Veneer tops

[tomjackson]

Do they make any difference in tone?

I've been looking at cheaper LP type guitars and they all seem to have either a maple cap on mahogany with a fancy flame veneer over the top or just a flame veneer over mahogany.

Would it not be better tonewise to just have all mahogany or plain maple over mahogany?

I do try guitars out on their merit but from the few I've tried the ones without veneers seem more resonant, although I'm sure it's not always the case.

I can't see how a thin layer of wood and glue can help things, is it just for aesthetics?

[tekbow]

veneers tend to be for asthetics i think, most guitars that have them seem to be emulating higher end guitars, like an epi les paul or a sterling axis type guitar.

saying that.. i have an actual axis and the maple on that is really just a cap, not so much a top, and it's a basswood body and maple neck. so who knows? i'm an EVH fan but i don't buy stuff just because it has his name to it, the thing with him is, the guitars he designs are incredible. have owned the axis and the peavey wolfgang, and play the fender wolfgang. all excellent. another thing about him is i don't think he does something for no reason when it comes to guitar design, if he has a maple cap on his guitar (at least the musicman) he must reckon it adds something

[hunter]

It's just for looks AFAIK

I have two guitars and both are not lowbudget, one is a Hamer Sunburst with 1PC Mahogany Body & Neck and a Flame Maple Veneer, the other is a MM Axis, maple over basswood.

[Transcend]

I have always found it is just for looks and it doesn't make a tonal difference in anyway at all, positive or negative.

Just makes it look a bit posher if its well done

[tekbow]

i'm not sure i agree, play a PRS standard next to a PRS Cu24 and you'll hear a tonal difference, or play a solid colour peavey wolfgang next to a transparent finish peavey wolfgang and you'll hear a difference. to my ears you do anyway.

what i meant was on lower end guitars i think a veneer is either trying to emulate a more expensive guitar, or are trying to make an original design look higher end.

It's just for looks AFAIK

I have two guitars and both are not lowbudget, one is a Hamer Sunburst with 1PC Mahogany Body & Neck and a Flame Maple Veneer, the other is a MM Axis, maple over basswood.

this is what i meant in my first post, the axis isn't a veneer, its a cap. i'm led to believe there's a difference. a cap is slightly thicker, though nowhere near as thick as a top on an archtop

[Sifu Ben]

?? The Standard and Custom is a huge difference in construction and not at all relevant to this discussion as one's solid mahogany and one has a carved maple top??

[Transcend]

?? The Standard and Custom is a huge difference in construction and not at all relevant to this discussion as one's solid mahogany and one has a carved maple top??

exactly.

i was saying there is little to no difference between guitars that are just mahogany and a guitar thats mahogany witha  veneer.

Im speaking of my experience with agile guitars as ive had two from the same line one witha  veneer and one without both the al2500 line same exactly other than the veneer.

[Sifu Ben]

^I know in the past though that they all had the veneer, whether they were solid or transparent. I've got a 3100 though, so the ebony board has a tonal effect anyway.

[Transcend]

^I know in the past though that they all had the veneer, whether they were solid or transparent. I've got a 3100 though, so the ebony board has a tonal effect anyway.

ahh maybe thats why i didn't notice any differences.

[tekbow]

?? The Standard and Custom is a huge difference in construction and not at all relevant to this discussion as one's solid mahogany and one has a carved maple top??

yes, if we're saying a veneer has little or no impact on tone, then we should consider it a guitar with no veneer or cap. I used the example of the musicman as it's a cap and not a veneer, then the construction the solid vs non solid colour Peavey wolfgangs as solids were either reject maple tops or solid basswood, i had a solid basswood one and compared it to a trans finish and it sounded different.

i may have got carried away there and thought the discussion was going in the direction of "a maple top/cap makes no difference to the guitar tonally" where we actually talking exclusively about veneers which i totally agree with

[FernandoDuarte]

Not sure if I understand the question:

the 5/8" thick TOP makes difference in tone... If it has one of these 0.7mm thick veneers to show figuring, won't...

In deed untill around 1/4" thick top you cannot count with noticiable difference...

[Zaned]

If it's a thin veneer for looks, I don't think it makes a real difference in tone - the natural variations between different pieces of the core wood (say alder for example) make a much bigger difference.

But if you add a 4-5 mm top to a strat for example, then it DOES make a difference. I have compared two strats from the same maker, and the one with a flame maple drop top on the alder body sounds different. I also own/have owned other strats with all-alder bodies, and they all sound more similar than the one with the maple top.

If someone's interested how the maple top changed the tone in this case: the midrange sound a bit more scooped, and the bottom/low mids are tighter. It's brighter too. Both alternatives sound very good :)

-Zaned

[Philly Q]

the 5/8" thick TOP makes difference in tone... If it has one of these 0.7mm thick veneers to show figuring, won't...

In deed untill around 1/4" thick top you cannot count with noticiable difference...

I think that just about sums it up really.  A thin veneer has pretty much negligible effect on tone, a cap/top from about 1/4" thick and upwards is a significant amount of wood and does affect the tone.

In those mid-priced LP types the flame/quilt veneer is just for looks - but it's the thick chunk of plain/ugly maple under the veneer which delivers the tonal goods.

[FernandoDuarte]

Yes, this 1/4" thick is really up to discussion... Hope someday I can make a A/B test with guitar build from same logs and same parts...

My guess is that IF there is a difference it would not be very significant, counting amps, pickups, etc...
Talking on solid body, of course