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Author Topic: Band Shuffling Advice?  (Read 4147 times)

Keven

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Band Shuffling Advice?
« on: April 21, 2010, 04:48:26 AM »
so at our last rehearsal, it was just me and my drummer, who pretty much write all music and are seasonned studio guys. we have a bass player and another guitar player (who happens to be one of my former students too!) with us who do a very good job while they're there.

that's just the problem, they aren't there all the time. our bass player's been there for one rehearsal in the last month and the other player just said he wasn't gonna be there 'cause of some family party. this pissed the drummer off real bad.

we're quite the odd bunch, i'm quite young, at 23, my drummer is 33, bass is 26-27 i think and the young player turned 20 in january. I've been living and breathing music since i got the damn thing in my paws. my drummer's played covers with a bunch of old bands. my ex student is a kind of lazy party all the time but really talented kid who could be something if he worked on it. and the bass player is a good one, but has no gear (plays on a bass kit we have at our rehearsal place)

anyway, backstory is done, we're working on our originals, actually, me and the drummer are. i've had little to no input from these guys. they play, we play some covers from back when we were a cover band. and that's that. last time me and the drummer rehearsed alone togheter we got a new song started.

so it comes to the point where we're thinking we might have the throw the dead weight off the boat, to get started with more songwriting, or simply get more motivated musicians. and it's always been up and down with these guys. everytime it feels like we're going somewhere, something else seems to come up in their lives and we're left just the two of us. it's kinda depressing really. i like playing, but i like having a good band sound, and it seems like for every killer sounding rehearsal we have, there's a month of 2 guitars and a drum, or 1 guitar a bass and a drum, never the full band.

we have to kick them out. i'm sick of this up and down. i've done this before but the past bass player was just a hack. these guys are good, but lack the motivation to dig into their guts and bring the music out.

I suppose there's no easy way to kick anyone out of a band (heck, i've been playing with the guitar player for at least 6 years...) but when people's interests go another way, it's time to do something.

i've been thinking we should go out to a pub or a restaurant on a night other than rehearsal night and have a talk. but a firm talk, no coming back. the decision is taken. it's pretty hard to put into words and i'm sure we'll get reactions like 'but we'll try better!' almost like the cheating husband making up to his wife for the umpteenth time, but i guess a band leader's gotta do what he's gotta do!

on the bright side, we're trying out a male lead singer (finally!) next saturday. i'd hate to ruin this rehearsal with a shite storm from the other members.

Also. I do fully understand how other people's interest can deviate from music. i'm just sick of waiting for something that doesn't exist in them.

this was more of a rant than anything i guess. sorry! but share experiences-wish me luck-anything at all. it's never an easy thing to do.
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38thBeatle

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2010, 06:38:20 AM »
Not an uncommon problem and you are right, you have to get other people who are into it the same as you and if that was going to happen it would have done so by now.

In my band we had some issues that came to a head and we had a rather grandly titled Band meeting which was in a pub on neutral ground and we all sat around a table in the middle of the pub, surrounded by punters who were roundly entertained for the next 40 minutes with a slanging/shouting match from two of the guys which ended with one of them storming off. My efforts at keeping it civilized failed and I ended up getting annoyed with both of them. We may just have well had the meet in private - the dampening effect of being in public didn't work at all.

No use to you but I'd say, ditch them and get guys in who are into it as y9ou and the drummer are.
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Twinfan

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2010, 08:46:01 AM »
I agree with Mr38th - if it's not working, it's not working.  We changed vocalist last year and it's been a breath of fresh air.  Really glad we did it.

You mention that the other guys would be really good if they put the effort in, but clearly something is preventing them from doing that - laziness, lack of inspiration etc.  Time to move on...

As to how to do it?  There's no right and wrong way.  Mr38th had trouble in person, we sacked our singer via email which I got criticism on here for etc.  There's no good way to hear bad news, so do it however you want to.

tomjackson

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2010, 10:07:19 AM »

Be ruthless and don't waste time :evil:

Twinfan did it by email but I'd go for text.  Sounds cruel but their apathy is wrecking your dreams, no explanation needed.  They should know if they don't turn up they are not entitled to be part of something good.  You need a certain arrogance and single mindedness to just get on and get the music out there.  I wasted time on people that could only put in 50%  which I shouldn't have done.

Everybody misses the odd practise but I can make 9 out of 10 times every week and I usually have to give my kids a bath and feed them before leaving,  still get there first!  Now I have commitments I've no interest in 'making it' or anything like that, but I still take the music seriously, at least in that you need to practise it to sound good and realise you potential.

Another thing to consider, good drummers, in fact drummers in general are sometimes pretty hard to get so if you have a good keen one you are sorted.  Guitarists and bass players are 10 a penny......

At 23 you should push your original stuff, make the most of your creative forces and see if you can get anywhere.  Most people don't but when you are older at least you can look back knowing you gave it a go :D

ToneMonkey

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2010, 11:31:10 AM »
You only need a guitarist and a drummer.  Just do a load Black Keys covers  :lol:
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tomjackson

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2010, 12:29:12 PM »
You only need a guitarist and a drummer.  Just do a load Black Keys covers  :lol:

And some White Stripes and Ting Tings :D

7thSon

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2010, 12:45:42 PM »
I think it would be better to isolate them and talk to the bassist/guitarist on their own along with you and the drummer.

Though to be honest, if you are 100% decided on this and there's is really no hope for them, then it's not a two-way discussion and there's little reason to meet them.

Keven

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2010, 03:33:43 AM »

Everybody misses the odd practise but I can make 9 out of 10 times every week and I usually have to give my kids a bath and feed them before leaving,  still get there first!  Now I have commitments I've no interest in 'making it' or anything like that, but I still take the music seriously, at least in that you need to practise it to sound good and realise you potential.



that's exactly how it is with us. My drummer is actually my boss, as he's the owner of the music shop i manage. but we're more or less equals, he just has 100% of the shares and ultimately it's money. anyway.. we're both very busy guys and the saturday is sacred and it's our reward for putting up with a week of crazy work. and it's fun to create. we're doing it seriously 'cause we need to record that to an EP and ship it just about everywhere and see what happens. but i know me, i'll be a kid in the studio, having fun, trying tones and guitars out, mic placements, compressors... quadruple tracking. same for my drummer. he has a custom shop mapex drum with 24'' bass drums and a brass snare. tell me we won't have fun miccing this beast up to sound brutally evil!

I don't sense this enthusiasm from the guys. ''oh you're recording?... i guess we'll just go early tonight then''.. UGH.

your answers have definitely shown me i'm not alone in thinking ''man, $%&# them, let's keep working and if they bitch, well, just too bad!'' they had their chance. we had our first gig last summer and we practiced 3 days a week and everyone was there and it was great. but it went downhill from there. they had their fun, but it was just the begnning for us.

thanks for the words of experience!
My BK's:
Black Dog8-Riff Raff8 / Black Dog7-Mule7
C-Bomb Set / Blackhawk Bridge
Holydiver Set/ BG50 Set

Keven

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2010, 12:59:49 AM »
Well. it is done.

it was almost too easy. guess we were right about the guys being not so interested. here goes to the rebirth!
My BK's:
Black Dog8-Riff Raff8 / Black Dog7-Mule7
C-Bomb Set / Blackhawk Bridge
Holydiver Set/ BG50 Set

38thBeatle

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2010, 08:00:34 AM »
I hope you get the people around you that feel as you do-once you do you will be in a great position.
Send three and fourpence we're going to a dance
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gordiji

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2010, 08:31:39 PM »
good luck kevin, i agree with all said above, you're committed or not. a reasonable but committed player is better
than an unreliable genius.for me adult discussion is essential in these situations, speaking the truth kindly is an art to be developed and is necessary practice for adulthood.

Johnny Mac

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2010, 09:32:37 AM »
I'm a it late on this one but well done. Getting bands to all work together is hard as hell! There is no easy way to say what needs to be said, as the others have pointed out. Commitment is the best quality as you all improve with time anyway. Life to short to carry unwanted baggage.

 I put a year of rehearsals into the band i'm in. It's been up and down but right now things are good. We had someone pulling us in a totally different direction and basically wanted us to be his backing band the cheeky bar-steward. Anyway after a 1000's of hints he took one, but knocked me for money but I'm glad his gone. I can't stand playing songs that are morose, bitter and resentful. He wrote songs like that. One was some anti-londoner rant! Silly w**ker. Then our the drummer invited a Jamician Keyboard player. He is very disciplined and talented. Knows lots of theory. But the ego is massive! I thought here we go again, another takeover. We did have them in the same room a few times and it was the pits. I just said I'm not enjoying this and left them to it. After lots of emails I went back and we had a great time. Very enjoyable and our new bloke is open to others ideas as before he wanted it all on his terms and even said he wants to take  this project on cruise ships, with no consultation from the rest of us!
Our last rehearsal they dropped a clanger and let slip that they tried out another guitarist. They said he was cr@p so I had a silent chuckle to myself there. Its all reggae pop at the moment so I don't suppose my warpigs will get much of a look in with that set! I'm well into early 70's funk, in fact I ffing love it, so I'm pushing for it to go that way along with the bass player, drummer and sax. So it could be a funk/reggae band. I just want to keep playing so I don't get rusty. It's all in the spirit of keeping an open mind for me. Once thats built up a bit more we could try out stuff from other genres. I came out of that room buzzing on Thursday. We played Jamming, by Bob Marley. I've/we have never played it before together and it sounded great 1st time.

I agree what was said in another post about drummers. They're as rare as rocking horse shite in my are area and the ones on Gumtree all want bloody paying!
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fr33man1

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2010, 12:01:08 PM »
Learnt one thing in my short band career. If there is any problem, deal it right away and most honeslty as possible. issues can grow alot and make some personal thoughts interfeer really bad in the main reason a band exists: get some brootalz tunes together and let the world know how its done ! :D

Hope to hear that big mapex and your bkps roar into some nice studio recorded tunes :)

roland_rat

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2010, 01:00:24 PM »
Not much advice from me that is different than what as already been said well earlier in this post.  Just wanted to wish you well with the new band you are geting together.  Sometimes it has to get worse before it gets better.   


Hope it all works out

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AndyR

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Re: Band Shuffling Advice?
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2010, 04:20:48 PM »
Yeah, hope it all works out now you're moving on :D

I saw the thread as it was developing, but didn't have much to say (I was thinking "ditch the f@ckers..." if that's any help, but I never actually managed to do it myself in my own situations... :lol:)
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