Username: Password:

Author Topic: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?  (Read 1905 times)

AndyR

  • Welterweight
  • ****
  • Posts: 4715
  • Where's all the top end gone?
    • My Offerings
Would you expect to affect the tone of a guitar if you stripped the lacquer off the back of the neck? I suppose my response would have been, "yeah, I guess so, but not so's I could actually tell..."

Over the weekend, I stripped the back of the neck on my CIJ 62 Strat, and got quite a bit of a surprise... (a nice one, luckily).

I've wondered about doing it ever since I got it nearly three years ago. I stripped my early 80s JV Squier Strat neck in the early 80s, did hundreds of gigs with it and never had a problem (and I sweat buckets), so I wasn't too concerned about neck stability. I've oiled and waxed it on and off over the years, so that might have protected it (linseed oil at first, lemon oil later, and a bit of briwax every now and then since).

However, I kept holding off doing it to this guitar because I wasn't having too much trouble with the poly.

And then I got a Roadworn last year... I've been oiling and waxing that, and it feels like a dream to play for me... and now I'm finding the finish on the CIJ neck not to my taste... so I went ahead and attacked it on saturday.

Feel-wise, it is everything I dreamed it would be. Apart from the difference in frets, the two guitars feel very similar and welcoming.

But I was amazed to find a difference in tone.

I've been struggling on-and-off getting enough top-end out of this guitar. There is plenty there to work with, but it's just a tad warmer and thicker sounding than I'm used to on a strat. This is very useful in some ways, but has relegated it from #1 spot after the Roadworn arrived.

I put Sultans in it the other week, which improved things and worked to the guitar's strengths, but it still felt a little less "organic" tonally than the Roadworn (to my ears, anyway :lol:). The Sultans are the best pickups I've had in this one so far (including Texas Specials, Tex Mex, and BKP Irish Tours). I'd even started wondering about new bridge hardware, from just saddles or block, to replacing the whole shooting match... but I'm loathe to mess with this area at all because the trem is working SO perfectly.

So, after I'd spent a shoulder-breaking few hours stripping off the poly, hoovering away the dust and giving it an initial dose of oil... I was amazed to discover that accoustically it seemed, well, "different". (It's got the same strings and set-up, by the way, you don't think I bothered taking it apart to do it do you?! My wife, when she found out what was happening was very relieved to find dust sheets everywhere :lol:).

Anyway, I compared it to the Roadworn (accoustically), and a big smile broke across my face. This is quite a good test, because I've been comparing them almost daily like this for moinths :roll:. Even with the old(er) strings, it's louder than it was, and brighter. It almost feels like it sustains more - but I think that could be my imagination.

So I powered up an amp and plugged in...

It's still thicker sounding than the Roadworn, and it doesn't have nearly as much cut and bite as that one. And it's retained its rounded warmth, but suddenly the tone has more clarity and seems to "breathe" more - in fact, all the words we use when trying to describe the difference over stock pickups when you instal BKPs!

I don't want to add too much to internet "tone-mythology" here... but I really wasn't expecting this (for me) "improvement". I've read about body finishes affecting tone, and I think that might be, um, well, let's say I'm not sure I believe it's measurable by most of us... and bridge hardware - this seems a reasonable bet to me, and I have some experience of it myself (always with new strings in the equation though). And I've read about necks/fingerboards having much more to do with the tone... but I haven't read anywhere about the finish on the back of the neck having a noticable effect...  :?

So, while I'm very pleased and grateful that this unlooked for change has occurred (and that it's an improving change for me rather than a bad side-effect!), I'm interested to know what other people might expect or have experienced.

(And I have a black CIJ custom tele quaking in its case, with a very similar lacquer on the back of its neck, even as we speak :lol:)
Play or Download AndyR Music at http://www.alonetone.com/andyr

Twinfan

  • Light Heavyweight
  • ******
  • Posts: 10528
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2010, 10:47:20 AM »
Interesting info - cheers!

Tellboy

  • Lightweight
  • ***
  • Posts: 988
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2010, 11:54:31 AM »
I got a Blackpoole Relic Tele a couple of months ago which has a thin nitro finish (and some areas of bare wood!). Compared to my Jap 50th Anniversary tele (which I would think has a lacquer finish similar to your Strat) it sounds much more alive. I've fitted a set of BG Flat50s in it and am very pleased with the results. The jap tele has a set of Piledrivers in and doesn't sound quite so 'tele' but even acoustically the Blackpoole sounds much better.
I've ordered a set of Pigtail case hardened steel saddles to replace the brass ones and hopefully give the jap tele some more zing.
John Suhr - "Practice cures most tone issues"
Crawler,Mule,Apache,Piledriver,Bl. Guard,Cold Sweat

Ian Price

  • Welterweight
  • ****
  • Posts: 4571
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2010, 12:22:44 PM »
Cheers Andy! I had a MIJ (althogh it mgiht have been a CIJ) '62 custom. That had a thickish finish on the neck that I never really got on with. It was quite twangy but not as twangy as other teles I have owned and played. If I still had it I think I would be sanding as soon as I got home!
I think I hate being indecisive.

AndyR

  • Welterweight
  • ****
  • Posts: 4715
  • Where's all the top end gone?
    • My Offerings
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2010, 12:30:54 PM »
If I still had it I think I would be sanding as soon as I got home!

That's the one thing that was worrying me about posting this... :lol:

If I was reading my post, I would be thinking about getting the sand-paper out on several guitars when I got home...

I'm hoping that one of our resident luthiers might come on board with the voice of reason and restraint - I'd hate to be responsible for a rash of folks butchering their guitars... :lol:

Omigod - you don't think Twinfan's rushed home and attacked his Modern Eagle yet?!!!   :o

:lol:

Play or Download AndyR Music at http://www.alonetone.com/andyr

Twinfan

  • Light Heavyweight
  • ******
  • Posts: 10528
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2010, 12:59:22 PM »
No need - the Eagle has no finish on the neck as standard  ;)

AndyR

  • Welterweight
  • ****
  • Posts: 4715
  • Where's all the top end gone?
    • My Offerings
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2010, 01:09:36 PM »
No need - the Eagle has no finish on the neck as standard  ;)

Whew!!! :lol:

I must admit, I plucked "Modern Eagle" out of the air on that line, without thinking how it might be constructed.
Play or Download AndyR Music at http://www.alonetone.com/andyr

Philly Q

  • Light Heavyweight
  • ******
  • Posts: 18109
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2010, 01:14:58 PM »
I haven't tried many MIJ Fenders, but I've noticed they tend to be a bit quiet - verging on dead - acoustically.  I always put it down to the slightly dodgy hardware, but maybe it was really the thick finishes?
BKPs I've Got:  RR, BKP-91, ITs, VHII, CS set, Emeralds
BKPs I Had:  RY+Abraxas, Crawlers, BD+SM

AndyR

  • Welterweight
  • ****
  • Posts: 4715
  • Where's all the top end gone?
    • My Offerings
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2010, 01:08:21 PM »
Update:

The initial post was based on experiences through a valve amp at the weekend.

Last night I was running through my Vox Tonelab LE modellor and studio monitors for the first time since the operation - the difference is even more noticable! So much so that it sparked another round of pickup height adjustment (it was due one anyway, I've still only had the pickups a few weeks), and I found I could now make much more extreme adjustments before getting into "hmm, a bit muddy" or "hmm, a bit too thin".

It really is as if the guitar is putting out "more" usable tone, giving me more options on how I can fine tune the thing...

There's loads more "quack" available from this strat now, and it's not so difficult getting a middle pickup tone I want (I've always struggled in that area on this guitar, it was possible, but extremely fiddly!).

I really wish I'd had the "ears" to notice the difference back in 1983 or whenever it was that I stripped the JV Squier's neck. I do remember that that one had thick-ish clear coat(s) under the "amber die" layer. The one this weekend had the "vintage colour" layer pretty much on the wood - the moment I was through colour I was on the wood itself. It was still pretty hard work though...

I'm not going to attack it yet, I'll fiddle around a lot more before commiting to it, but odds are that I'll be stripping the neck of my MIJ Custom Tele now...

I'd think twice before attacking a one piece maple neck though - really not too sure about what to do with the fingerboard in that case...

EDIT: So, bearing in mind that this strat was already my #1 guitar over all others until the Roadworn arrived a few months ago... you can imagine that I'm having quite a nice time with it now! :lol:
« Last Edit: March 23, 2010, 01:11:52 PM by AndyR »
Play or Download AndyR Music at http://www.alonetone.com/andyr

MDV

  • Middleweight
  • *****
  • Posts: 6945
  • If it sounds good it IS good
Re: Stripping the back of a neck - would you expect it to affect tone?
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2010, 11:54:02 AM »
I can believe it.

Paint or heavy laquer dampen high freqency oscilations through the guitar.

Its one of the reasons that my Legra Aurora has none.