CHARLTON HESTON dead at age 84 ...

[Antag]

I don't think you can overlook something which I at least find morally abhorrent

Actually, I can quite easily overlook it because it's so wildly illogical & hopelessly ill-informed... :)

[TwilightOdyssey]

What happened to my fun, slightly irreverent, thread?!!

[Johnny Mac]

What happened to my fun, slightly irreverent, thread?!!

Another sense of humour bypass over this side of the pond!! It's the combination of inconsistent weather and a full moon!  

[38thBeatle]

I thought he was brilliant in the 1966 world cup final. That comb over hair do didn't do any favours... or am I thinking of the wrong bloke?

[Philly Q]

What happened to my fun, slightly irreverent, thread?!!

Another sense of humour bypass over this side of the pond!! It's the combination of inconsistent weather and a full moon!  

To be fair, I don't think death is usually the ideal jumping-off point for a bit of comedy gold...

[Johnny Mac]

What happened to my fun, slightly irreverent, thread?!!

Another sense of humour bypass over this side of the pond!! It's the combination of inconsistent weather and a full moon!  

To be fair, I don't think death is usually the ideal jumping-off point for a bit of comedy gold...

No? Well it depends what mood your in I suppose. There's lots of humour death related that comes from the UK.

[TwilightOdyssey]

What happened to my fun, slightly irreverent, thread?!!

Another sense of humour bypass over this side of the pond!! It's the combination of inconsistent weather and a full moon!  

To be fair, I don't think death is usually the ideal jumping-off point for a bit of comedy gold...

Worked well in Kind Hearts & Coronets

[Dakine]

...who's lobbying quite specifically did not help prevent hundreds of deaths

Actually, it probably prevented a damn sight more deaths.  Places that have concealed carry & castle doctrine have drastically lower rates of violent crime than those that don't.  What has Chicago's handgun ban given them?  One of the highest murder rates in the US.

If you're trying to pin the Colombine deaths on Heston, then I'd suggest that had his lobbying been more successful (i.e. to the extent that the teachers were allowed to carry), then there would have been fewer deaths in that tragic incident.

Bottom line: criminals don't care about laws banning firearms, but they do care about a potential victim shooting back.

very informed.

From UK to USA, stop watching movies and 'slanted' (politically) news reels. It is NOT the wild west here lol.

Charlton Heston was an icon, movie or NRA still an icon.

As for gun violence. I have a concealed carry permit cos I choose to. I rarely carry though as it's safe area and I do not feel threatened. Gun laws are good (as it's WAAAAAAAAAAYYYYY too late to change the American Constitution, with the 'right to bear arms' being originally written in to allow citizens to amass arms to repel invasions, this is after the Brits were kicked out lol) as the 'bad guys' will NEVER give up their 'illegal' gun purchases, so level the playing field and at least allow the same chance to law abiding people.

As for guns being dangerous, read/ask/think/be adult! A firearm is a TOOL no more no less. The user of said tool can use it as a weapon or not. Check alcohol/car/drug deaths in relation to firearms deaths. Also, check figures of crime (mentioned by Antag) where concealed carry has been allowed. Basically get ya facts straight or live IN the situation or shush !

[Philly Q]

What happened to my fun, slightly irreverent, thread?!!

Another sense of humour bypass over this side of the pond!! It's the combination of inconsistent weather and a full moon!  

To be fair, I don't think death is usually the ideal jumping-off point for a bit of comedy gold...

Worked well in Kind Hearts & Coronets

Not so well in Weekend at Bernie's.  

But yes, absolutely, death can often be very funny in fiction and even when talking about real people who've been gone a while.  But I felt a bit sorry for poor old Charlton Heston being the butt of jokes and the target of so much vitriol before he's even in the ground.

But I wish I hadn't raised the subject of death and comedy, and I'm not terribly interested in the gun control debate - it's one of those subjects that no-one ever seems to change their mind on so discussion is pretty fruitless.  I just think it's a shame that Charlton Heston is now best known for being senile, wearing a toupee and being a figurehead (nothing more) for a bunch of people who like guns.  No-one's mentioned that in the early '60s this "Hitler equivalent" was an active supporter of the civil rights movement.

He wasn't the greatest actor in the world, he was a bit stiff and humourless, but at his best those qualities were used to his advantage.  Just watch the movies - The Big Country, Will Penny, El Cid, Ben-Hur, Major Dundee, Planet of the Apes, The Ten Commandments, Touch of Evil.  They're all great, and that's how he should be remembered.

[plastercaster]

...who's lobbying quite specifically did not help prevent hundreds of deaths

Actually, it probably prevented a damn sight more deaths.  Places that have concealed carry & castle doctrine have drastically lower rates of violent crime than those that don't.  What has Chicago's handgun ban given them?  One of the highest murder rates in the US.

If you're trying to pin the Colombine deaths on Heston, then I'd suggest that had his lobbying been more successful (i.e. to the extent that the teachers were allowed to carry), then there would have been fewer deaths in that tragic incident.

Are you sure you're not making the effect a cause here?
I've seen this argument before (The area was different, could have been some NY ghetto, but the points were the same), And I thought surely, this is because:
Chicago -> poor (?) -> unemployment -> crime -> shootings -> handgun ban
rather than:
Chicago -> evil liberals impose handgun ban  -> Criminals shoot people because it's become more illegal.

Also, do you really think armed teachers are a good idea? For a start, teachers want to teach, not kill children, no matter how urgent the situation is.
Also, I've seen teachers have mental breakdowns in class. what's to say that someone in the grip of madness won't pull a gun on a student?
I know I've half-contradicted myself, but the situations are different.

I'm not meaning to troll here, I'm just curious.

[Matt77]

I personally just like to remember him as the guy that forgot to take off his wristw@tch when filming the big chariot race in Ben Hur

[Antag]

What has Chicago's handgun ban given them?  One of the highest murder rates in the US.

Are you sure you're not making the effect a cause here?
I've seen this argument before (The area was different, could have been some NY ghetto, but the points where the same), And I thought surely, this is because:
Chicago -> poor (?) -> unemployment -> crime -> shootings -> handgun ban
rather than:
Chicago -> evil liberals impose handgun ban  -> Criminals shoot people because it's become more illegal.

Ah, but you've missed something:
Chicago -> poor (?) -> unemployment -> crime -> shootings -> handgun ban -> more shootings
So it's fair so speculate that either
handgun ban -> the law abiding are defenceless -> more shootings
or
handgun ban -> criminals ignore it & continue to shoot people anyway -> more shootings

So whether there has been an undesirable effect or no effect at all, the effect hasn't been the one intended.

No, I don't like the idea of armed teachers either.  But I like the idea of someone being able to rampage around school corridors shooting people with nobody able to do anything about it even less.

I'm not meaning to troll here, I'm just curious.

I think I was the one being a troll.  Before seeing this thread I'd trawled through 26 pages of nasty/smug/warped BBC-trendy-lefty garbage on this subject so when I came to my favourite site & saw more of same I blew my top a bit :lol:  Apologies to nfe for the tone of my reply & to Twilight for jacking the thread...

[nfe]

I think I was the one being a troll.  Before seeing this thread I'd trawled through 26 pages of nasty/smug/warped BBC-trendy-lefty garbage on this subject so when I came to my favourite site & saw more of same I blew my top a bit :lol:  Apologies to nfe for the tone of my reply & to Twilight for jacking the thread...

No worries, I'll live  :)

[Johnny Mac]

What happened to my fun, slightly irreverent, thread?!!

Another sense of humour bypass over this side of the pond!! It's the combination of inconsistent weather and a full moon!  

To be fair, I don't think death is usually the ideal jumping-off point for a bit of comedy gold...

Worked well in Kind Hearts & Coronets

Not so well in Weekend at Bernie's.  

But yes, absolutely, death can often be very funny in fiction and even when talking about real people who've been gone a while.  But I felt a bit sorry for poor old Charlton Heston being the butt of jokes and the target of so much vitriol before he's even in the ground.

I expect you wouldn't want to hear a very crass Patrick Swayze joke then. Bearing in mind the poor sod still hasn't gone. I never made this joke up either, it just turned up, like many do as a text message.

Anyway enough about death and gun laws ect!

Anyone heard birdsong on digital radio yet? Very soothing!

[MrBump]

Ummm... is this thread beyond redemption?

On a similar side note, legislation has just been brought in to prohibit the sale of Samurai swords in the UK.  

As a martial artist I train with swords, it's a part of the tradition of what I do.  I keep my swords (butterfly, not Samurai) in my garage, next to my bow saw, straight saw, my jigsaw, electric drill and various other weapons of mass destruction.  Legislation aside, I know what I'd rather be hit with.

I've never really understood gun posession, but then I'm not American...  Looking at the rising gun crime in this country, maybe we can no longer afford to me smug?

Mark.