the neck mule a little more towards the strings, this will allready change alot, at least it does on mine, once you are absolutely sure you got the right spot to leave the neck mule on, then adjust the individual poles to get the resonse your used to. The bridge is pretty much the same, if its set quite low, just play with the setup a little and if you want a bit more brightness tilt it a bit.

I have the bridge mule set up in a way that i can have the string growl when digging in deep and just roll off a bit for perfect glassy cleans.

IT IS IMPOSSIBLE to get good rock drive and good bluesy cleans from a bridge Mule without messing a bit with the tone/volume. There is just too much high end difference in the sound IMO. So basically setup the bridge Mule for a great rock tone, and believe me its in there, and triple check how the cleans are when rolled off a bit. If you dont have the best tone caps, just dont use it, use the vol instead.

Sorry if i cut it a bit too short, im late for an appointment!!!!!!! :oops:
Mules in '76 Gibson custom with maple neck.

kellar

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Pickup question
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2008, 10:49:54 AM »
Wow, thanks for the great replies. I just want to clarify something, in case I sounded a bit negative earlier (that was not my intent). I am by no means disappointed with these pickups. They are incredible, quite unique in tone. I like them a lot, just having a difficult time finding that happy medium between the bridge and the neck. So with that said........
I sat down last night and devoted myself to finding the correct height for these pickups. I refuse to believe that such an incredible pickup can't make me happy. I adjusted up and down on the neck first because my clean neck tones are most dear to me and very important to achieving the sounds that I like most. Eventually, I found it. The neck had to be adjusted quite low actually. I didn't find it earlier because I don't normally adjust my neck pickup quite that low. It's about a mm down into the pickup ring(I normally have my neck about even with the top of the ring) and the treble side is about a turn higher than the bass side. It sounds brilliant!! The lows are super tight and poppy, the highs are glassy and clear. It's pretty damn close to where I like it.
I then tried to match up my bridge. That is a bit of a challenge for me because I am not one to just match up the outputs and then leave it. That was my problem before. Though the outputs matched up, I wasn't happy with the tone out of the bridge. I would then adjust up or down and that would obviously throw everything off. I would find myself moving the neck again. Anyway, I found the spot on the bridge where I was happy and the outputs matched. So, at about midnight (much to the dismay of everyone living within a half kilometer of me!!) I cranked it up and let it go. Frankly, it blew me away. The neck was warm but super tight. Crystal clear. The cleans were beautiful and dynamic. But, the neck is what really won me over. The tones were airey and super glassy (if that makes any sense). I have lots of air between the strings and the bridge pickup and I think that is the key. Incredible tones.
So, with that said I think I am pretty happy. IMHO the bridge could be a touch hotter. But, I don't know if I am willing to swap it for another pickup because I really like the clean tone. The neck could also be a touch smoother. Then again, I don't know if I am willing to sacrifice the smooth overdriven tones. I thought about a Stormy Monday and a Black Dog, but I think I am just being ridiculous and a bit too much of a perfectionist. Regardless, the Mules sound simply unbelievable, no doubt about it.
With that said, I am getting the slightest bit of ringing out of the pickups on the high strings, both pickups. Any idea what I can do about that?
It's not loud, just noticeable. (told you I was impossible to please!!)
Calibrated IV Mules, Stormy Monday/Riff Raff

kellar

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Pickup question
« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2008, 12:39:11 PM »
Well, I wrote Tim to ask him for his opinion. Despite liking what I have heard from these pickups, they may not be exactly what I am looking for. Not bad by any means, just different in some ways than what I need. A bit cleaner and crisper in the neck. The mule just seems a bit too round for me. In the bridge I would like just a bit more fire for solos. I really like the mule bridge clean, sounds great. But for solos I feel like I needed just a bit more bite. You know what I mean??
Anyway, suggestions anyone?? I haven't given up on the mules yet. I'm still playing around with them in the hopes that I find what I am looking for and don't have to annoy Tim with a swap.
Calibrated IV Mules, Stormy Monday/Riff Raff

Peter Antal

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« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2008, 12:58:27 PM »
Ahh, forgot you bought your pups less than two weeks ago. I say if you don't think Mules are your best choice, don't hesitate to exchange them for something else! :) That's what the two-week trial period is there for. BTW, I also adjusted my Mules very low when I put heavy strings (12's) on my guitar. I recently went back to 10's and had to raise them again for more sensitivity.

I hope you'll find what you're looking for. 8)

kellar

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« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2008, 01:06:42 PM »
Thanks. Yeah, I got them last week. I'll wait on a reply from Tim to see what I do next. I am open for suggestions as well, since I haven't heard any of the other pickups.
Calibrated IV Mules, Stormy Monday/Riff Raff

Twinfan

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« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2008, 01:28:56 PM »
Hunter has some great Black Dog clips in the players section of the forum which may help you?