Help on new pickup set for my ES335

[OneFingerSnap]

Hi everyone.

I'm the proud owner of a Gibson ES335. It needed a re-fret, so I decided to take the opportunity to do a bit of a "revolution" on it. I know a pretty good luthier here in Portugal, so for starters, he made me a new ebony fretboard to house the new frets. Also, I wanted to try a set of "rockier" pickups on the guitar. I was curious to hear how a semi-acoustic, jazzier type of guitar would work when used in a rock context. I knew I didn't want a very high gain pickup, I was searching for a middle ground, vintage-like pickup that cleans up nicely and also gets a good distorted tone from a light crunch up to a fairly distorted tone (think Gary Moore, Still Got The Blues). After a bit of research, I bought a Seymour Duncan JB for the bridge and a Seymour Duncan Jazz for the neck.

The problem is I'm not happy with the sound at all, from both pickups. I find it too trebly and harsh, and not meaty enough. I was told the new ebony fretboard also makes the tone brighter, so probably the pickup choice wasn't the best. A friend mentioned he was very happy with the BK pickups he bought for his guitar, so after checking the website, I decided to buy a set of BK's to replace the SD's on my 335.

After reading the pickup descriptions, and the forum, I narrowed my choice down to the Mules, Stormy Mondays or PG's. However, I can't make up my mind between these three! Remember, my original goal still holds; I'd like to use my 335 in a rock context and get both a nice, warm clean tone, up to a fairly distorted, non-harsh tone, definitely more vintage than modern.

One last question: I have a Seymour Duncan Antiquity (neck) in another semi-acoustic guitar, which I am happy with. Which of the BK's would you say is closer to the Antiquity?

Thanks in advance for your help!

PS: Sorry for the boring, long post guys...



Regards,
Miguel

[Jonny]

Have you checked out the Mule demo in the Players section?
For me (probably not helpful) if I had a 335, I would go Stormies. But this is only through imagination of what I think they would sound like. Mules I think might be too overpowering. But the Mule seems to be good for anything.

I would recommend checking out some submitted clips too, here's some:

http://www.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3748&highlight=stormy+monday
http://www.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3638&highlight=stormy+monday
http://www.bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4000&highlight=stormy+monday

And specifically this one, as the user actually mentioned it was for classic rock stuff, etc. etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2PX9JWqCTw

Whatever you manage to end up with you won't be disappointed. And welcome too.  :)

[Fourth Feline]

Hi everyone.

I'm the proud owner of a Gibson ES335. It needed a re-fret, so I decided to take the opportunity to do a bit of a "revolution" on it. I know a pretty good luthier here in Portugal, so for starters, he made me a new ebony fretboard to house the new frets. Also, I wanted to try a set of "rockier" pickups on the guitar. I was curious to hear how a semi-acoustic, jazzier type of guitar would work when used in a rock context. I knew I didn't want a very high gain pickup, I was searching for a middle ground, vintage-like pickup that cleans up nicely and also gets a good distorted tone from a light crunch up to a fairly distorted tone (think Gary Moore, Still Got The Blues). After a bit of research, I bought a Seymour Duncan JB for the bridge and a Seymour Duncan Jazz for the neck.

The problem is I'm not happy with the sound at all, from both pickups. I find it too trebly and harsh, and not meaty enough. I was told the new ebony fretboard also makes the tone brighter, so probably the pickup choice wasn't the best. A friend mentioned he was very happy with the BK pickups he bought for his guitar, so after checking the website, I decided to buy a set of BK's to replace the SD's on my 335.

After reading the pickup descriptions, and the forum, I narrowed my choice down to the Mules and the Stormy Mondays. However, I can't make up my mind between these two! Remember, my original goal still holds; I'd like to use my 335 in a rock context and get both a nice, warm clean tone, up to a fairly distorted, non-harsh tone.

One last question: I have a Seymour Duncan Antiquity (neck) in another semi-acoustic guitar, which I am happy with. Which of the two BK's would you say is closer to the Antiquity?

Thanks in advance for your help!

PS: Sorry for the boring, long post guys...



Regards,

Miguel

Hi Miguel  :)

Definately the Mules between those two choices for Rock. Also  because I have been trying different pickus in my 335 copy - and whereas I find Alnico II Stormy Mondays to have  a looser, softer, quieter bass definition - a pair of 'Brand x' Alnico V   pickups I tried had a much tighter bass even though they lacked the detail , quality and subtleties of the S.Ms.

For  a 335 ( after some experimentation with my Les Paul, S.G. and 335 copy ) - I would therefore ask Tim for anAlnico IV Stormy Monday set, or in your case. the Mules.

Congratulations on your 335 ownership !  :D

[OneFingerSnap]

Wow guys! I wasn't expecting such quick answers!

Thanks a lot, I'll be checking the clips (yet again ;-) You might have noticed that I edited the original post and added the PG's to mix after the first two replies. Sorry about that, I'm still a bit confused as you can see...

I was already a bit more inclined to the Mules, but what if I add the PG's? Between these and the Mules where would you guys go???

Thanks,
Miguel

[gingataff]

I don't have a 335 although I'd love one. I think the Mule would work well but I also think a set of Riff Raffs could be an option, a bit brighter than you were thinking but that's what tone controls are for :)

[kellar]

Stormy Monday's are magic in a 335. But, if you want something a little more rock than the Mules are that. What about a Stormy Monday neck/Mule bridge combo? that could be the best of both worlds.

[Philly Q]

I was already a bit more inclined to the Mules, but what if I add the PG's? Between these and the Mules where would you guys go???

Apart from the way the neck pickup is wired, I believe the PG Blues set is basically very similar to the SMs.  The SMs aren't really "rock" pickups, unless you're looking no further than a late 60s/early 70s blues-rock kind of tone or maybe thinking of getting a bit jazzy.  Then again, Gary Moore has the PG Blues set apparently, so what do I know?

I don't own any Mules, but I've been reading some good things recently about combining an alnico IV Mule neck with an alnico V Mule bridge.  The AIV neck will be a little tighter than the AII SM, as Fourth Feline has mentioned, but it'll still do nice warm tones.  And the AV bridge will be a little more "rock" again - it apparently has the clarity and bite of the Riff Raff, with a bit of extra meat in the midrange.

[Ratrod]

If I wanted to make a rocky 335, I'd go for Riff Raffs, although that might be a little on the bright side with all that maple and an ebony board.

[Philly Q]

If I wanted to make a rocky 335, I'd go for Riff Raffs, although that might be a little on the bright side with all that maple and an ebony board.

I'm not a 335 owner, but (if my Thinline Tele's anything to judge by) the semi-hollow body seems to bring out the bass and treble more than a solidbody.  I have a feeling Riff Raffs might sound a little "cold" and piercing, especially, as you say, with all that maple and ebony.

[Fourth Feline]

I don't have a 335 although I'd love one. I think the Mule would work well but I also think a set of Riff Raffs could be an option, a bit brighter than you were thinking but that's what tone controls are for :)

Yes, I was watching the ' You Tube' clip of Larry Carlton playing " Just an excuse" - with his Gibson'57 pickups.  As I listened, I realised that his tone ( towards the end - when it really heats up ) - was perhaps closer to a pair of Riff Raffs I had once heard / played than Stormy Mondays.

As you also observed, you can use the tone controls. Apparently Larry Carlton himself spins his bridge tone control down to about 3-5 sometimes, or as he said " just where bright  starts to become dark ".

My experiments with my 'spare' Gibson pickups seem to re-inforce these observations - although obvously a set of Gibson  490T / 498R  lack the overall qualities of our beloved B.K.P s.

So for me it seemed to prove that Mules and Riff Raffs e.t.c. might be a more viable choice than I had first thought.

[Fourth Feline]

I e:mailed Tim - and he recommended that I let the B.K.P team put Alnico IV magnets in my ( now Alnico II ) Stormy Mondays, instead of changing the model of pickups.

Tim said it would tighten the bass - and although I might lose a little warmth overall, the frequency responce would be more even.

All this help / knowledge and he even replied on Sunday !

Great one Tim, thank you .  :D